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Jonas Mahonas

Datsyuk in 19-20 Season

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2 hours ago, roboturner said:

Someone piss in your Cheerios this morning?

He had already made it clear that he wanted to finish his career in Russia. He signed his contract in good faith, but before it was complete he (and most everyone else) noticed his play was declining and his body wearing down. Add in his family situation and he knew it was time to go home.

Why can't people just appreciate how lucky we were to watch the  games he played in, the magical stick-handling, and the amazing breakaway/shootout goals he gave us? Are you seriously that pissed cuz he left one year earlier than he had originally planned?

I'm not pissed at all.  I don't know the guy.  What I do know is that hockey is business, and Datsyuk backed out of a business deal, cost us Jakob Chychrun at the draft, and quit on the fans and team because he was sad.  Doesn't seem like a very stand up thing to do.  Call me old fashioned by I still think things like integrity, living up to your commitments, and not quitting matters.  And I'm not so emotionally invested in an individual player to sugar coat it when he does something s***ty.  I'm a Red Wings fan, not a member of Datsyuk's personality cult.  I'm not "lucky" to watch Datsyuk.  He's "lucky" that fans, people like me and you, were willing to pay money to watch his team play hockey.  And he repaid everyone by walking out on the team a year early and costing us a defensive prospect we desperately needed for organizational depth.

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Well, cost us Chychrun indirectly. But I do agree that in a way, if he had finished the contract, Holland wouldn't have had to worry about bringing in another center and that #16th pick would have been really nice for the rebuild. And we wouldn't have been forced to lock ourself with Frans Nielsen for the next 6 years (that contract is going to suck if we go for a full rebuild) and Larkin could have solidified the #2 center spot in 2017/18 season after more experience.

Although, Chychrun hasn't been all that great to be honest. 

Edited by kickazz

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Yep. All kinds of indirect affects, none of them necessary if he just makes good on his commitment. 

But you should just forget all that and count yourself lucky.  "Cuz I don't care if Pavel's pissing in my ear.  I consider myself lucky man.  He's...he's...*tears up*...he's the Magic Man buddy and I'll carry the memory of the 2008 Stanley Cup with me till the day I die". 

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It is pretty hilarious though that one guy can have such an effect that he can literally do something that's borderline lawsuit material and get away with it because he won our hearts so good. In a way.. he really is a magic man. Perhaps more of an illusionist though. 

I'm pretty sure if Holland and Illitch sued Datsyuk, they would have won that lawsuit no questions asked. 

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9 minutes ago, kickazz said:

Well, cost us Chychrun indirectly. But I do agree that in a way, if he had finished the contract, Holland wouldn't have had to worry about bringing in another center and that #16th pick would have been really nice for the rebuild. And we wouldn't have been forced to lock ourself with Frans Nielsen for the next 6 years (that contract is going to suck if we go for a full rebuild) and Larkin could have solidified the #2 center spot in 2017/18 season after more experience.

Although, Chychrun hasn't been all that great to be honest. 

Neither was Mantha until a month ago.  I'd still rather have the 19 year old man child defenseman than Dennis Cholowski.  But who cares?  Pavel could stick handle. 

2 minutes ago, kickazz said:

It is pretty hilarious though that one guy can have such an effect that he can literally do something that's borderline lawsuit material and get away with it because he won our hearts so good. In a way.. he really is a magic man. Perhaps more of an illusionist though. 

I'm pretty sure if Holland and Illitch sued Datsyuk, they would have won that lawsuit no questions asked. 

I'm no expert in contract law so I don't know.  But it's certainly unethical.  And worst yet, it really screwed over a team we're all suppose to like more than any individual player.  Which lots of folks seem willing to "forgive".  Fact is, we're in MUCH worse position now than if he'd just done what he agreed to do and finished out his ONE REMAINING YEAR.  But he didn't.  And the team is worse off for it.

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Yeah, I agree with you. Although saying it makes me feel like a d-bag. 

Maybe Datsyuk could have helped us be in a better position in the standings. Rather than 15th in the conference, perhaps we could have been 11th or 12th with his help. But him not being here also did screw us in the ways listed earlier.

It's all very subtle but if you add it all up, it really does suck that he left. For our cap space, for our playoff streak (maybe), for our 2016 draft. 

 

Edited by kickazz

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All of that's true.  But to be honest I mostly just wanted to point out (accurately) s***ty things that Datsyuk did and then watch everybody get all bent out of shape because it's hard  to reconcile a person you worship like a saint doing something selfish and reasonably s***ty to a team you worship just as much.  It's like watching Patriots fans getting all jelly legged over Tom Brady being a scumbag. 

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1 minute ago, kickazz said:

It's like the 2016 elections Kip. You're not going to convince people either way. :innocent:

You misunderstand me.  I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything.  Just painting them into a corner and watching them spin around in circles trying to get out.  Otherwise known as trolling.  But in this case it's relevant to the topic of the discussion (i.e. Bringing Datsyuk Back) so I'm in the clear.  And honestly it was a pretty entertaining way to spend a boring Thursday night.

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Not as a businessman but as a fan I didn't give two s***s about him "bailing" on us. For years I watched him many a night being the only player on the ice that seemed to care, and even when everyone cared he cared the most. I still recall his shifts at the end of Game 7 vs the Sharks when we were trying to complete that miraculous 0-3 comeback. The guys ankle is basically Stevie's knee now. It's not like he left with gas in the tank, he gave us his best years. It says more about the rest of the team that he'd still be our best player. It's a new NHL where contracts are thrown around like hotcakes.

Edited by Number19

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8 hours ago, Number19 said:

Not as a businessman but as a fan I didn't give two s***s about him "bailing" on us. For years I watched him many a night being the only player on the ice that seemed to care, and even when everyone cared he cared the most. I still recall his shifts at the end of Game 7 vs the Sharks when we were trying to complete that miraculous 0-3 comeback. The guys ankle is basically Stevie's knee now. It's not like he left with gas in the tank, he gave us his best years. It says more about the rest of the team that he'd still be our best player. It's a new NHL where contracts are thrown around like hotcakes.

That's cool.  I guess I just have higher standards.

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My family has had 6 seats on the glass since the Red Wings played in Border Cities Arena back in '26.  Well, it was on the cage back then, and the team was the cougars, but it was still hockey.  Seen a lot of players come and go.  Datsyuk is a very special one.  I'd like to see him back for a victory lap, personally.

download (6).jpg

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16 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

My family has had 6 seats on the glass since the Red Wings played in Border Cities Arena back in '26.  Well, it was on the cage back then, and the team was the cougars, but it was still hockey.  Seen a lot of players come and go.  Datsyuk is a very special one.  I'd like to see him back for a victory lap, personally.

download (6).jpg

I remember those days. We called it the thunderdome back then. Unfortunately Datsyuk would have been run out of the building by the superior talent.

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1 hour ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I remember those days. We called it the thunderdome back then. Unfortunately Datsyuk would have been run out of the building by the superior talent.

I remember when my uncle bought the knitting lady her gameday crochet needles.  

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I hope OP was kidding ... but knowing Holland, he just might pull a Samuelsson and sign the Magic Man in 19-20 ... but no, we should not.  He has dramatically decline even last year.  

But I do think he did the right thing and left last year ... this crap is not worth staying around for.  

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22 hours ago, kickazz said:

What's low about this thread? If I recall, Fedorov was chewed out by fans for signing a contract with Anaheim and back then the team was pretty high. 

Fedorov case is completely different. If you want to compare, I'd suggest compare Datsuyk leaving case with Yzerman's. I didn't see anybody chewing Stevie for refusing to work under Ken Holland in stagnant organization and taking once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. I believe Pavel left 'cause he realized he's almost done due to health issues and he always wanted to finish his career in Russia. I don't see any legitimate reason for blaming him. Sergey left because he is primadonna and he wasn't getting a treatment he though he deserved...

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12 minutes ago, ami said:

Fedorov case is completely different. If you want to compare, I'd suggest compare Datsuyk leaving case with Yzerman's. I didn't see anybody chewing Stevie for refusing to work under Ken Holland in stagnant organization and taking once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. I believe Pavel left 'cause he realized he's almost done due to health issues and he always wanted to finish his career in Russia. I don't see any legitimate reason for blaming him. Sergey left because he is primadonna and he wasn't getting a treatment he though he deserved...

Fedorov left as a free agent. Datsyuk left in the middle of his contract. What Datsyuk was objectively worse. If you want to make excuses for him that's fine but not everyone will buy it. 

And lol you can't compare Yzerman to Datsyuk because once again, Yzerman was not under a contract when he left.

Contracts are serious matters in the U.S. people get sued over these things.

So no people are not "low" for OBJECTIVLY judging Datsyuk. PIf people want to use their emotions to judge other people for objectively assessing Datsyuk then that's hilarious and hypocritical.

Edited by kickazz

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2 hours ago, kickazz said:

So no people are not "low" for OBJECTIVLY judging Datsyuk. PIf people want to use their emotions to judge other people for objectively assessing Datsyuk then that's hilarious and hypocritical.

lol

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4 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

What's so funny?

Probably one of those "I have nothing to say to argue against facts so I'll just nervously laugh it off and wallk away"

Literally nobody can justify anything for Datsyuk except with their own feelings. Feelings don't work in the world of forums and debate. We call those things fallacies.

Edited by kickazz

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