Red Wings Expansion Draft Protected List

[MileHighWingsGuy 178]

Is there some way we could leave Holland exposed? Holland and our first would be a great deal.

[LeftWinger 4,935]

4 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

If this happens I will burn all my jerseys and tattoo and image of peter griffin with Mrazek's face on my left butt cheek in your honor

No thank you...no need to honor me.

Even if Mrazek stays, now that Holland pretty much said he has a bad attitude and that's what got him exposed,  do you really think Petr is going to play with his heart here now? Well at least if he stays we can include him in all trade scenarios...

[Never_Retire_Steve 35]

The funny but really sad thing about looking at this list when the expansion draft became official was that I was convinced that we would have to trade Howard or Mrazek before this year's deadline because I was quite convinced that whoever was left exposed would go to Vegas. Now, I'm just shocked that after the dust all settled that we will potentially lose a 25 year old goalie for NOTHING. At least if you think he has a bad attitude, why wasn't he traded? Just absolutely makes no sense to me. I really hope that Vegas stays away from him but if I'm Vegas there's no way I'm not taking him. I've also heard a rumor that there's a side deal in place to stay away from Kronwall which if true is almost as bad as leaving Mrazek exposed.

I hate to be so negative but I truly feel like if they gave an award for worst GM of the season, Holland would finish runner up to Benning.

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

The good thing about possibly having a Howard/coreau tandem is we'll likely land 1st overall and holland will get fired 

[kliq 3,755]

Nobody

26 minutes ago, Never_Retire_Steve said:

The funny but really sad thing about looking at this list when the expansion draft became official was that I was convinced that we would have to trade Howard or Mrazek before this year's deadline because I was quite convinced that whoever was left exposed would go to Vegas. Now, I'm just shocked that after the dust all settled that we will potentially lose a 25 year old goalie for NOTHING. At least if you think he has a bad attitude, why wasn't he traded? Just absolutely makes no sense to me. I really hope that Vegas stays away from him but if I'm Vegas there's no way I'm not taking him. I've also heard a rumor that there's a side deal in place to stay away from Kronwall which if true is almost as bad as leaving Mrazek exposed.

I hate to be so negative but I truly feel like if they gave an award for worst GM of the season, Holland would finish runner up to Benning.

That's the thing, the dust settles on Wednesday. Nobody truly knows what is happening behind the scenes. If on Wednesday Mrazek is chosen, people should feel free to go nuts, until then lets see what happens.

Do you have a source on the Kronwall rumor? I haven't heard that reported anywhere.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

23 minutes ago, Never_Retire_Steve said:

The funny but really sad thing about looking at this list when the expansion draft became official was that I was convinced that we would have to trade Howard or Mrazek before this year's deadline because I was quite convinced that whoever was left exposed would go to Vegas. Now, I'm just shocked that after the dust all settled that we will potentially lose a 25 year old goalie for NOTHING. At least if you think he has a bad attitude, why wasn't he traded? Just absolutely makes no sense to me. I really hope that Vegas stays away from him but if I'm Vegas there's no way I'm not taking him. I've also heard a rumor that there's a side deal in place to stay away from Kronwall which if true is almost as bad as leaving Mrazek exposed.

I hate to be so negative but I truly feel like if they gave an award for worst GM of the season, Holland would finish runner up to Benning.

Vegas will have Fleury. Only reason to take Mrazek is to flip him for something else. If Holland is ok with losing him, I seriously doubt he hasnt explored the trade market for him. So why then hasnt he been traded?

1. There is no market for him. Vegas will take someone else.

2. There is a backroom deal to keep Mrazek a wing that only Holland and Mcphee know about. Purpose being a wake up call for our cocky lil netminder.

3. Vegas will take him. Flip him. And Holland truely is a total moron.

Though some of you may disagree with me, I really dont believe #3 that Holland is a total moron. Im starting to suspect Mrazek will be a Wing next year regardless of his exposure.

 

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

8 minutes ago, kliq said:

Nobody

That's the thing, the dust settles on Wednesday. Nobody truly knows what is happening behind the scenes. If on Wednesday Mrazek is chosen, people should feel free to go nuts, until then lets see what happens.

Do you have a source on the Kronwall rumor? I haven't heard that reported anywhere.

I have not heard this one either. I tend to believe Holland when he says he wont be making special deals to keep players. And I doubt this would have been the case had we not just come off an awful season. Had this been a playoff year, he wouldve donated his left nut to keep Cleary and the boys together. I think we're witnessing a fresh attitude from Holland. The message he's sending is, you cant even make the playoffs, why should I sacrafice future assests to protect any of you? I dont care if youre a good ol boy with an A on your chest, or a 25 year old goalie, if you cant play you get exposed. This is the first step to rebuilding. Change in the front offices philosophy. Hes more concerned about his 3rd draft choice in 2019 at this point, then most of the losers we already have.

[kiwi wingnut 33]

I must be the only person alive who is fine with Howard being protected?  I fully get the arguments around asset (mis)management, but I think there is a whole human element not being mentioned or discussed.

Howard came off a pretty bad season, worked his arse off, came back a much better player, held teams to zero goals over 60-65mins, while his team failed to score in front of him. And no complaints the following game he'd come back with more of the same.  If I was his team-mate I'd have a truckload of respect for the man and his attitude, likewise if I was his boss.  To me he has earned the right to be protected, especially looking through a lens of respect and integrity.

Meanwhile the young kid with all the potential in the world, lets in 3-4 goals a game, and calls out his team-mates for not scoring enough?  Who would you rather had your back when it came to the crunch?

As stated, I agree not a good move in terms of asset management.  But do we all forget that these are people & not just assets?  That when they earn the respect of the peers, and management, they deserve it in return?

I hope we keep Mrazek, but if we don't it ain't the end of the world.  I'll still be cheering my damned team on.

[Never_Retire_Steve 35]

I heard the rumor from some Detroit writer, can't remember the name sorry. Seems like wild speculation at best when I read it.

Anyway, regarding your 3 points Chris:

I think you have things a little off in your thoughts.

If I were a GM and picking an expansion team, I would definitely not take Fleury. Reasons being, he's expensive and certainly past his prime and Vegas will take a few years to be good so I don't think it's a good long term play. The only way I would take Fleury is if I could flip him and keep Mrazek.

Mrazek is coming off a very bad season but he's also shown that he can be one of the game's best over the course of a season. If it weren't for him at the start of last year, there's absolutely no way Detroit makes the playoffs in 15-16.

Mrazek is 25 so he's still in his prime or could still improve and has a very high ceiling IMO.

Fleury is 32 and on the decline and more expensive. Sure the argument could easily be made that he's the better goalie but that doesn't always make it the best pick.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

9 minutes ago, kiwi wingnut said:

I must be the only person alive who is fine with Howard being protected?  I fully get the arguments around asset (mis)management, but I think there is a whole human element not being mentioned or discussed.

Howard came off a pretty bad season, worked his arse off, came back a much better player, held teams to zero goals over 60-65mins, while his team failed to score in front of him. And no complaints the following game he'd come back with more of the same.  If I was his team-mate I'd have a truckload of respect for the man and his attitude, likewise if I was his boss.  To me he has earned the right to be protected, especially looking through a lens of respect and integrity.

Meanwhile the young kid with all the potential in the world, lets in 3-4 goals a game, and calls out his team-mates for not scoring enough?  Who would you rather had your back when it came to the crunch?

As stated, I agree not a good move in terms of asset management.  But do we all forget that these are people & not just assets?  That when they earn the respect of the peers, and management, they deserve it in return?

I hope we keep Mrazek, but if we don't it ain't the end of the world.  I'll still be cheering my damned team on.

Im right there with you brother. This forum treats Mrazek like he's the next coming of Hasek, when in reality he's much closer to Pavelec. The off ice issues only compound the problem. But hey, cool new toys are more fun than old toys that break once in a while. I think theres a toy story movie about that.

[LeftWinger 4,935]

Holland's back door deal is, Vegas takes Fluery and then Sheahan from us, we keep Mrazek then trade Howard for Fluery......

 

Edited June 20, 2017 by LeftWinger

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

4 minutes ago, Never_Retire_Steve said:

I heard the rumor from some Detroit writer, can't remember the name sorry. Seems like wild speculation at best when I read it.

Anyway, regarding your 3 points Chris:

I think you have things a little off in your thoughts.

If I were a GM and picking an expansion team, I would definitely not take Fleury. Reasons being, he's expensive and certainly past his prime and Vegas will take a few years to be good so I don't think it's a good long term play. The only way I would take Fleury is if I could flip him and keep Mrazek.

Mrazek is coming off a very bad season but he's also shown that he can be one of the game's best over the course of a season. If it weren't for him at the start of last year, there's absolutely no way Detroit makes the playoffs in 15-16.

Mrazek is 25 so he's still in his prime or could still improve and has a very high ceiling IMO.

Fleury is 32 and on the decline and more expensive. Sure the argument could easily be made that he's the better goalie but that doesn't always make it the best pick.

I'm not saying your wrong, but most of the hockey-world disagrees with you.

Consensus from the fans of 29 other teams, as well as here, and writers seem to think Fleury is there guy. Of course thats not set in stone, but you know what I mean. This is the first time ive ever heard talk of Vegas flipping Fleury and going with Mrazek. The rest of the league does not regard Mrazek as highly as we do.

[LeftWinger 4,935]

He was #2 behind Fluery in the top 9 available though...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

13 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

He was #2 behind Fluery in the top 9 available though...

In what?

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

45 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Im right there with you brother. This forum treats Mrazek like he's the next coming of Hasek, when in reality he's much closer to Pavelec. The off ice issues only compound the problem. But hey, cool new toys are more fun than old toys that break once in a while. I think theres a toy story movie about that.

And Howard's closer to retirement so give me pavelec over retirement any day

[DickieDunn 2,571]

I heard the rumor from some Detroit writer, can't remember the name sorry. Seems like wild speculation at best when I read it.
Anyway, regarding your 3 points Chris:
I think you have things a little off in your thoughts.
If I were a GM and picking an expansion team, I would definitely not take Fleury. Reasons being, he's expensive and certainly past his prime and Vegas will take a few years to be good so I don't think it's a good long term play. The only way I would take Fleury is if I could flip him and keep Mrazek.
Mrazek is coming off a very bad season but he's also shown that he can be one of the game's best over the course of a season. If it weren't for him at the start of last year, there's absolutely no way Detroit makes the playoffs in 15-16.
Mrazek is 25 so he's still in his prime or could still improve and has a very high ceiling IMO.
Fleury is 32 and on the decline and more expensive. Sure the argument could easily be made that he's the better goalie but that doesn't always make it the best pick.

Mrazek has yet to have a good full year as a starter. His first run as #1 ended with him playing like garbage for the last 2 month and losing the job. Last year was bad all around.

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[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

1 minute ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

And Howard's closer to retirement so give me pavelec over retirement any day

You are aware that Howard is only 33 and that Pavelec likely wont be returning the Jets or the NHL at all? Howard has a lot more time left in the NHL than Pavelec does lol

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

3 minutes ago, DickieDunn said:

Mrazek has yet to have a good full year as a starter. His first run as #1 ended with him playing like garbage for the last 2 month and losing the job. Last year was bad all around.

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Hes lost the starting job twice already in a very short career. Tack on the off ice issues, and its hard to understand why this fanbase is still so over the moon for him. Howards got his own problems, but no besides maybe me bends over backward for him like people do for Mrazek.

[chaps80 1,591]

Where did the Mrazek comparisons to Hasek come from? Cause they're from the same country? He's about 6 vezinas and 2 Cups and a Hart away. Lol

Is there really a rumour that there's a deal in place to leave Kronwall alone? HAHAHA I hope it isn't true, but it's not impossible...


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Is there some way we could leave Holland exposed? Holland and our first would be a great deal.

/endthread


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[chaps80 1,591]

You are aware that Howard is only 33 and that Pavelec likely wont be returning the Jets or the NHL at all? Howard has a lot more time left in the NHL than Pavelec does lol

Not if that pesky knee flares up. Where the ointment Jeff??


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[LeftWinger 4,935]

32 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

In what

 

https://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/1320723-the-7-best-goalies-made-available-to-the-golden-knights

 

Top 7 not 9

Edited June 20, 2017 by LeftWinger

[kliq 3,755]

30 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

I agree.  Holland cant pull off the kind of move the 76ers just made. That is WAY behond his skill set.

lol ok.

Phily traded the 3rd pick for the 1st pick in a draft where the top 3 are considered at the same level (from what I have read, I'm not a big basketball guy), you want Holland to trade the 9th pick for the 1st (maybe 2nd) in a draft where the top 2 are considered heads over heals better then the rest of the class.

Not the same thing, but when it comes to Holland you are incapable of being logical so honestly whatever.

[chaps80 1,591]

 
https://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/1320723-the-7-best-goalies-made-available-to-the-golden-knights
 
Top 7 not 9

Most surprising move in the draft. No ******* kidding.


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[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

24 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

 

https://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/1320723-the-7-best-goalies-made-available-to-the-golden-knights

 

Top 7 not 9

Well I'll have to respectfully disagree with Mr. Cory Wilkins, whoever that is lol

You take Fleury because Flower is the best available, no brainer. 

After that you have Grubauer, Raanta, and Korpisalo, possibly Pickard. I would take 2 of those, possibly all 4 depending on ability to flip them. You let one grow under Fleury until flowers contract runs out, or its time to trade him because the underling has become the master. 

Mrazek is not in this position. Hes already 25, coming off a horrific season, already makes more money than hes worth, and reportedly has off ice issues with managment and coaching staff.

Only way you take Petr is to flip him, and apparently Ken Holland cant flip him, so why take him?

Edited June 20, 2017 by ChristopherReevesLegs

[kliq 3,755]

2 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Sorry, dude.  You are right.  But I just have a hatd time blaming players.  I truly believe that they give what they can, and it's up to the GM to pick the right ones and the coach to play them in the right order and at the right times.  

 

I respect this post Jonas, and I admit Holland and co. have made mistakes. Trading Datsyuk to Arizona last year and then using the cap space to sign Nielsen is a perfect example. Had we not done that, we would likely have a better pick this year, have more cap space, and we would have Jakob Chychrun (fingers crossed that Hronek and/or Chowolski surprise us). I guess the way I look at it, is Holland has done some great things, and he has done some bad things, but like it or not he is the GM for at least the next year. I just hope he can learn from the teams mistakes over the past few years and move forward.

Also, I truly do believe that the direction of this team is one that comes from ownership as well as Holland. If Iilitch wanted to completely re-build, all he would have to do is give Holland the word. I respect Holland's loyalty to vets, and I like the fact that he wants a good mix of vets/kids, but I just think sometimes his ratio's are off and he can overvalue vets.