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DickieDunn

Off-season moves

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I will preface this question by saying that in general I'm not in favor of signing anyone in free agency.  That said, I see that Colorado did not qualify Mikhail Grigorenko and he will become a UFA.  Grigorenko is a 23 year old center, former first round pick, has good size, is highly skilled, but has never been been able to put it all together (probably traumatized by having to play for Buffalo at age 18). 

If you could get him on a two way (prove it) contract, would you sign him?

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17 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

I will preface this question by saying that in general I'm not in favor of signing anyone in free agency.  That said, I see that Colorado did not qualify Mikhail Grigorenko and he will become a UFA.  Grigorenko is a 23 year old center, former first round pick, has good size, is highly skilled, but has never been been able to put it all together (probably traumatized by having to play for Buffalo at age 18). 

If you could get him on a two way (prove it) contract, would you sign him?

I think so yeah. He's still young and can thrive in a different system. I feel as though his development was unfortunately stunted by s***ty Buffalo and Colorado.

3 hours ago, kliq said:

If you were a Dallas fan, you would be calling for his head for missing the playoffs last year given the elite talent they have on top.

They already are. Dallas fans don't think that highly of Nill, only LGW people do because anyone but Holland. People here are in a bubble. 

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Just now, kickazz said:

I think so yeah. He's still young and can thrive in a different system. I feel as though his development was unfortunately stunted by s***ty Buffalo and Colorado.

I've never even really watched the guy play much.  I had a buddy who was a big Sabres fan and was pumped when they got him, but after he was traded to Colorado I quit paying attention to him.  Seems intriguing based on his offensive upside, but I keep reading about work ethic issues.  He scored 10 goals in 75 games this season.  It's not good by any means, though it would have been 10th on our team.  Given his pedigree and upside I'd seriously consider it. 

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The other reason I'd do it is because it looks like Holland is still interested in signing free agents. Grigirenko is young and would be a cheap option. Could be a good investment and beats signing free agent for ridiculous money. 

I've seen him play for Colorado a couple times. He's a good skater, makes good passes, doesn't seem like much of a scorer though, but with the right Wingers you never know

Edited by kickazz

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2 hours ago, DickieDunn said:

There are two moves that would help the team more than anything else they could do, fire Holland and take out the Trashill

Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk
 

You don't know that until you see who they are replaced with. I still remember when the majority on this board were relieved to have a new voice in Blashill and thought it was time for Babs to go if we wanted to move forward. People were pissed at the thought of Holland losing Blashill to keep the overrated Babcock.

With that being said, there are definitely better coaches out there (ie. Tippet), I'm not sold on a better GM being available at the moment. Let's wait a year and see what happens. 

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Just now, DickieDunn said:

Can't get much worse than these two morons

Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk
 

Come on Dickie, you're smarter then that, are you not a Lions fan? You have seen worse.

5 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

Yea, but it looks like he's making moved to try to better his team. Meanwhile, Ken Holland....

Different situation, I'm pretty sure the majority (myself included) would be upset if we brought Methot in. Nill is looking to get his team back to contender status after the failure that was 2016/17. We need to acquire talent between the ages of 18-24, much harder to acquire then then guys 30+.

I do agree though, I want Holland to make a move, specifically for a top 4 D-man under 24.

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53 minutes ago, kliq said:

You don't know that until you see who they are replaced with. I still remember when the majority on this board were relieved to have a new voice in Blashill and thought it was time for Babs to go if we wanted to move forward. People were pissed at the thought of Holland losing Blashill to keep the overrated Babcock.

With that being said, there are definitely better coaches out there (ie. Tippet), I'm not sold on a better GM being available at the moment. Let's wait a year and see what happens. 

My favorite thing in the world is how many ppl willingly shat on Babcock. Most of them now s*** on Blash even harder. Hate to break it ya again sweethearts, we let a top 5 coach walk in exchange for a nobody. The wole fresh voice narrative was utter garbage then and its utter garbage now. Its like trading a '16 cadillac for a '17 chrysler, its a bad move. U got the coach u deserve.

51 minutes ago, frankgrimes said:

Steal for the Stars Methot doesn't get enough respect although the guy is the reason, why Karlsson can play his offensive style. A second and rights to a goalie is just great. Guy brings leadership and stability to their blue line well done Nil

Methot will be a great partner for Klingberg. Unfortunately i dont think his presence would have helped us much.

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Methot will be a great partner for Klingberg. Unfortunately i dont think his presence would have helped us much.


He wasn't the right fit for the Wings but for Dallas he is perfect. Gets to play in front of Big Ben and with Klingberg plus Seguin, Spezza and Benn are there to score AND the advantage of privacy outside of the rink.

Nice to see that more and more people realize how good of a coach Babs is, best one in the game for sure. But it's not like there aren't any good choices out there Suter, Tippet... and maybe even Trirz after this season. Hopefully Chris is using this as an evaluation year

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7 hours ago, kickazz said:

The other reason I'd do it is because it looks like Holland is still interested in signing free agents. Grigirenko is young and would be a cheap option. Could be a good investment and beats signing free agent for ridiculous money.

With the amount of cap space we have -- cheap is the only route Holland can go.  Needless to say, I'd rather have a 23 to 25 year old reclamation project than and 33 to 35 y/o project.

5 hours ago, kliq said:

I do agree though, I want Holland to make a move, specifically for a top 4 D-man under 24.

I don't know of any team that's looking to trade one of these, but yeah... this is the move Holland NEEDS to make.

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10 minutes ago, e_prime said:

With the amount of cap space we have -- cheap is the only route Holland can go.  Needless to say, I'd rather have a 23 to 25 year old reclamation project than and 33 to 35 y/o project.

I don't know of any team that's looking to trade one of these, but yeah... this is the move Holland NEEDS to make.

Closest i can think of that MIGHT become available is Schultz out of Pitt. He's a little older than 24 (26) and might cost too much to re-sign for my liking though.. but it'll be interesting to see where he goes if Pitt can't afford to keep him. 

 

http://nhl.nbcsports.com/2017/06/26/agent-schultz-likes-pittsburgh-but-wants-to-be-rewarded/

 

Heres his contract for reference if anyone wants. He took quite the pay cut to stay there.. didn't know it was that big of a difference. 

 

https://www.capfriendly.com/players/justin-schultz

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33 minutes ago, e_prime said:

I don't know of any team that's looking to trade one of these, but yeah... this is the move Holland NEEDS to make.

Carolina has been reported to be shopping some of their young D. Unfortunately for us, they're likely looking for a young established center in return. I'm thinking they're looking for a similar type trade as the Jones for Johansen one that went down last year.

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2 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Carolina has been reported to be shopping some of their young D. Unfortunately for us, they're likely looking for a young established center in return. I'm thinking they're looking for a similar type trade as the Jones for Johansen one that went down last year.

My thoughts exactly. I think it'll be Duchene for a young Carolina d man. 

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51 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Carolina has been reported to be shopping some of their young D. Unfortunately for us, they're likely looking for a young established center in return. I'm thinking they're looking for a similar type trade as the Jones for Johansen one that went down last year.

Francis is quietly making quite a name for himself. He took over a team after Rutherford not to unlike our own now. That team is one 1c away from really competing. 

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5 hours ago, frankgrimes said:

 


He wasn't the right fit for the Wings but for Dallas he is perfect. Gets to play in front of Big Ben and with Klingberg plus Seguin, Spezza and Benn are there to score AND the advantage of privacy outside of the rink.

Nice to see that more and more people realize how good of a coach Babs is, best one in the game for sure. But it's not like there aren't any good choices out there Suter, Tippet... and maybe even Trirz after this season. Hopefully Chris is using this as an evaluation year

 

The problem is you typically get two extreme's. You either get people who talk about Babs like he is the best coach in the game end of story, or people who will say he was no good. Like anything, it usually lays somewhere in the middle. IMO, Babs is likely one of the top 3 coaches in hockey.

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Ahahahahahha this is great. Frank raves about Toews being the best player because of "all the hardware" but then also raves about Babcock being the best coach in all of hockey who has ZERO Jack Adams awards. 

 

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25 minutes ago, kliq said:

The problem is you typically get two extreme's. You either get people who talk about Babs like he is the best coach in the game end of story, or people who will say he was no good. Like anything, it usually lays somewhere in the middle. IMO, Babs is likely one of the top 3 coaches in hockey.

I'd stretch that to top 5 even. Still an amazing position to be in coaching wise.

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Without making trades, the Wings don't really have a lot of cap room.  Tatar is likely to get around $4.5 mil a year.  AA Either a short deal around $2-2.5 mil or a 4-5 year deal at closer to $4 mil, and XO probably around $1.5 short term.  That eats up most of the cap room just re-signing their 3 RFAs.  If AA takes the shorter cheaper deal, which the Wings probably prefer, they can sign a cheaper player.  D is the bigger need by far.

 

Nashville is rumored to be looking for a top 6 forward.  I'd be calling them seeing if they'd be willing to send one of their top 4 D in exchange for Tatar, Nyquist, AA, Mantha, or Svechnikov the cornerstone of the package, with other pieces coming and going depending on which forward it would take and which D comes back.  I don't think it's a stretch to say they have 4, or even 5, guys as good or better than anyone the Wings have.

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I know it wont happen but I truly would love to throw caution to the wind. With a huge draft coming up, a weak team as is. Take a run on guys like Grigerenko, Yakupov, and such. Hope one or both can get their game together and be a part of our future. A fresh start and not having all the trades and stuff going down, maybe one or both can turn it around. Worst case were a top 5 pick in a great draft. Hopefully top 2

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Craig Custance was answering fan questions on reddit this morning. I'll share some highlights.

In regards to Holland's future after this coming season:

Quote

I think that's very much in the air. I would say these are the three most likely options: 1. Young talent looks good, the team makes strides and ownership is convinced he's the guy to take on the rebuild and extends his current deal. 2. Season goes sideways. Young players regress. Ownership decides a new voice is needed and the two sides mutually walk away from each other and he becomes a Lou Lamoriello or Jim Rutherford for another team. 3. Things remain in neutral. Some of the young guys show promise. Ownership feels loyalty to him for over two decades of success and he gets a president job and a new GM is brought in.

In regards to the draft:

Quote

They certainly got good players but I'm a little concerned about some of the talent they passed on in order to get bigger organizationally. These are 18 year old kids so it's nothing we can access a week later but my draft philosophy would be to try and hit home runs with high-end skill during the draft and then work in size through other avenues. I'd give it a C, maybe C+ for quantity.

In regards to who will start in net this season:

Quote

I think the expansion draft tipped the hands of where the team is with their goalies. My sense is it will be Jimmy Howard's job to lose. There seems to be some question whether Mrazek is capable of a full load of 60 games. As for the trade options, Holland's MO is to be conservative on the trade front. I might be missing something but I want to say his last off-season traditional hockey trade was the Hasek/Kozlov deal. So I'm always reluctant to suggest Detroit is going to make a major move. That said, he's been clear he's working the phones in an attempt to add a youngish defensemen.

In regards to our future with the young guns:

Quote

Larkin, to me, is the key to the whole thing in Detroit. The league adjusted to him last season in the way he used his speed to the outside in the offensive zone. He's a smart kid who gets the message pretty quickly. They need him to turn into a No. 1 center if they want to re-emerge as a Cup contender because I'm not sure they got one in this draft. He's got the inner drive and skillset to make it happen and having Henrik Zetterberg around helps shield him a bit in the short term.

In regards to upgrading the D:

Quote

Yeah, I'm going to dive in to a lot of this today when we wrap up. I'm not sure Nyquist lands you the upgrade needed on defense. If the Red Wings really want to add an impact young defensemen, my guess is that it would cost them Athanasiou. Team has a decision to make with Tatar too.

More on Holland:

Quote

I can tell you that Ken Holland has the utmost respect around the league and would get hired just about immediately if he and the Red Wings parted ways. I also think this front office would benefit from a fresh, outside perspective. I liked the Shawn Horcoff addition and more outside voices would benefit the front office. I really like the structure of the Maple Leafs front office, where you have a vet like LL, analytics guy like Dubas, cap guy in Pridham, scout in Hunter, Shanahan up top, Babcock weighing in. Red Wings would do well to pull in a couple new voices similarly.

On Wings future:

Quote

The degree of difficulty in what the Red Wings are doing right now is pretty high. But if it does go sideways, they'd probably end up with a decent draft pick anyways, haha. One thing people might not be factoring in enough is the lottery changes that have been put into place since Toronto and Edmonton got Matthews/McDavid. You saw it with Colorado. Complete meltdown this year and they still only got the No. 4 overall pick. There's less guarantee in a full-on tank now too. Basically the NHL is going to turn into the NFL where teams take turns being good.

A number of people asked about DK as well and he basically kept responding that he thinks DK is a fine D-man and he has been asked to do too much. Wings need to add to the defense around him so he can succeed.

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Can't find it quickly enough so I gave up but I read somewhere that Nashville wants a top six forward without having to trade a top 4 d man. Not sure what they have in terms of defensive prospects (probably pretty decent ones based on their recent history?) but they seem pretty set on keeping their current top 4 together for a long time.. can't blame them. 

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9 minutes ago, amato said:

Can't find it quickly enough so I gave up but I read somewhere that Nashville wants a top six forward without having to trade a top 4 d man. Not sure what they have in terms of defensive prospects (probably pretty decent ones based on their recent history?) but they seem pretty set on keeping their current top 4 together for a long time.. can't blame them. 

If I were them I'd go for Stone in FA. Seems like it'd be a good fit. 

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