Jacob Trouba watch

[Juklitz 85]

Right, six week to get this done. If it´s not done, then it´s Trouba who´s done. 

[frankgrimes 1,836]

Here's a good article (probably one of the best), on how to fix that defense http://www.wingingitinmotown.com/2016/10/17/13298806/despite-performance-red-wings-should-consider-moderate-selling-with-trades

TLDR:

- expose Green to the expansion draft (no brainer) and don't use the cap space if nobody that really helps in the long run is available

- get something for Smith at the trade dead line

- sell of guys on 1 year contracts and the trade dead line

Personally I would add LTIR Kronwall starting next season.

 

Trouba will eventually get moved (probably not to Detroit), and it will be for significantly less than Cheveldayoff is currently asking... He will eventually have to come down on his demands and when he does, I'm betting Boston are the first in on him...

What are they going to offer Pasternak? Guy is not a defender and Winnipeg doesn't need help at the wing, they could need another center but their goal is to get another youngish top 4 defenseman. I'm honestly surprised that Anaheim and Winnipeg haven't traded with each other yet, Fowler + a second for Trouba would make sense for both teams. 

 

 

[joesuffP 1,746]

Can I just say that I hate WiiM. All their articles read like angry LGW posters. You know when you post 3-4 opinion pieces a day it's got to be mostly dribble

Edited October 18, 2016 by joesuffP

[e_prime 1,936]

2 minutes ago, joesuffP said:

Can I just say that I hate WiiM. All their articles read like angry LGW posters. You know when you post 3-4 opinion pieces a day it's got to be mostly dribble

Probably because some of them are angry LGW posters?? 

They've taken a serious negative swerve of late, and they've added a few additional "writers" who are less than stellar with their analysis and commentary.

[kliq 3,755]

10 minutes ago, frankgrimes said:

Here's a good article (probably one of the best), on how to fix that defense http://www.wingingitinmotown.com/2016/10/17/13298806/despite-performance-red-wings-should-consider-moderate-selling-with-trades

TLDR:

- expose Green to the expansion draft (no brainer) and don't use the cap space if nobody that really helps in the long run is available

- get something for Smith at the trade dead line

- sell of guys on 1 year contracts and the trade dead line

Personally I would add LTIR Kronwall starting next season.

I read the article, the tone sound more like a message board rant then a professionally written article. Either way, one thing I do agree with is we need to figure out which of the kids are a part of our long term plans, and which one's are not as there are only so many spots.

We essentially have 7 spots for next year, and I would assume that Kronwall, DD, Green, and unless he is picked in the expansion draft E are locks. Then you have 3 spots for Sproul, XO, Marchenko, and Russo. I agree that Smith likely walks away in UFA similar to KFQ. I cant see Holland trading him at the deadline unless we are out of it which I really doubt will be the case.

What I would like is either a 100% healthy Kronwall (doubtful), or him going on LTIR, but LTIR can be tricky. You can't just put Kronwall on it, it has to be deemed by league doctors that he is not fit to play in the NHL due to injury. If they say his knees are fine, there is nothing the Wings can do.

Personally, I would like to see this next season:

Trouba - DD

Green - Marchenko

Sproul - Russo

Bench - E

In this scenario XO is involved in the Trouba trade, Smith is as well or walks away, Kronwall is on LTIR. I would also love to see E gone in the expansion draft, but I dont see it happening.

8 minutes ago, joesuffP said:

Can I just say that I hate WiiM. All their articles read like angry LGW posters. You know when you post 3-4 opinion pieces a day it's got to be mostly dribble

lol, my exact thoughts.

[krsmith17 7,191]

Frank, why would Anaheim want Trouba? They're trying to offload defensemen to make room for Lindhold. They're carrying 8 defenseman not including their stud RFA. Now, a three way trade involving some other team with top 6 wingers to spare and a need for a top pair defenseman... that could work... If only there were a team out there that fit that description...

[krsmith17 7,191]

kliq, we went from starving for right-handed shooting defenseman to icing a team with 5... Not sure if that's a good thing... I personally hope we re-sign Smith (I know, shocking right?). I'd rather see something like...

DeKeyser - Trouba

Smith - Green

Ouellet - Sproul / Russo

[DickieDunn 2,571]

you can't just ltir someone. It has to be a real injury

[Richdg 267]

As I stated earlier to fix the RW's is going to take some time. Like 2+ seasons. So if I was the GM how would I go about it? Ok......

1. Offer Nyquist, tatar, Smith and a low 2017 pick to the Jets for Trouba and their 2018 2rd round pick. That opens up 3 spots on the roster for Trouba, Jurco and Kronwall. It also frees up the cap space to resign trouba. That gives us the following lineup:

mantha-larkin-AA

Z-Frans-Abby

Jurco-Sheahan-Vanek

Ott-Helm-Glendening

Miller

DD-Trouba

Kronwall-Marchenko

Oullett-Green

E-Sproul

Mrasek

Howard

2. Over the course of this season move Ott, Vanek, and Green to PO contenders for 2017/2018 draft picks. Those are the type of players PO teams look to add. If/when those guys are moved out then room is created for Lil Bert and Svechnikov to join the big club in Detroit.

3. 2017 Draft. Do whatever we have to to get Cullen Foote in the 1st. Even if he ends up being our only draft pick next summer. Over the course of next summer leave no stone unturned in the attempt to move Z and Kronwall. By then it might also be possible to LTIR E with his bad hip.All of which frees up massive amounts of cap space.

4. The 2017/18 season is not going to be a season with a bunch of winning. 30-40 wins at best. That is fine. Because when the 2018 draft gets here the poor record and extra picks that we picked up in the Trouba deal plus anything we can get from moving Ott, Vanek, Green, Z, and Kronwall all get packaged together for A. Svechnikov. BTW if you live in Michigan go watch him play with the Muskegon Lumberjacks. For the 2017/18 season we also add Mckee to the lineup to protect all of the good young talented F's on the team. Now we have a roster that looks like this:

Mantha-Larkin-AA

Svechnikov-Frans-Abby

Jurco-Sheahan-Svechnikov

McKee-Helm-Glendening

Lil Bert

DD-Trouba

Oullett-Marchenko

Sproul-Foote

Russo

Mrasek

Vet backup

At this point we also have a ton of cap room so we can add vets as needed to upgrade over the guys that don't pan out. We have now reached the spot where starting in the 2018/19 season we are on the upswing again.

[kickazz 5,459]

1 hour ago, joesuffP said:

Can I just say that I hate WiiM. All their articles read like angry LGW posters. You know when you post 3-4 opinion pieces a day it's got to be mostly dribble

Freedom of Press. 

1 hour ago, e_prime said:

Probably because some of them are angry LGW posters?? 

They've taken a serious negative swerve of late, and they've added a few additional "writers" who are less than stellar with their analysis and commentary.

It's only natural, we are a team in decline, and all these kids who grew up watching a successful team for 20+ years can't handle it. 

Having said that, some of the WiiM writers actually write some useful educational pieces. Things like "How the LTIR works", "How the cap distributes", or "How the cap-recapture penalty works" 

WiiM and other bloggers around the country probably do a better job of explaining some of the way things work than the actual NHL website does (if at all). 

Edited October 18, 2016 by kickazz

[krsmith17 7,191]

I agree. There are quite a few Wiim articles that aren't great reads, simply because they put out so many, written by so many different people, however they do still have a lot of quality content in my opinion. I certainly don't agree with everything they have to say, but they are educated "fans". I listen to their podcast every week and for me, I think it's one of the better Red Wing podcast out there...

[Jacksoni 418]

1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

kliq, we went from starving for right-handed shooting defenseman to icing a team with 5... Not sure if that's a good thing... I personally hope we re-sign Smith (I know, shocking right?). I'd rather see something like...

DeKeyser - Trouba

Smith - Green

Ouellet - Sproul / Russo

One of these days you're gonna have to tell us about your Brendan Smith connection. Can only fools us for so long.

By the way, so far I am liking what we have seen from Brendan mostly.

Edited October 18, 2016 by Jacksoni

[Dabura 12,207]

1 hour ago, DickieDunn said:

you can't just ltir someone. It has to be a real injury

*wink wink*

Edited October 18, 2016 by Dabura

[krsmith17 7,191]

No personal connection. He's just one of our best defensemen, so why let him walk? I'd package him in a trade for a true upgrade, and I'd let him walk if he's asking for a massive payday (doubt he will be), otherwise he's on my future roster...

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Brendan Smith being one of the Wings' best defenemen is not a good thing.

[Jacksoni 418]

7 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

No personal connection. He's just one of our best defensemen, so why let him walk? I'd package him in a trade for a true upgrade, and I'd let him walk if he's asking for a massive payday (doubt he will be), otherwise he's on my future roster...

I agree, as you probably know. I'm just glad that he is on track to deliver what he can. Let's hope it sticks.

[Jesusberg 1,256]

22 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

Trouba will eventually get moved (probably not to Detroit), and it will be for significantly less than Cheveldayoff is currently asking... He will eventually have to come down on his demands and when he does, I'm betting Boston are the first in on him...

Normally I'd agree with this, but I've read a few articles, blogs, etc. recently outlining how notoriously patient Cheveldayoff is when it comes to trading. Prior to finally getting moved to Buffalo, Kane was demanding a trade during (nearly) every off-season. Cheveldayoff waited for the right package. Sure, the situation is a bit different here, but I don't expect him to just settle. I think Trouba caves before Cheveldayoff makes a trade he's not happy making.

I agree that we see a ton of those, "seriously, the Wings could have paid that price" scenarios, but I'm not sure this is one of them.

[LeftWinger 4,948]

The price will drop. With the play of Vanek, it makes one of Tatar and Nyquist even more expendable. Tatar looked real good with Z and Larkin last night, plus I've always thought he was the better of the two, so my first thought would be to trade Nyquist. BUT, that also makes Tatar more attractive to other teams, as does his small cap hit this year. Plus, if he hits 30 goals, he may command $6M per season, which we cannot afford. I truly believe Vanek will get re-signed, because Holland likes that type of player. Especially if he continues on like he has started.

I still think WPG would accept a trade with a forward in the package. What if we went Smith, Ouellet, Tatar and 2018 1st for Trouba. I think it's over paying actually. Maybe come end of November, things will heat up!

[Buppy 1,720]

4 hours ago, frankgrimes said:

Here's a good article (probably one of the best), on how to fix that defense http://www.wingingitinmotown.com/2016/10/17/13298806/despite-performance-red-wings-should-consider-moderate-selling-with-trades...

One thing to note; despite what the article claims Russo is still waiver exempt next season.

3 hours ago, Richdg said:

.... For the 2017/18 season we also add Mckee to the lineup ...

Of all the jokes in that post, this was by far the funniest.

1 hour ago, LeftWinger said:

...

I still think WPG would accept a trade with a forward in the package. What if we went Smith, Ouellet, Tatar and 2018 1st for Trouba. I think it's over paying actually. ...

It is overpaying. Grossly even.

[krsmith17 7,191]

2 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

The price will drop. With the play of Vanek, it makes one of Tatar and Nyquist even more expendable. Tatar looked real good with Z and Larkin last night, plus I've always thought he was the better of the two, so my first thought would be to trade Nyquist. BUT, that also makes Tatar more attractive to other teams, as does his small cap hit this year. Plus, if he hits 30 goals, he may command $6M per season, which we cannot afford. I truly believe Vanek will get re-signed, because Holland likes that type of player. Especially if he continues on like he has started.

I still think WPG would accept a trade with a forward in the package. What if we went Smith, Ouellet, Tatar and 2018 1st for Trouba. I think it's over paying actually. Maybe come end of November, things will heat up!

You say that Tatar has looked "real good" with Zetterberg and Larkin, so Nyquist would be the preferred player to move in a trade... But what about how great Nyquist, Vanek and Helm have looked together? That has been by far our best line, the only line that has stuck through the 3 games... I know you're high on Vanek, and hate Nyquist and Helm but take off the blinders for a moment and give credit where credit is due. Nyquist has been far better than Tatar based on these (small sample) three games. Vanek has looked great, but he's not the only driving force on that line.

[LeftWinger 4,948]

I've always liked Tatar more than Nyquist. I said my first thought would be to move gus, but considering that Tatar makes less now and has scored more consistently than gus, he may be the more attractive piece to other teams. Plus the fact that if he hits 30 again, we may not be able to afford him. Thus I was eluding to the notion that we would be better to trade Tatar.  What you're saying is Nyquist has been the better thus in turn making him the more attractive piece that teams would want. That's fine with me to trade gus first, but I think due to his salary and more talent, Tatar would fetch us more. If trading Tatar meant getting Trouba, I'll keep Nyquist. But I still like Tatar more.

LasT night I gave Helm props. I most certainly did not say anything bad about him. But unless he hits the 25 goal mark, I still will not like his contract. He's on his way, so we'll see how this ends up. Maybe HE becomes the attractive piece in a Trouba trade...

[kliq 3,755]

6 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

kliq, we went from starving for right-handed shooting defenseman to icing a team with 5... Not sure if that's a good thing... I personally hope we re-sign Smith (I know, shocking right?). I'd rather see something like...

DeKeyser - Trouba

Smith - Green

Ouellet - Sproul / Russo

Ill be honest, I wrote my post very quickly without even thinking about LH/RD, that is a good point. I would be just as open to trading Marchenko and keeping XO like you have. 

I would obviously love to get rid of E and keep Smith instead, however I cant picture a scenario where E is moved. Smith is a very good possession player, the metrics show it, and anyone that watches him can see it. Last night I was very impressed with him and his ability to move the puck. If he just had that finishing touch he would be a very very good hockey player. My other worry about him is that he will be offered a contract from another team that we will not be able to match due to our cap restraints. In an ideal world, I really like those pairings you have. Get it done Kenny!

1 hour ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Any trade not involving one or more of Larkin, Athanasiou, Svechnikov, Mantha, DeKeyser, and Mrazek will NOT happen.  I'd love to trade Howard, Kronwall, Ericsson, Nyquist, Zetterberg, Franzen, Miller, and Cleary for Trouba too, but it just isn't going to happen.  Trouba is a projected 1st pairing guy.  Not going to come cheap.  Wings will need to move a real asset.

I dont think anyone is disputing this. All reports indicate that Holland is willing to move anyone not named Larkin for Trouba. If Winnipeg asks for Larkin plus some, Holland should hang up the phone.

1 hour ago, Buppy said:

One thing to note; despite what the article claims Russo is still waiver exempt next season.

 

Wow.....even more reason to not take these "articles" seriously. If you want to be considered a respected sports writer, at least have your facts right.

[LeftWinger 4,948]

I wonder if either team would have any interest in Saarijarvi. RH'D I know.

[e_prime 1,936]

6 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

kliq, we went from starving for right-handed shooting defenseman to icing a team with 5... Not sure if that's a good thing... I personally hope we re-sign Smith (I know, shocking right?). I'd rather see something like...

DeKeyser - Trouba

Smith - Green

Ouellet - Sproul / Russo

^ OMG. Yes. I don't know where Kronwall and Ericsson have magically disappeared to, but the wine I've been drinking really doesn't care.

5 hours ago, Jacksoni said:

One of these days you're gonna have to tell us about your Brendan Smith connection. Can only fools us for so long.

By the way, so far I am liking what we have seen from Brendan mostly.

Defensive Possession -- on point.  Active in the offensive zone -- on point.  Tenacity -- excellent.  Keeper -- Absolutely.

[Internet.Unknown 422]

10 hours ago, kickazz said:

Freedom of Press. 

It's only natural, we are a team in decline, and all these kids who grew up watching a successful team for 20+ years can't handle it. 

Having said that, some of the WiiM writers actually write some useful educational pieces. Things like "How the LTIR works", "How the cap distributes", or "How the cap-recapture penalty works" 

WiiM and other bloggers around the country probably do a better job of explaining some of the way things work than the actual NHL website does (if at all). 

WiiM is trash.

Bunch of smug nerds who pleasure themselves to spreadsheets and are too young to really remember the 97 Cup run.