Marchenko Waived

[chaps80 1,591]

5 hours ago, puckbags said:

There are lots of other guys I would prefer to be waived but these are also business decisions.  Ericsson can hit the road as far as I'm concerned but someone would pick up him for sure . Lots of contending teams would take a veteran d man who could use a fresh start for a playoff run.  His salary isn't as bad as people think and we would be on the hook for half of it for 3 years. I would rather seem him get traded and then we have no salary to cover.  Wishful thinking. I'm just surprised he's lower on the totem pole than Sproul. 

No one would trade for Errorsson, at least not with his cap hit. Other teams know he's useless too. Too much cash and term left on his contract to take a gamble that the change of scenery would help him and he'd suddenly stop making horrible mistakes, scoring on his own net, turning the puck over, standing around like a pylon, and playing like he's half the size he is. He's been in the league for a decade. He is what he is at this point. I doubt he'd get picked up off waivers either, even if he'd come cheaper. One could hope though...

[kliq 3,755]

48 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

I respectfully disagree with you and am certain he gets claimed and sticks around as 5-7

 

Why would a team trade an asset for a guy who projects to be a 7th man on most teams and holds a cap hit of 1.45mil for 2 years. They can likely get a player who is cheaper and has higher upside from their farm team. Not to mention, maybe Holland did offer him for a 7th and nobody wanted him for that. if he goes unclaimed tomorrow, I think that proves it. Personally I'm hoping he gets claimed. I dont want that cap hit and we are loaded with low end d-men.

[kylee 727]

just on a whim I feel like he's going to get claimed 

[kickazz 5,459]

Out of all the players we've put through the waivers recently he has the highest chance of getting claimed imo. Having said that I can see him not getting claimed as well. It never hurts a team to take a right-handed D-man in this league. 

He's a toss up tbh.

Edited February 4, 2017 by kickazz

[chaps80 1,591]

Yeah I can see him getting claimed. Not a huge deal since he's nothing special, but this move is just typical Holland. Waive a younger player who has a good chance of being claimed instead of a vet who wouldn't be claimed. Kronwall is finished and overpaid, Errorsson is useless and overpaid. They'd easily clear. This team is going to take forever to rebuild if he continues protecting his useless vets and ditching his younger guys for nothing. It's getting more and more unsettling as time goes on knowing Holland controls the Wings roster. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

1 hour ago, kliq said:

Why would a team trade an asset for a guy who projects to be a 7th man on most teams and holds a cap hit of 1.45mil for 2 years. They can likely get a player who is cheaper and has higher upside from their farm team. Not to mention, maybe Holland did offer him for a 7th and nobody wanted him for that. if he goes unclaimed tomorrow, I think that proves it. Personally I'm hoping he gets claimed. I dont want that cap hit and we are loaded with low end d-men.

This. We have defensemen in Grand Rapids that are much better than Marchenko right now. Next time we have to call up a Griffin, do we want it to be the unspectacular defensive minded Marchenko, just because he's the safe guy with experience? Or do we want the smart, offensive minded Russo? I can't speak for everyone, but I'd much rather get rid of that hurdle and let Russo be the next guy in line for a call up... Really hope a team claims Marchy tomorrow. I would be right there with people with pitchforks if it were Sproul that were waived, but Marchenko is not a big loss by any stretch. I'd even say it's addition by subtraction...

[kliq 3,755]

46 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

Yeah I can see him getting claimed. Not a huge deal since he's nothing special, but this move is just typical Holland. Waive a younger player who has a good chance of being claimed instead of a vet who wouldn't be claimed. Kronwall is finished and overpaid, Errorsson is useless and overpaid. They'd easily clear. This team is going to take forever to rebuild if he continues protecting his useless vets and ditching his younger guys for nothing. It's getting more and more unsettling as time goes on knowing Holland controls the Wings roster. 

I'm all for trading E, and I admit Kronwall is on his last legs and will likely be put on LTIR sooner then later, but moving a well liked vet who has been with your team for 10 plus years to the AHL is a big move. I am not against doing it in the right situation, but doing it to save Marchenko a guy that has no future here and is likely not even now as good as either of them is not that right situation. If we were talking Sproul, different story, but we arent.

Edited February 4, 2017 by kliq

[chaps80 1,591]

43 minutes ago, kliq said:

I'm all for trading E, and I admit Kronwall is on his last legs and will likely be put on LTIR sooner then later, but moving a well liked vet who has been with your team for 10 plus years to the AHL is a big move. I am not against doing it in the right situation, but doing it to save Marchenko a guy that has no future here and is likely not even now as good as either of them is not that right situation. If we were talking Sproul, different story, but we arent.

Kronwall was a big part of this team for a long time yes, but he's no longer useful as a player. Marchenko, while nothing special, is a useful able bodied right handed Dman. We all know Kenny's loyalty knows no bounds, and that's a huge reason he's in the mess he's in, and it doesn't seem like he's learned that yet. Marchenko wouldn't be a big deal to lose, but I am worried he'd expose someone like Sproul instead of  Kronwall, and maybe even Errorsson if it came down to it.

[kliq 3,755]

4 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

Kronwall was a big part of this team for a long time yes, but he's no longer useful as a player. Marchenko, while nothing special, is a useful able bodied right handed Dman. We all know Kenny's loyalty knows no bounds, and that's a huge reason he's in the mess he's in, and it doesn't seem like he's learned that yet. Marchenko wouldn't be a big deal to lose, but I am worried he'd expose someone like Sproul instead of  Kronwall, and maybe even Errorsson if it came down to it.

Marchenko was was sitting in the pressbox as our 8th d-man. It appears all of DD, Green, E, Jensen, Sproul, XO, Kronwall, and Smith were above him on the depth chart. With that being said, he and his expendable caphit are better off gone. He had no value. I'd rather have Kronwall in the lineup then Marchenko at this point. It doesnt make sense to have an inferior kid in the lineup over a vet unless the kid has upside. Marchenko doesnt have much upside.

As far as losing Sproul, that's not what happened, so lets not turn this into something its not.

[chaps80 1,591]

3 minutes ago, kliq said:

Marchenko was was sitting in the pressbox as our 8th d-man. It appears all of DD, Green, E, Jensen, Sproul, XO, Kronwall, and Smith were above him on the depth chart. With that being said, he and his expendable caphit are better off gone. He had no value. I'd rather have Kronwall in the lineup then Marchenko at this point. It doesnt make sense to have an inferior kid in the lineup over a vet unless the kid has upside. Marchenko doesnt have much upside.

As far as losing Sproul, that's not what happened, so lets not turn this into something its not.

No it's not what happened. Like I said, Marchenko isn't a big loss if he's claimed, but it's still a classic Holland move keeping a vet who can barely skate anymore over a young guy who can because he's Kronwall and he won a cup ten years ago. 

[kliq 3,755]

3 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

No it's not what happened. Like I said, Marchenko isn't a big loss if he's claimed, but it's still a classic Holland move keeping a vet who can barely skate anymore over a young guy who can because he's Kronwall and he won a cup ten years ago. 

So you think that Marchenko is a better player right now then Kronwall I take it?

[chaps80 1,591]

9 minutes ago, kliq said:

So you think that Marchenko is a better player right now then Kronwall I take it?

He's no worse that's for sure. And he can skate.

[kliq 3,755]

8 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

He's no worse that's for sure. And he can skate.

Ok, but do you think he's better?

[chaps80 1,591]

3 minutes ago, kliq said:

Ok, but do you think he's better?

At this point, yes. But both are pretty useless. Both played 30 games and Marchenko has 6 points, Kronwall 5. And Kronwall plays on the PP. Lol

[kliq 3,755]

13 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

At this point, yes. But both are pretty useless. Both played 30 games and Marchenko has 6 points, Kronwall 5. And Kronwall plays on the PP. Lol

If you feel this way, I understand your frustration. I'll say this, if I could shed this team of Kronwall's conract or Marchenko's contract, I would get rid of Kronwall's contract every time. Since that is not on the table and Kronwall's cap-hit is here to stay until he is a UFA or ends up on LTIR, I choose Kronwall to stay and Marchenko to go. If we were talking Sproul, I choose Sproul.

Don't forget, if Holland all of a sudden demotes Kronwall to the AHL, what's stopping Kronwall from retiring and costing us the recapture penalty. He has to treat this situation with ease or it could bite him in the ass later. 

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

3 hours ago, kliq said:

Why would a team trade an asset for a guy who projects to be a 7th man on most teams and holds a cap hit of 1.45mil for 2 years. They can likely get a player who is cheaper and has higher upside from their farm team. Not to mention, maybe Holland did offer him for a 7th and nobody wanted him for that. if he goes unclaimed tomorrow, I think that proves it. Personally I'm hoping he gets claimed. I dont want that cap hit and we are loaded with low end d-men.

It's not 2 years really , seasons almost done and then next season.... I seriously doubt ken holland called 29 teams and offered marchenko 

 

is there a way of finding out how many teams put a claim on a player ?? I can see a handful of teams putting a claim but I can see an early team like Arizona getting, can also see buffalo and leafs having interest 

2 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

This. We have defensemen in Grand Rapids that are much better than Marchenko right now. Next time we have to call up a Griffin, do we want it to be the unspectacular defensive minded Marchenko, just because he's the safe guy with experience? Or do we want the smart, offensive minded Russo? I can't speak for everyone, but I'd much rather get rid of that hurdle and let Russo be the next guy in line for a call up... Really hope a team claims Marchy tomorrow. I would be right there with people with pitchforks if it were Sproul that were waived, but Marchenko is not a big loss by any stretch. I'd even say it's addition by subtraction...

I wouldn't get too excited and hope sproul and Russo  get significant ice time cause marchenko isn't here 

 

not with Blashill and holland running the show 

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

1 hour ago, chaps80 said:

No it's not what happened. Like I said, Marchenko isn't a big loss if he's claimed, but it's still a classic Holland move keeping a vet who can barely skate anymore over a young guy who can because he's Kronwall and he won a cup ten years ago. 

Got no problem losing marchenko , just bugs me a bit that we couldn't of landed a late pick and hope anderssen  gets his mojo back 

27 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

At this point, yes. But both are pretty useless. Both played 30 games and Marchenko has 6 points, Kronwall 5. And Kronwall plays on the PP. Lol

5points????? Christ I didn't even realize he was that bad this year 

[kliq 3,755]

33 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

It's not 2 years really , seasons almost done and then next season.... I seriously doubt ken holland called 29 teams and offered marchenko 

Semantics, he signed a 2 year deal and this season is just over half done. My point is that he is not worth hi 1.5mil caphit.

Pretty sure that when a GM is about to waive a player they put out feelers to all the other GM's (unless they want the move unnoticed), and if another GM is interested they will make contact. Do I think Holland literally called every GM to talk about Marchenko....of course not. If every time a GM was about to waive a guy he had to call every GM in the league you would just end up with a ton of pointless calls.

Edited February 4, 2017 by kliq

[DickieDunn 2,571]

Marchenko is probably no more than a 3rd pair guy when he's at his peak.  But you have a pending UFA in Smith who has been scratched in favor of players like Marchenko in the last two seasons.  Logic would dictate that you try to move Smith before the roster crunch comes, and if you can't trade Smith, you waive him in favor of the younger player who is signed for next season.

 

But Blashill doesn't understand those Yoo-row-peein fellers and Smitty is a good ol' hard workin' North American boy, and Holland favors vets over younger players even when the vet sucks.

[kliq 3,755]

1 hour ago, DickieDunn said:

Marchenko is probably no more than a 3rd pair guy when he's at his peak.  But you have a pending UFA in Smith who has been scratched in favor of players like Marchenko in the last two seasons.  Logic would dictate that you try to move Smith before the roster crunch comes, and if you can't trade Smith, you waive him in favor of the younger player who is signed for next season.

 

But Blashill doesn't understand those Yoo-row-peein fellers and Smitty is a good ol' hard workin' North American boy, and Holland favors vets over younger players even when the vet sucks.

Agreed that they should try to trade Smith, but coming off an injury his trade value is going to be a bit low. What they should be doing is putting him in a top 4 role in a way to showcase him so a team will give them a decent pick for him.

[krsmith17 7,191]

8 hours ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

is there a way of finding out how many teams put a claim on a player ?? I can see a handful of teams putting a claim but I can see an early team like Arizona getting, can also see buffalo and leafs having interest  

One of the "TSN Insiders" usually release that information. I'm guessing McKenzie or Dreger will tweet it sometime this afternoon. I wouldn't be surprised if he gets claimed, but I doubt many teams will put in a claim, and wouldn't be completely shocked if he cleared...

8 hours ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

I wouldn't get too excited and hope sproul and Russo  get significant ice time cause marchenko isn't here 

not with Blashill and holland running the show 

I doubt if Sproul gets many more games this season to be honest, unless we get another couple injuries on the back end, or he's inserted for Kronwall for a few rest days down the stretch. Hopefully we make some moves at the deadline to alleviate the logjam. If we can move Smith and / or Green at the deadline, that also opens up a spot or two...

As for Russo, no chance he sees any games this season, and maybe not even full time until late next season, or to start the '18-'19 season. However, if there are injuries on the back end next season, without Marchenko, there's one less (useless) player for him to have to jump...

The thing I'm ecstatic about is the fact that Marchenko got waived in favour of Sproul. It at least shows some competence from management...

8 hours ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

Got no problem losing marchenko , just bugs me a bit that we couldn't of landed a late pick and hope anderssen  gets his mojo back  

Im getting sick of this notion that Andersson is still some wizard that picks late round gems every year. He doesn't and hasn't in nearly two decades. Scouting across the league, both North American and European is just too good to find steals in the late rounds anymore. The last competent NHLer that Andersson found in the later rounds (6th or later - absolute best you'd get for Marchenko), was Ericsson back in 2002, 291 overall. Do we really need another Jonathan Ericsson? Before that it was Zetterberg (1999, 210) and Datsyuk (1998, 171). It's not the late '90's anymore. Those kind of players just aren't available in the later rounds these days... You may still be high on Axel Holmstrom or Mattias Elfstrom, but do you really think either of those guys are going to develop into anything more than bottom 6 NHLers at best? I don't. And those type players are a dime a dozen, just like Marchenko...

If we lose Marchenko (I hope so) and we needed to replace him next season, we have better options in Grand Rapids. Even if we had to replace him externally, there are better options every year in free agency and over seas...

5 hours ago, DickieDunn said:

Marchenko is probably no more than a 3rd pair guy when he's at his peak.  But you have a pending UFA in Smith who has been scratched in favor of players like Marchenko in the last two seasons.  Logic would dictate that you try to move Smith before the roster crunch comes, and if you can't trade Smith, you waive him in favor of the younger player who is signed for next season.

But Blashill doesn't understand those Yoo-row-peein fellers and Smitty is a good ol' hard workin' North American boy, and Holland favors vets over younger players even when the vet sucks.

Like has been mentioned, players coming off injury hold little value. Let Smith get in some games, and then see what we can get for him closer to the deadline. We need to shed this roster of 2-3 defensemen, not one, so waiving Marchenko regardless of what happens with Smith was the right move.

Edited February 4, 2017 by krsmith17

[kickazz 5,459]

Thought this article was hilarious. 

www.wingingitinmotown.com/platform/amp/2017/1/31/14465266/dan-milstein-sticks-his-nose-where-it-doesnt-belong-criticizes-red-wings-scratching-alexey-marchenko?client=safari

Edited February 4, 2017 by kickazz

[DickieDunn 2,571]

5 hours ago, kliq said:

Agreed that they should try to trade Smith, but coming off an injury his trade value is going to be a bit low. What they should be doing is putting him in a top 4 role in a way to showcase him so a team will give them a decent pick for him.

No, what they should do is waive his ass because he has, or at least he should have, no future with the team, while Marchenko and hte other young D potentially do.

 

Of course I fully expect Hjolland to give him a 3 year, $9 mil extension, because "you just can't lose a guy like that."

Edited February 4, 2017 by DickieDunn

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

One of the "TSN Insiders" usually release that information. I'm guessing McKenzie or Dreger will tweet it sometime this afternoon. I wouldn't be surprised if he gets claimed, but I doubt many teams will put in a claim, and wouldn't be completely shocked if he cleared...

I doubt if Sproul gets many more games this season to be honest, unless we get another couple injuries on the back end, or he's inserted for Kronwall for a few rest days down the stretch. Hopefully we make some moves at the deadline to alleviate the logjam. If we can move Smith and / or Green at the deadline, that also opens up a spot or two...

As for Russo, no chance he sees any games this season, and maybe not even full time until late next season, or to start the '18-'19 season. However, if there are injuries on the back end next season, without Marchenko, there's one less (useless) player for him to have to jump...

The thing I'm ecstatic about is the fact that Marchenko got waived in favour of Sproul. It at least shows some competence from management...

Im getting sick of this notion that Andersson is still some wizard that picks late round gems every year. He doesn't and hasn't in nearly two decades. Scouting across the league, both North American and European is just too good to find steals in the late rounds anymore. The last competent NHLer that Andersson found in the later rounds (6th or later - absolute best you'd get for Marchenko), was Ericsson back in 2002, 291 overall. Do we really need another Jonathan Ericsson? Before that it was Zetterberg (1999, 210) and Datsyuk (1998, 171). It's not the late '90's anymore. Those kind of players just aren't available in the later rounds these days... You may still be high on Axel Holmstrom or Mattias Elfstrom, but do you really think either of those guys are going to develop into anything more than bottom 6 NHLers at best? I don't. And those type players are a dime a dozen, just like Marchenko...

If we lose Marchenko (I hope so) and we needed to replace him next season, we have better options in Grand Rapids. Even if we had to replace him externally, there are better options every year in free agency and over seas...

Like has been mentioned, players coming off injury hold little value. Let Smith get in some games, and then see what we can get for him closer to the deadline. We need to shed this roster of 2-3 defensemen, not one, so waiving Marchenko regardless of what happens with Smith was the right move.

I would be really surprised if he clears , dmen are always high in demand and he's 25 and right handed and he really hasn't had enough games to determine if his career is over 

 

think he gets picked quite early by like Arizona , thanks for the heads up I'll check dreggers tweets 

 

as for hakan Anderssen , I was thinking about how long it's been since he drafted a gem when I wrote  it and yes it's been a while, guess im just hopeful ... I think ryno could have been an NHL player(not saying a star)but wanted to go back home,some people just don't wanna do the ahl route 

 

as for axel holmstrom maybe I'm naive but I think there's something there , maybe it's nostalgia with the last name or breaking the sedin twins record for the playoffs , at the least I'm hopeful he can be a good bottom 6 who really steps up his game in the playoffs (we can always use that)

 

i for one am looking forward to seeing him come down next year

Edited February 4, 2017 by nyqvististhefuture
Errors

[krsmith17 7,191]

1 hour ago, DickieDunn said:

No, what they should do is waive his ass because he has, or at least he should have, no future with the team, while Marchenko and hte other young D potentially do.

Of course I fully expect Hjolland to give him a 3 year, $9 mil extension, because "you just can't lose a guy like that."

Again, we need to shed at least two defensemen from this roster, so it's more than just Smith (or Marchenko) that needs to go.

Marchenko has never shown any sort of real potential. He will never be anything more than a mediocre bottom pair defenseman at the NHL level. Those guys are a dime a dozen. 

Smith > Marchenko

Ouellet / Sproul / Jensen > Marchenko

Kronwall / even Ericsson > Marchenko

It was the right decision. Marchenko is no loss to this team and if another team sees him as an upgrade to theirs, good for them and good for us.

36 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

I would be really surprised if he clears , dmen are always high in demand and he's 25 and right handed and he really hasn't had enough games to determine if his career is over 

 

think he gets picked quite early by like Arizona , thanks for the heads up I'll check dreggers tweets 

 

as for hakan Anderssen , I was thinking about how long it's been since he drafted a gem when I wrote  it and yes it's been a while, guess im just hopeful ... I think ryno could have been an NHL player(not saying a star)but wanted to go back home,some people just don't wanna do the ahl route 

 

as for axel holmstrom maybe I'm naive but I think there's something there , maybe it's nostalgia with the last name or breaking the sedin twins record for the playoffs , at the least I'm hopeful he can be a good bottom 6 who really steps up his game in the playoffs (we can always use that)

 

i for one am looking forward to seeing him come down next year

I'd love for Holmstrom to surprise everyone, but honestly, I just don't see it. I think at best, he becomes a decent bottom 6er, and we have an over abundance of them in our system, just like every team. I'd personally rather see guys like Turgeon, Bertuzzi and Smith make our bottom 6 than Holmstrom...