kipwinger 8,440 Report post Posted January 21, 2017 Also, given that there's absolutely no market for goalies at the moment there's really no easy way to move one. I think we're far better off holding on to both of them into the offseason to see if anything changes (which is doubtful). Trying to force a trade would require you to A) eat some of Howard's contract, which is dumb considering he's our better goalie right now, or B) sell low on Mrazek, who's been bad enough that you couldn't get good value for him. Neither is a good idea. I'm all for moving assets if you can get a return, but I'm never in favor of giving assets away (unless it's someone abjectly terrible like Kindl). 2 kliq and ChristopherReevesLegs reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frankgrimes 1,836 Report post Posted January 21, 2017 (edited) With the trade dead line only a few weeks away it's time for Holland to let it be known that everyone is available, so the Wings could get ahead of the pack and start filtering the (hopefully) good offers. It's also important to set high asking prices but at the same time discuss the lowest return you'd trade a guy for. If you can get a first round pick for Vanek of course you take it and run with it but if not a second is still better than nothing, same goes for Green. I don't think there will be a lot of trades but in terms of where this team is headed it should be a very interesting trade dead line because there is no way ownership can be satisfied with the failed rebuild on the fly approach. Edited January 21, 2017 by frankgrimes Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kipwinger 8,440 Report post Posted January 21, 2017 If you think "everyone is available" I don't know what to tell you. Sure, in theory, everyone should be available for a better player, but that's not how trades work anymore. You don't get high end returns anymore. You get prospects, picks, and rentals. I'm not trading any of AA, Larkin, Mantha, Nyquist, Tatar, Dekeyser for rentals, prospects, or picks. The return isn't worth what you'd be losing. I would take picks for Vanek, Smith, and/or Green, although they would have to be first rounders to make it worth while. There's no market for trading a goalie, so that's pointless. Abby, Ericsson (who I'd give away for nothing), and Helm have contracts that are hard to move and I'm not sure I'd move Helm and/or Abby anyway. Marchenko, Glen, Miller, Ott, etc. don't have any value so you wouldn't get anything worthwhile for them. Realistically the only trades worth making are a package around Nyquist, Tatar, or Dekeyser OR Vanek, Smith, Green for picks. That's pretty much it. So no, not everyone is available. 3 ChristopherReevesLegs, kliq and krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022 Report post Posted January 21, 2017 1 hour ago, kipwinger said: This Mrazek debate is hysterical. On the one hand you've got folks who think you completely dump a goalie who's struggling in favor of our veteran goalie who has struggled in the same way for big patches of his career. On the other side you've got someone who basically refuses to admit that Mrazek has every played a bad game in his career, or at least not one that was his fault. Bingo bango. I dont actually want to trade Mrazek. Its a dumb move to trade either goalie at this point. But if anyone insists that Howard MUST GO, Im going to counter with all the reasons why Mrazek MUST GO. The years of fawning over Mrazek by the fanbase has created this pro mrazek anti jimmy echo chamber amongst most fans. And now the slip ups by Mrazek have really exposed that with people bending over backwards to defend Petrs bad play. Reality is theyre both decent goalie assets with different strengths and weaknesses. And theyre both Red Wings and I love them both. The goalie market is not going to move at all until Bishop moves, one of the PIT goalies moves, and Vegas makes their selections. Then we may see an oppurtunity to unload a goalie. Maybe. 1 kliq reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted January 21, 2017 5 hours ago, kipwinger said: This Mrazek debate is hysterical. On the one hand you've got folks who think you completely dump a goalie who's struggling in favor of our veteran goalie who has struggled in the same way for big patches of his career. On the other side you've got someone who basically refuses to admit that Mrazek has every played a bad game in his career, or at least not one that was his fault. Howard has never been this bad for this long. 1 wingfan1991 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings_fanatic 677 Report post Posted January 21, 2017 12 minutes ago, DickieDunn said: Howard has never been this bad for this long. Howard played on far better teams for most of his time with the wings. Once lidstrom retired, howards play began taking a downward trend. To top that off he is 32 now. Mrazek, while he has had an off year, has far too much potential to trade away. One thing that i think happened is the new goalie coach wanted petr to not challenge as much and play with more technique, despite the fact that mrazek plays best when he is challenging and relying on his athleticism to control plays and make saves. Lately, petr looks like he is going back to that and i have seen his confidence growing. Nonetheless, the issue of the gm is he needs to decide where this team is going. I believe if we had a dman better than dekeyser then we would have a few more wins then we do. Otherwise we should just trade away some guys, get picks and draft some good players. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kickazz 5,459 Report post Posted January 22, 2017 2 hours ago, wings_fanatic said: Howard played on far better teams for most of his time with the wings. Once lidstrom retired, howards play began taking a downward trend. To top that off he is 32 now. His best career year was the year after Lidstrom retired. Hahahah. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wingfan1991 221 Report post Posted January 22, 2017 Mrazek should only play against TB, that's when he's played his best with 0-1 max 2 goals against. Other then that it's "3" or more and almost zero chance of winning a game. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marcaractac 3,960 Report post Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) Here is what I'd like to see between now and the start of next season: Trade Vanek at the deadline, whether in playoff contention or not. If he is willing to put pen to paper before the trade deadline to stick around on a hometown discount, see what can be worked out. Term must be short. Same goes for Smith. If he wants to get paid, move him by the deadline. Trade Green. I like the guy, but like Vanek, he has more value to this team with what he can bring in. Be aggressive in trying to move Howard and Ericsson. Retain salary if need be, but they got to go. Trade Sheahan if he is still here after the expansion draft. Who am I kidding? When he is still here after the expansion draft. Let Ott and Miller walk. Let Jurco play out the season. See what we have. Expansion draft protection: Zetterberg, Nielsen, AA, Mantha, Helm, Tatar, Nyquist, Dekeyser, Ouellet, Sproul, Mrazek Look into bringing a veteran dman in on a short-term deal in UFA. If a move for a top dman makes sense, do it. If not, roll with what they have. Take the best available dman with the first round pick. No more maxing out the cap for the sake of it. Shed salary, save cap space for when the team is back on the upswing. Keep options and cap space open for when the right deal for a dman does come along. Edit: So far so good Edited January 22, 2017 by marcaractac 2 krsmith17 and AtlantaHotWings reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kickazz 5,459 Report post Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said: This is the logical thing to do. Ain't that the truth Apollo Edited January 22, 2017 by kickazz 2 marcaractac and krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,908 Report post Posted January 22, 2017 Logical, but there is no way he leaves Abby unprotected. If not traded, I have a feeling it'll be one of Nyquist or Tatar. It damn well better not be one of AA or Mantha. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings_fanatic 677 Report post Posted January 22, 2017 3 hours ago, kickazz said: His best career year was the year after Lidstrom retired. Hahahah. And what has he done since then? Been horribly inconsistent, on a consistent basis. When he actually is playing well he manages to get injured. Howards days are done with the red wings. No way does the team keep howard and lose one of coreau or mrazek. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kickazz 5,459 Report post Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) 4 minutes ago, wings_fanatic said: And what has he done since then? Been horribly inconsistent, on a consistent basis. When he actually is playing well he manages to get injured. Howards days are done with the red wings. No way does the team keep howard and lose one of coreau or mrazek. Lets see. Um. Selected to 2014-15 All-star game Selected for 2014 Olympics in Sochi Had a consistent year this season in 2016/17 and led the league in GAA and SV% and maintained top 3 in those categories until injury. So.. that's two posts where you've spoken gibbrish about Howard. Can we stop now? Lol. Edited January 22, 2017 by kickazz 2 ChristopherReevesLegs and kliq reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BringBack19 110 Report post Posted January 22, 2017 6 hours ago, kickazz said: Lets see. Um. Selected to 2014-15 All-star game Selected for 2014 Olympics in Sochi Had a consistent year this season in 2016/17 and led the league in GAA and SV% and maintained top 3 in those categories until injury. So.. that's two posts where you've spoken gibbrish about Howard. Can we stop now? Lol. To play devils advocate, I believe Howard lost the job or was injured before the end of 2014/15. Then he was terrible last year. Howard was great this year until he got injured. So saying he is inconsistent, and when playing well generally gets injured is a pretty fair statement regarding Howard. This is coming from a Howard fan. 1 wings_fanatic reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kickazz 5,459 Report post Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) 6 hours ago, BringBack19 said: To play devils advocate, I believe Howard lost the job or was injured before the end of 2014/15. Then he was terrible last year. Howard was great this year until he got injured. So saying he is inconsistent, and when playing well generally gets injured is a pretty fair statement regarding Howard. This is coming from a Howard fan. Lost the job after injury not because of personal skill. The other poster makes Howard sound worse than he actually is. And no one is denying that Mrazek stole the job last year (only to lose it again and then get it back in the playoffs) Edited January 22, 2017 by kickazz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kjw25 104 Report post Posted January 25, 2017 First thing I would do is fire Blashill and power play coach. Then I would trade Sheahan for a 5th round pick. I would look to trade Abby over the summer for a draft pick as he is grossly overpaid. I would trade Vanek at the deadline for a 1st rounder or D prospect. Erickson would be bought out over the summer. I would look to trade Nyquist for a prospect. I would fully submerge in the youth movement and not be afraid of missing the playoffs. 1 Jacksoni reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022 Report post Posted January 25, 2017 I would stand pat at the Trade Deadline, then hope to find some good Vets in FA this year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BinMucker94 302 Report post Posted January 25, 2017 I'm not even sure what to do anymore. After consistently seeing terrible player usage by Blashill all season long, I'm convinced that we won't know what this team is capable of until he is gone. 1 DickieDunn reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted January 25, 2017 I'm not even sure what to do anymore. After consistently seeing terrible player usage by Blashill all season long, I'm convinced that we won't know what this team is capable of until he is gone.YuuuuuuuuuuuuuuupSent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk 1 BinMucker94 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DatsyukianDekes 2,428 Report post Posted January 26, 2017 http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/holland-dont-see-us-buyer-deadline/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022 Report post Posted January 26, 2017 5 minutes ago, DatsyukianDekes said: http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/holland-dont-see-us-buyer-deadline/ Well of course we cant buy. What do we have 50 cents in cap room? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brandon27 111 Report post Posted January 26, 2017 http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/holland-dont-see-us-buyer-deadline/Hopefully that means he will be a seller then. It's time. Trade anyone you can for something valuable. That includes Z. Love the guy, but it's a business. We need to rebuild and need every asset we can get.Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S5 using Tapatalk... ignore the typos! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted January 26, 2017 Probably means standing pat. The parity gives almost every team the illusion that they have a shot until the very end.Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frankgrimes 1,836 Report post Posted January 26, 2017 seems like the Matthews hysteria wasn't just Toronto that kid is impressive Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kliq 3,755 Report post Posted January 26, 2017 9 minutes ago, frankgrimes said: seems like the Matthews hysteria wasn't just Toronto that kid is impressive Well....I'm sure a bit of both lol. In all seriousness, the kid is good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites