Red Wings trade Vanek to FLA for (D) Dylan McIlrath and Conditional 3rd Round Pick

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

7 minutes ago, frankgrimes said:

 

Yeah that's why companies need to keep upgrading and trying to re route the addresses better.

Personally I think this region lock crap sucks.

 

Yeah what the heck, I thought Canadians and Americans were bros. Even The Don and your stoner president seem to be getting along. Region locks are bogus man.

[krsmith17 7,191]

18 hours ago, Datsyukian-Deke said:

You know who the real winner of this trade is? Larkin. He gets to move away from that dreaded 3rd line with Sheahan and play with AA and Nielsen 

Great point. The problem with that theory though is that Jeff Blashill is still coaching this team...

Lines at practice today...

Tatar - Zetterberg - Mantha

Athanasiou - Nielsen - Sheahan

Larkin - Helm - Abdelkader

Miller - Glendening - Callahan

[Hockeymom1960 5,107]

2 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Nothing in that article even mentions Mcilrath 

He's trying to burst our bubble.

[kliq 3,755]

50 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Great point. The problem with that theory though is that Jeff Blashill is still coaching this team...

Lines at practice today...

Tatar - Zetterberg - Mantha

Athanasiou - Nielsen - Sheahan

Larkin - Helm - Abdelkader

Miller - Glendening - Callahan

They put Sheahan on the 2nd line??? I really don't get the logic.

[DickieDunn 2,571]

He does a lot of good things according to genius coach

Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2 minutes ago, DickieDunn said:

He does a lot of good things according to genius coach

Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk
 

He's good, but I think Babcock was better

[kliq 3,755]

The other issue I am having, is we are clearly not making the playoffs. Is this not the time to let either AA or Larkin play center? If these two are supposed to be our future 1C/2C or 2C/3C, dont they need to actually play C? This is the time to experience growing pains when losing doesnt matter, if anything it actually helps us.

Edited March 3, 2017 by kliq

[frankgrimes 1,836]

22 minutes ago, kliq said:

The other issue I am having, is we are clearly not making the playoffs. Is this not the time to let either AA or Larkin play center? If these two are supposed to be our future 1C/2C or 2C/3C, dont they need to actually play C? This is the time to see growing pains when losing doesnt matter, if anything it actually helps us.

Yes, this should have been exactly the time to increase the role of the youngster and see if Larkin could be a potential 1 center, is AA capable of maybe becoming a 2c? and which young GR player can realistically be at the team next season. This is exactly what shortterm pain and longterm gain should be as of now, the streak is over hand the keys to the young guys and let's see what they got. Which can be very exciting just look at Edmonton, Buffalo, Winnipeg and Toronto tons of reasons for optimism even if they are losing right now.

The goal has to be to close the gap to Arizona and Colorado somehow which honestly will be a huge task, we have to hope that both teams are starting to get on a bit of a run here.

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

2 hours ago, kliq said:

The other issue I am having, is we are clearly not making the playoffs. Is this not the time to let either AA or Larkin play center? If these two are supposed to be our future 1C/2C or 2C/3C, dont they need to actually play C? This is the time to experience growing pains when losing doesnt matter, if anything it actually helps us.

Agreed. Should move Helm to 4C and let Larkin be center of one of the top 3 lines.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

Since we're not making the playoffs, why not call him up and let him punch a few faces?  

God forbid Wings fans who attend games should have something to get excited about this season.

[kickazz 5,459]

3 hours ago, kliq said:

The other issue I am having, is we are clearly not making the playoffs. Is this not the time to let either AA or Larkin play center? If these two are supposed to be our future 1C/2C or 2C/3C, dont they need to actually play C? This is the time to experience growing pains when losing doesnt matter, if anything it actually helps us.

Be honest, are they actually going to be 1C/2C or is that LGW made up? Serious question because I have no idea. 

Edited March 3, 2017 by kickazz

[kliq 3,755]

5 minutes ago, kickazz said:

Be honest, are they actually going to be 1C/2C or is that LGW made up? Serious question because I have no idea. 

That's what I want to find out. At the end of the day they are both listed, and were both drafted as center-man. Lets try them at that position, and if they can't cut it, transition them full time to the Wing. I guess my point is that this is the time to see what they can do. In all likelihood, one will be our 2C, the other will probably be traded or be moved to the Wing. I'm hoping 1C, but this year was not a promising one for Larkin as far as 1C is concerned. 

I would also like to see what they are capable of with a better coach. 

[kickazz 5,459]

What I mean is, I wonder if Blash and Holland still see them as 1C/2C. Like, are they playing Wingers this season because that's how management sees them being best at? 

Makes you wonder aye? 

Edited March 3, 2017 by kickazz

[kliq 3,755]

3 minutes ago, kickazz said:

What I mean is, I wonder if Blash and Holland still see them as 1C/2C. Like, are they playing Wingers this season because that's how management sees them being best at? 

Makes you wonder aye? 

That very well could be true, they do say actions speak louder then words. My gut tells me they just prefer Zetterberg-Nielsen up the middle for now, but who really knows. It's no secret Holland prefers vets over kids.

I have never heard Holland actually say either were the future 1C or 2C of the team, but then again even if he did, I take anything coaches/GM's say to the media with a grain of salt.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

I have absolutely have zero concern with either of them playing wing. I think the concern that theyre not is grossly misplaced. 

[kickazz 5,459]

I mean hear me out for this theory; they sign Nielsen till 2022 primarily to play center, Z is in till 2021 or whatever, Helm locked in for 4 more years, Glendening and Sheahan played some 4th line center (Glendening locked for 4 years).

Why sign all these centers long term, play them in those positions and continue to play Larkin and AA on wing? I can only assume they are 1. Not comfortable having those guys there and 2. prefer them to be hybrids rather than full on centers (Like Zetterberg in the 2000s). I say hybrids because AA and Larkin do take faceoffs, just not that much. 

Edited March 3, 2017 by kickazz

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

5 minutes ago, kickazz said:

I mean hear me out for this theory; they sign Nielsen till 2022 primarily to play center, Z is in till 2021 or whatever, Helm locked in for 4 more years, Glendening and Sheahan played some 4th line center (Glendening locked for 4 years).

Why sign all these centers long term, play them in those positions and continue to play Larkin and AA on wing? I can only assume they are 1. Not comfortable having those guys there and 2. prefer them to be hybrids rather than full on centers (Like Zetterberg in the 2000s). I say hybrids because AA and Larkin do take faceoffs, just not that much. 

I think both AA and Larkin have speed that makes them ideal for wing. They also lack superb defensive ability you want in a center. Who cares what they played in the past. Play them where they fit. Readress that in the future when we need centers.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

I think both AA and Larkin have speed that makes them ideal for wing. They also lack superb defensive ability you want in a center. Who cares what they played in the past. Play them where they fit. Readress that in the future when we need centers.

I'm theory you are right but right now is the time to take a look at those things. Starting soon Wings will play meaningless hockey why not sink or swim with the growing pains of the young guns.

AA needs better defensive awareness and Larkin has a bit of bulking up to do (phone Roberts please) and both need to be better on puck battles. Speed alone can only get you so far.

My biggest worry is how empty the brackets are in GR not one player screams top 6 or top 4 defenseman, that's scary.

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

2 hours ago, kickazz said:

I mean hear me out for this theory; they sign Nielsen till 2022 primarily to play center, Z is in till 2021 or whatever, Helm locked in for 4 more years, Glendening and Sheahan played some 4th line center (Glendening locked for 4 years).

Why sign all these centers long term, play them in those positions and continue to play Larkin and AA on wing? I can only assume they are 1. Not comfortable having those guys there and 2. prefer them to be hybrids rather than full on centers (Like Zetterberg in the 2000s). I say hybrids because AA and Larkin do take faceoffs, just not that much. 

Having Z, Nielson, Helm as the top 3 centers just won't be good enough in a few years so they have to have new blood going in the center position. Z's been great, but I don't think he'll be at the level of a 1st line center in a couple years. I think Larkin at least will get a shot at developing into a 1C or 2C guy. At the beginning of the year Holland said outright that their longterm plan was to have Larkin at center (I wish I remembered when he said it - maybe the "less can be more exciting" presser or he did long radio interview). It didn't work out when they've put him there, but I don't think they'll give up on that plan yet.

Edited March 3, 2017 by PavelValerievichDatsyuk

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

38 minutes ago, frankgrimes said:

 

I'm theory you are right but right now is the time to take a look at those things. Starting soon Wings will play meaningless hockey why not sink or swim with the growing pains of the young guns.

AA needs better defensive awareness and Larkin has a bit of bulking up to do (phone Roberts please) and both need to be better on puck battles. Speed alone can only get you so far.

My biggest worry is how empty the brackets are in GR not one player screams top 6 or top 4 defenseman, that's scary.

 

IMO its not as hard to transition back and forth between wing and center as ppl make it out to be. Especially if a winger has past expierence at center.

[kickazz 5,459]

27 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

IMO its not as hard to transition back and forth between wing and center as ppl make it out to be. Especially if a winger has past expierence at center.

The difference between a Winger and Center has become very slim in the modern hockey era. Centers and Wingers play basically the same game now. The only real difference is basically taking faceoffs. 

Both Wingers and Centers carry the puck through the zone now, both can slide down on the backcheck early (used to be the Centers responsiblity primarily). With all the speed in the game, it doesn't natter who does what as long as they can get to the puck and do something with it. Cherry picking wingers rarely exist now, everyone is expected to utilize full ice (something only centers really did) 

Edited March 3, 2017 by kickazz

[kliq 3,755]

1 hour ago, frankgrimes said:

My biggest worry is how empty the brackets are in GR not one player screams top 6 or top 4 defenseman, that's scary.

Grand Rapids is doing just fine. They are 35-16-1-2, and once again are in 1st place in the Central Division. There are some god kids down there.

Granted there is likely no elite talent, but then again elite talent doesn't usually play in the AHL.

As far as Top 6 forwards and Top 4 D, here are our best bets (from the AHL, not our system in general):

Courtesy of http://www.hockeysfuture.com

Robbie Russo

Talent Analysis

Russo is a very solid puck mover from the back end and is not afraid to use his body. He is also a great leader and a very hard worker. A free agent signee by the Red Wings after playing out his NCAA eligibility, Russo is a playmaker from the back end while playing a strong defensive game.

Future

Russo skated for Detroit AHL affiliate Grand Rapids in 2015-16, leading the team's defensemen in scoring as a rookie. Russo will push for a roster spot with the Red Wings in training camp in 2016-17 and projects as a middle pairing defenseman who can contribute to the attack and on the power play.

Evgeny Svechnikov

Talent Analysis

Svechnikov’s greatest asset is his ability to find the open areas in the offensive zone; and, contributing to his offensive success, he also possesses quick, hard and accurate wrist and snap shots that often find the minimal open space opposing goaltenders allow. He’s a strong skater and, despite having limited experience playing on the smaller ice surface, is quickly becoming adjusted to the physicality of the North American game. He can often leave his defensive zone assignments unattended, but that’s something that should improve as he continues to get acclimated to the game on this side of the pond.

Future

Svechnikov signed a three-year entry level contract with Detroit in October 2015 after attending his first NHL training camp with the Red Wings. He returned to Cape Breton for his second QMJHL season with the Screaming Eagles in 2015-16 and was once again one of the team's leading scorers. A big, skilled winger with a nasty edge to his game, he could crack the lineup in Detroit in 2016-16 though he may start the year with the AHL's Grand Rapids Griffins.

Joe Hicketts

Talent Analysis

Hicketts is a short but solidly-built skating defensemen with elite offensive ability. Injuries during his junior career have created concerns about his durability and his lack of stature is sometimes an obstacle in the defensive game. His scoring ability and playmaking instincts are matched by few prospects in his age group.

Future

Hicketts returned to Victoria for his fourth WHL season in 2015-16 and played in his second World Junior Championship with Canada. A mobile puck mover who excels despite his lack of stature, Hicketts has dominated at the junior level and will look to have that same success when he begins his pro career next season. As with any player his size staying healthy will be a concern — he missed time both during the regular season and in the playoffs with the Royals — but Hicketts has the potential to be an exciting Torey Krug-type player at the next level.

From NHL.com

Hicketts is a 5-foot-8, 175-pound mobile defender who, at 20, has elite offensive ability, but his size is a question.

Last season he completed a four-season junior career with Victoria of the Western Hockey League. The past two seasons combined, Hicketts had 20 goals and 125 points and was plus-55 in 121 regular-season games. He represented Canada in the IIHF World Junior Championship the past two seasons.

Hicketts is almost certain to begin the season with Grand Rapids of the American Hockey League. Because of his size, defense is a concern, but he could develop into a player in the Brian Rafalski/Torey Krug mold.

Edited March 3, 2017 by kliq

[chaps80 1,591]

On March 1, 2017 at 11:29 PM, DickieDunn said:

McIlrath started playing pro hockey at 14?

The retained salary is irrelevant. They won't need the cap space and it's gone for next year. And that likely is the best offer. Florida probably needed to send a player for contract limit reasons.

Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk
 

Oh. My mistake. 7 seasons since his first AHL game.

Yes retained salary doesn't matter. All this talk about Vanek being the best trade chip the Wings had, and they end up with a 3rd. Lol

On March 2, 2017 at 0:43 AM, Crashnburnluder said:

Do you think Holland turned down a better offer??? Honestly?  Not trying to be rude but everything that came from the media said the offers just weren't there and there is a lot of info out there as to why that was the case. As far as all the wingers the offers weren't there, add in the fact he is a specialty player

As far as the picks go you point out would it have been better to just get the 2nd. Ill say yes and no, depending on who the pick is coming from. We ended up with a 3rd and a D "prospect" who can help in the AHL and maybe play 7th in the NHL next season if he puts the injuries behind him and protect guys like AA and Larkin. The key to the whole thing is Florida making the playoffs. If Florida makes playoffs we get Arizonas pick which could be as early as 63-65ish?

As for a straight 2nd Florida obviously wasn't giving it up, so say a team like Chicago or Pitt did. So they go on Win the cup or right outside of it. That second ends up being pick 59-62. 

so our options were:

63-65ish and McIlrath

or

59-62ish

I know where I fall. I think people get too hung up on the round number when the key number is the overall.

If this draft got me excited about one thing. It is the Idea of Green being a Rental next season. The Idea of having a PP Dman for sale on the deadline next season for another pick in the 2018 draft is exciting. Detroit is going to be making a lot of picks the next 2 seasons. and hopefully that includes 2 top 5 picks this year and next. 

Ya i'm sure Holland turned down Brent Burns and a 1st or something man. Of course he took what he could get. Doesn't mean the return doesn't suck for one of the top guys on the Wings all season. But it is what it is. And as far as Mcillrath goes, I highly doubt he suits up for the Wings. The guy was a 10th overall pick 7 years ago and he's spent most of that time in the minors or hurt. He's got 3 goals and 2 assists in 43 career NHL games. But at least he can fight I guess.

On March 2, 2017 at 0:46 AM, kickazz said:

Would you rather have had Vanek stayed and walk away during Free Agency? I don't get your logic here. 

That wasn't what I was implying. Obv a 3rd is better than a kick in the nuts, but Holland got a 3rd for spare part Jurco. You'd think Vanek would fetch more.

[chaps80 1,591]

On March 1, 2017 at 10:35 PM, MileHighWingsGuy said:

Enjoyed watching Vanek score some goals this year, one of the few worth watching, sad to see him go.

Definitely. Especially the ease with how he scored goals in the shootout. Skates in and looks for the slightest opening and whips it right in. Goalie has no time to even react. Have to go back to Hossa for the last time I saw shots like that from a Wings player. 

Many thought he'd be the steal of the 2016 UFA market, and he was. Can't complain for $2.6 million. Too bad it wasn't a two year deal. 

[LeftWinger 4,961]

Quote

McIlrath, who turns 25 on April 20, was assigned to the Grand Rapids Griffins, where Holland said he'll be evaluated the rest of the season. The 10th overall pick by the Rangers in 2010, McIlrath (6-5, 236) will be an unrestricted free agent after the season. He has appeared in just six NHL games this season and 43 in his career.

http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/2017/03/red_wings_ken_holland_on_thoma.html

...as much as I'd like to see him in Detroit, he was acquired to add toughness to GR. Maybe if he does a good job down there, he'll get a contract offer and get to Detroit next season. But add this to the audio from yesterday where Holland said he got him to be in GR, I don't think we'll see Dylan here in Detroit. Possibly never...