2017 ECF: OTTAWA SENATORS VS. PITTSBURGH PENGUINS

[chaps80 1,591]

1 hour ago, xtrememachine1 said:

I've been saying this for awhile now.  Not that its any fault of the Pens, but they're not having to go through anyone good to win these championships.  Last year they played the Rangers (they own Lundqvist), the Caps (a franchise the Pens have been beating in the playoffs for literally decades), a severely banged up Lightning team and the cinderella Sharks.  This year, they get the Blue Jackets (who turned back into the Jackets we all know and love late in the season), the Caps again, the Sens (who shouldn't even be this deep in the playoffs) and now they'll face the Preds (the lowest seeded team in the entire playoffs).  

Do you remember back in the 90s when the Wings would have to go through the Stars and Avs just to get to the Finals?  The Pens have like a 70-90% chance of winning each series they're in.  Partly due to their talent, of course, but the lack of competition is REALLY helping them out.  Even in 09 they didn't have to face anyone difficult until they got to us and we nearly beat them despite all of our injuries.  Boston and NJ, both teams the Pens struggled against a lot in the regular season, lost to Carolina, who were then swept by the Penguins.

Was thinking about this the other day. The '97, '98 and '02 Cups were bloody hell battles in the West, especially with the Avs rivalry on full bore. The Wings had some TOUGH players in those days, not like today where if a guy stubs his toe on the hot tub he's day to day. The Pens, if they repeat, haven't faced anything compared.

Crosby can win 5 in a row and he can't touch Stevie for being a true warrior captain. Win one on one leg first actually.

Edited May 23, 2017 by chaps80

[toby91_ca 620]

Yes, long weekend screwed me up, but I at least got the no games starting on Friday correct.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

4 hours ago, toby91_ca said:

On paper, PIT has had a very difficult road this year.  They finish 2nd overall in the entire league and are awarded with a 1st round series against the 3rd place team in the East (4th overall).  Then 2nd round against President's Trophy winners.

Anyway, what really boggles my mind is why the FINALS are starting next Monday.  I'm sure there is a valid reason that I'm too lazy to look into, but I think it's terrible for everyone.  If PIT wins tonight, there is literally a week without games.  Even if OTT wins tonight, the series will be over on Wed and then there will be no games on Friday, Saturday or Sunday.  I don't get it.  I do think it's pretty bad for the NHL.  Everyone always talks about the playoffs going too late and we have this big break.  No games for a week will have people moving on to other things, especially those that don't have a vested interest in the 2 teams that will be left.

Pretty obvious isn't it?  The league doesn't want to screw the Pens like they did Detroit in 2009.  If Pittsburgh wins tonight, the Finals should start Thursday, with Friday being game 2.  Then those bastards will know what it feels like.  

3 hours ago, chaps80 said:

Was thinking about this the other day. The '97, '98 and '02 Cups were bloody hell battles in the West, especially with the Avs rivalry on full bore. The Wings had some TOUGH players in those days, not like today where if a guy stubs his toe on the hot tub he's day to day. The Pens, if they repeat, haven't faced anything compared.

Crosby can win 5 in a row and he can't touch Stevie for being a true warrior captain. Win one on one leg first actually.

Except, Jonathan Tayes has already surpassed them both as the greatest captain ever, with only Beliveau to catch.  

[chaps80 1,591]

1 hour ago, GMRwings1983 said:

Pretty obvious isn't it?  The league doesn't want to screw the Pens like they did Detroit in 2009.  If Pittsburgh wins tonight, the Finals should start Thursday, with Friday being game 2.  Then those bastards will know what it feels like.  

Except, Jonathan Tayes has already surpassed them both as the greatest captain ever, with only Beliveau to catch.  

Oh yeah, I forgot Tayes. What about Gordie and Gretzky though? Already left them behind after his first Cup?

Edited May 23, 2017 by chaps80

[toby91_ca 620]

1 hour ago, GMRwings1983 said:

Pretty obvious isn't it?  The league doesn't want to screw the Pens like they did Detroit in 2009.  If Pittsburgh wins tonight, the Finals should start Thursday, with Friday being game 2.  Then those bastards will know what it feels like.  

I remember at the time people thinking that, but I totally did not get it at all.  I actually thought the schedule favored the Wings for some reason, can't remember why.  But the Wings had a full 2 days rest before the Finals and PIT had 3 days rest, but that made total sense because PIT swept their 3 round and DET took 5 games.  

A long rest here would not help PIT, probably hurts as they'll be rusty....but same applies to NSH, which is why I suggested the schedule is dumb all around.  

[chaps80 1,591]

1 minute ago, toby91_ca said:

I remember at the time people thinking that, but I totally did not get it at all.  I actually thought the schedule favored the Wings for some reason, can't remember why.  But the Wings had a full 2 days rest before the Finals and PIT had 3 days rest, but that made total sense because PIT swept their 3 round and DET took 5 games.  

A long rest here would not help PIT, probably hurts as they'll be rusty....but same applies to NSH, which is why I suggested the schedule is dumb all around.  

The 2009 loss was on the Wings. 2 wins from another repeat and they blew it, plain and simple. Coming out flat in Game 7 was the icing on it.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

1 hour ago, chaps80 said:

The 2009 loss was on the Wings. 2 wins from another repeat and they blew it, plain and simple. Coming out flat in Game 7 was the icing on it.

*Puts tin foil hat on*

The league wanted the Penguins and Crosby to get the cup, and they pulled out the stops to do it in the second go around in 2009.

Why:

-Crosby is the face of the league and Canadian. The league didn't want him and the Pens to lose 2 years in a row to a team driven by European players that the average sports fan probably doesn't recognize (names like Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Lidstrom aren't as familiar or marketable as Crosby). The league was trying to grow the game and Crosby & Pens winning is more marketable than Detroit winning again (back-to-back) for the 5th time in 12 years.

How:

-Malkin starts a fight in the last minutes of game 2. He was given an instigator penalty and that, by the rules, results in a suspension for the next game. But the league doesn't suspend him. Pens win Game Three 4-2.....Malkin gets 3 assists.

-Game 7, the first goal by Max Talbot is off a dump into DETs zone. However, that dump in was from about 4 ft behind the center line (FOUR FEET) and should have been an icing. It wasn't called and Talbot put the Pens up 1-0 in the 2nd.

And that sir is why you are wrong. YOU LOSE YOU GET NOTHING GOOD DAY.

*Removes tin foil*

Or ya know... the old cliche "they blew it"

 

Edited May 23, 2017 by ChristopherReevesLegs

[NerveDamage 4,176]

How, I say, How the hell did the Sens survive the end of the 2nd?

[Dabura 12,207]

 

[LeftWinger 4,951]

Sens will win this series.

Must be nice to have a legit top pair defense...Karlsson and Phaneuf. Remember when Phaneuf was almost ours?

[chaps80 1,591]

YESSSS!! What a game! That's how you rebound at home! Game 7!!

[Dabura 12,207]

2 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

Sens will win this series.

Must be nice to have a legit top pair defense...Karlsson and Phaneuf. Remember when Phaneuf was almost ours?

Phaneuf isn't very good. Karlsson is amazing.

[chaps80 1,591]

58 minutes ago, NerveDamage said:

How, I say, How the hell did the Sens survive the end of the 2nd?

Craig. Anderson.

Remember when he was a run of the mill backup? So underrated!

2 minutes ago, Dabura said:

Phaneuf isn't very good. Karlsson is amazing.

He was a beast in his early days in Calgary. Toronto killed his career.

Edited May 24, 2017 by chaps80

[NerveDamage 4,176]

 

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

It's hard to envision Ottawa winning game 7, but you never know.  If they can strike early or get some other-worldly performance from Anderson, they have a shot.  Other than Karlsson, this is a team basically devoid of top level talent.

Edited May 24, 2017 by GMRwings1983

[chaps80 1,591]

6 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

*Puts tin foil hat on*

The league wanted the Penguins and Crosby to get the cup, and they pulled out the stops to do it in the second go around in 2009.

Why:

-Crosby is the face of the league and Canadian. The league didn't want him and the Pens to lose 2 years in a row to a team driven by European players that the average sports fan probably doesn't recognize (names like Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Lidstrom aren't as familiar or marketable as Crosby). The league was trying to grow the game and Crosby & Pens winning is more marketable than Detroit winning again (back-to-back) for the 5th time in 12 years.

How:

-Malkin starts a fight in the last minutes of game 2. He was given an instigator penalty and that, by the rules, results in a suspension for the next game. But the league doesn't suspend him. Pens win Game Three 4-2.....Malkin gets 3 assists.

-Game 7, the first goal by Max Talbot is off a dump into DETs zone. However, that dump in was from about 4 ft behind the center line (FOUR FEET) and should have been an icing. It wasn't called and Talbot put the Pens up 1-0 in the 2nd.

And that sir is why you are wrong. YOU LOSE YOU GET NOTHING GOOD DAY.

*Removes tin foil*

Or ya know... the old cliche "they blew it"

 

A missed call that resulted in one goal in a Game 7 that would have never occurred if the Wings kept the foot on the gas after being up 2-0 in the series against a lesser opponent. They came out flat in that Game 7, like it or not. I recall many fans watching asking wtf was wrong with them. When they decided to play it was too late. One goal shouldn't have mattered when scored that early.

[chaps80 1,591]

16 minutes ago, GMRwings1983 said:

It's hard to envision Ottawa winning game 7, but you never know.  If they can strike early or get some other-worldly performance from Anderson, they have a shot.  Other than Karlsson, this is a team basically devoid of top level talent.

I dunno, this series they are on pretty equal ground. Each team was blown out once, but other than that, all games have been close, both teams are getting great goaltending from their starters. Pens are better on paper, and if they had everyone healthy, this would already be over. But injuries happen and the Sens are taking advantage. Good.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

3 hours ago, chaps80 said:

A missed call that resulted in one goal in a Game 7 that would have never occurred if the Wings kept the foot on the gas after being up 2-0 in the series against a lesser opponent. They came out flat in that Game 7, like it or not. I recall many fans watching asking wtf was wrong with them. When they decided to play it was too late. One goal shouldn't have mattered when scored that early.

We didnt "put the foot on the gas" and "didn't deciede to play until late" is a gross oversimplication of events. 

I urge you to find examples illustrating your point other than "some other fans agreed with me"

Two absurdly missed calls. One occuring after the fact, in complete defiance of the actual rules. Blatant. And theres a good chance the Pens dont win game 3 without Malkin. The series unfolds completely differently after that.

I honestly think the league did this to Vancouver when they were in the SCF against the Bruins in 2011 as well. The missed calls against Boston were absolutely ridiculous. 

[chaps80 1,591]

We didnt "put the foot on the gas" and "didn't deciede to play until late" is a gross oversimplication of events. 
I urge you to find examples illustrating your point other than "some other fans agreed with me"
Two absurdly missed calls. One occuring after the fact, in complete defiance of the actual rules. Blatant. And theres a good chance the Pens dont win game 3 without Malkin. The series unfolds completely differently after that.
I honestly think the league did this to Vancouver when they were in the SCF against the Bruins in 2011 as well. The missed calls against Boston were absolutely ridiculous. 

I agree with the Malkin thing. He should have been suspended as per league rules, and Game 3 they probably don't win. But that makes it a 2-1 series. Not a hole by any stretch. It sucked, but it shouldn't have changed anything.

The missed icing made it a 1-0 game in a series that never should have gone that far. You don't recall the slow assed play by the Wings in that game? The sheer quiet of the home crowd in a Game 7, fighting for a 5th Cup since '97 and a second repeat in just over ten years? I remember it that way, though it was 8 years ago.

Either way, that Final stung to loose, much more so than the sweep to NJ, who were just starting their perennial powerhouse years at that time too, and won all the Cups from '95-'03 with Colorado, Dallas, and Detroit. PIT was not a worthy opponent, and should have been dispatched in 5.


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[DickieDunn 2,571]

ABC Anybody But Crosby

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[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2 hours ago, chaps80 said:

 

I agree with the Malkin thing. He should have been suspended as per league rules, and Game 3 they probably don't win. But that makes it a 2-1 series. Not a hole by any stretch. It sucked, but it shouldn't have changed anything.

The missed icing made it a 1-0 game in a series that never should have gone that far. You don't recall the slow assed play by the Wings in that game? The sheer quiet of the home crowd in a Game 7, fighting for a 5th Cup since '97 and a second repeat in just over ten years? I remember it that way, though it was 8 years ago.

Either way, that Final stung to loose, much more so than the sweep to NJ, who were just starting their perennial powerhouse years at that time too, and won all the Cups from '95-'03 with Colorado, Dallas, and Detroit. PIT was not a worthy opponent, and should have been dispatched in 5.


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PIT was not a worthy opponent? IDK, I think they probably went to the SCF two years in a row for a reason...

My point is, if Malkin was suspended in that game, as he should have been, the Pens probably don't win the game, and after that everything is butterfly effect. Max Talbot's game 7 dump in becomes irrelevant."Flat play" by the Wings in game 7 becomes irrelevant. The whole rest of the series is changed, and changed in our favor.

 

[NerveDamage 4,176]

lol, hockey players are just big bearded kids.

this is so funny, like the hate Bettman gets, and how they just take it all in. at some point you just love to hate the guy

...or is it the guy you love to hate?

[Nightfall 871]

Crosby is one of the best in the world.  Its easy to hate him if he isn't playing on your team. 

The NHL parity has made teams so close that its hard to see a distinct advantage.  To say the Pens haven't had to play anyone good is a gross understatement.  There is a reason why Nashville made it to the finals and its not because they just got lucky through 3 rounds of hockey.  There is also a reason why the Sens are a game from the finals and why they came back last night.  The parity has made teams so close.

As for game 7, the Pens have the advantage for sure, but you never know how things will go in a game 7.

[chaps80 1,591]

PIT was not a worthy opponent? IDK, I think they probably went to the SCF two years in a row for a reason...
My point is, if Malkin was suspended in that game, as he should have been, the Pens probably don't win the game, and after that everything is butterfly effect. Max Talbot's game 7 dump in becomes irrelevant."Flat play" by the Wings in game 7 becomes irrelevant. The whole rest of the series is changed, and changed in our favor.
 

Sure they did, but Detroit had the better, more experienced roster. And Hossa on their side this time, although from what I remember, his playoffs weren't great after notching 40 goals in the regulars.

About the Malkin thing, I can agree with that.


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Not really close by comparison, but we Wings fans can sorta sympathize with the Sabres fans from '99 in regards to how the NHL upholds it's 'rules'.

Yeah that was a horrible call. It was the Stars though, and Hull scored the goal to win his first Cup. Probably just something the NHL wanted left alone. Funny how nowadays you can bowl a goalie over and score and it counts (sometimes).


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[GMRwings1983 8,794]

14 hours ago, chaps80 said:

A missed call that resulted in one goal in a Game 7 that would have never occurred if the Wings kept the foot on the gas after being up 2-0 in the series against a lesser opponent. They came out flat in that Game 7, like it or not. I recall many fans watching asking wtf was wrong with them. When they decided to play it was too late. One goal shouldn't have mattered when scored that early.

Oh please.  We got screwed worse than Bret Hart in Montreal.