Howard 2017 Starting Netminder

[MabusIncarnate 5,344]

Report - Jimmy Howard will be the starting goalie next season, they would like him to start 50-55 games if healthy. 

He was easily the better of the two last season, I think he's earned his spot. It's make it or break it time for Mrazek, prove me wrong and be the goalie we need you to be Petr. They also stated that Las Vegas "Was not at all interested" in Mrazek which may reflect on his overall value. 

http://nhl.nbcsports.com/2017/07/23/red-wings-would-like-jimmy-howard-to-play-50-55-games

[krsmith17 7,191]

Howard is rightfully so the starter going into the season, but I wouldn't be at all shocked if Mrazek returns to form and steals the starter role once again. Here's to hoping...

[Andy Pred 48 337]

Well hopefully our near $10m duo play like their payroll and it'll help out our average D (at present) which should see us challenge for a post season league position.

 

[Jacksoni 418]

As expected. If he's healthy he's good. In my opinion he certainly should start the season. Mrazek will get his shot to show where he is at soon enough. Among all the problems we have this, being the goalie tandem, is the most pleasant.

Perhaps a rewording is in order - the goaltender situation is not a problem except for the cost, being 9m+ for our tenders. Going in to next season I'd like that down 1.5-2m if possible.

Edited July 24, 2017 by Jacksoni

[frankgrimes 1,836]

Rightfully so

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

Vegas didnt want him, Detroit doesnt want him, only LGW prays he can still unseat Howard lol 

[krsmith17 7,191]

1 minute ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Vegas didnt want him, Detroit doesnt want him, only LGW prays he can still unseat Howard lol 

Why wouldn't we? Howard may have just a few good years left in him. It's natural to hope that the younger guy can eventually replace the older guy. I also hope Larkin "unseats" Zetterberg as our number one center, although that may be a lot less likely to happen.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

5 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Why wouldn't we? Howard may have just a few good years left in him. It's natural to hope that the younger guy can eventually replace the older guy. I also hope Larkin "unseats" Zetterberg as our number one center, although that may be a lot less likely to happen.

It's natural to want to ice the best team. That team includes Howard.

But yeah, hopefully Big Ras can unseat Larkin 

[krsmith17 7,191]

1 minute ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

It's natural to want to ice the best team. That team includes Howard.

But yeah, hopefully Big Ras can unseat Larkin 

I'm not arguing which of the two makes the team better. It's very clear that Howard was the better goaltender last season, and if he continues to be again this season, of course you ride him. What I'm saying is that it's natural to hope that the younger goalie unseats the goalie that will in all likelihood soon be on the decline of his career.

Yeah, we definitely need to unseat the 21 year old Larkin. He's way past his prime anyway...  Forget that ridiculous example, do you not hope that Larkin unseats Zetterberg as the top line center in the next year or so? No? Bulls***. Yes? Why? Because Zetterberg likely only has another couple good years (if we're lucky) in him before he starts to drastically decline.

This has nothing to do with me liking Mrazek over Howard (I've always been a Howard supporter), this is about what's better for the team going forward. I do hope the younger goalie gets back on track and unseats the older goalie. And if all things are equal, I go with the younger goalie (player) every time. (Note: I'm not talking a few years, I'm talking significant difference in age (8 years)).

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

24 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I'm not arguing which of the two makes the team better. It's very clear that Howard was the better goaltender last season, and if he continues to be again this season, of course you ride him. What I'm saying is that it's natural to hope that the younger goalie unseats the goalie that will in all likelihood soon be on the decline of his career.

Yeah, we definitely need to unseat the 21 year old Larkin. He's way past his prime anyway...  Forget that ridiculous example, do you not hope that Larkin unseats Zetterberg as the top line center in the next year or so? No? Bulls***. Yes? Why? Because Zetterberg likely only has another couple good years (if we're lucky) in him before he starts to drastically decline.

This has nothing to do with me liking Mrazek over Howard (I've always been a Howard supporter), this is about what's better for the team going forward. I do hope the younger goalie gets back on track and unseats the older goalie. And if all things are equal, I go with the younger goalie (player) every time. (Note: I'm not talking a few years, I'm talking significant difference in age (8 years)).

Nope. I hope one of AA/Larkin/Rasmussen can take the reigns from Zetterberg 4 years from now. I hope Zberg finishes his career on top like the thoroughbred he is.

If this thread was called "Zetterberg 2017 #1 Center" everyone would probably say "yeah no s***" and move along with no mention of Larkin. But old love seems to die hard with goalies so I'm not surprised. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

6 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Nope. I hope one of AA/Larkin/Rasmussen can take the reigns from Zetterberg 4 years from now. I hope Zberg finishes his career on top like the thoroughbred he is.

If this thread was called "Zetterberg 2017 #1 Center" everyone would probably say "yeah no s***" and move along with no mention of Larkin. But old love seems to die hard with goalies so I'm not surprised. 

To be fair, most have basically said "yeah, no s***" and moved along with this thread as well. And someone has already mentioned demoting Zetterberg (and they won't be the last to bring this up in the next couple seasons), except in this case, it was Nielsen being promoted not Larkin.

I don't think a single person is surprised to see Howard as the starting netminder, and that would include even the biggest Mrazek fans and Howard "haters"...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

5 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

To be fair, most have basically said "yeah, no s***" and moved along with this thread as well. And someone has already mentioned demoting Zetterberg (and they won't be the last to bring this up in the next couple seasons), except in this case, it was Nielsen being promoted not Larkin.

I don't think a single person is surprised to see Howard as the starting netminder, and that would include even the biggest Mrazek fans and Howard "haters"...

And people complain about Blashill...

 

[kickazz 5,459]

Some of Osgood, Patrick Roy's best years came when they were 36-37 years old, same for Hasek. Howard should still have a lot of good years in him. 

Craig Anderson had a phenomenal year and he's 36.

Goalies are a different breed than forwards and defenseman.

Edited July 24, 2017 by kickazz

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

6 minutes ago, kickazz said:

Some of Osgoods best years came when he was 36-37 years old. Howard should still have a lot of good years in him. 

I'm already building a case against Petruzzelli for the 2021/22 season 

[toby91_ca 620]

19 minutes ago, kickazz said:

Some of Osgood, Patrick Roy's best years came when they were 36-37 years old, same for Hasek. Howard should still have a lot of good years in him. 

Craig Anderson had a phenomenal year and he's 36.

Goalies are a different breed than forwards and defenseman.

I agree, goalies are different, but I think goalies' shelf lives are shorter, not longer.  There are examples of goalies having great years later in their 30s, but those are few and far between I think and they are also more one offs (i.e. you don't typically see a string of several good years).

This isn't backed up by any statistical analysis though.

[krsmith17 7,191]

21 minutes ago, kickazz said:

Some of Osgood, Patrick Roy's best years came when they were 36-37 years old, same for Hasek. Howard should still have a lot of good years in him. 

Craig Anderson had a phenomenal year and he's 36.

Goalies are a different breed than forwards and defenseman.

Naming a few great goaltenders that have had good years beyond the age of 35, doesn't make it the norm. There are always outliers. Jagr is 45 years old, and still putting up great numbers. Again, an outlier, not the norm. On average, goaltenders prime years are likely a little later than defensemen, just as defensemen are a little later than forwards, but they do still have a peak, and if Howard hasn't hit his yet (I think he has), he will very soon. Mrazek's prime years should begin this season or next, and if he is truly as good as he has shown in some of the short stints, he should be a very good goaltender for another 5-10 years.

[wings_fanatic 677]

I am a huge mrazek supporter and im not surprised. But if mrazek comes back to his potential then they will end up splitting games in which case i see them sticking with mrazek if they were to make playoffs. Its not long ago mrazek was named starter and look how fast that changed. 

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

31 minutes ago, wings_fanatic said:

I am a huge mrazek supporter and im not surprised. But if mrazek comes back to his potential then they will end up splitting games in which case i see them sticking with mrazek if they were to make playoffs. Its not long ago mrazek was named starter and look how fast that changed. 

It's approaching 2 years now

[kickazz 5,459]

6 minutes ago, F.Michael said:

Not to nitpick, but that was then - this is now.

Remember how Bowman loved his vets?

Today - if you're over 30 - fugghetaboutit!

Just like 'speed'...'Youth' also seems to be of high value nowadays.

Personally - I feel both 'speed', and 'youth' are painfully overrated.

Wait - what are we talking about again?

RedWingFred

[kliq 3,755]

You can look at it both ways, if a goalie is an average talent, most likely once he hits 30+ teams will give up on him because they want either A) a kid with potential, or B) an elite/upper tier goaltender. There are only realistically around 60 spots in the entire NHL.

The reason why elite goalies can sustain elite play, is because the main thing that slows down athletes more then anything is wear and tear/injuries. Obviously goalies get injured, but if a goalie can keep his groin/knees healthy, there is no reason to believe they can't go for a long time at a high level. Add to that the fact that you can watch the minutes a goalie plays to decrease the chance of injury, they can hold off injuries a lot longer.

For a player, even if they are older and smarter, they are getting hit and knocked around every game and their chance of avoiding injury IMO are less. They need to be careful of injuries to their groins, knees, shoulders, head, legs, arms etc. Not that a goalie cant suffer a concussion, broken arm, dislocated shoulder etc. but I'm pretty sure it's a lot less likely.

I could see a healthy 38 year old goaltender winning a Vezina. I could never see a 38 year old winning the Art Ross or Hart.

[LeftWinger 4,936]

10 hours ago, Andy Pred 48 said:

Well hopefully our near $10m duo play like their payroll and it'll help out our average D (at present) which should see us challenge for a post season league position.

 

Does the rest of the team play like their payroll?

[chaps80 1,591]

Vegas didnt want him, Detroit doesnt want him, only LGW prays he can still unseat Howard lol 

He's already unseated Howard before with minimal NHL experience under his belt. Can easily do it again after the season he just went through. If a guy with his skill set and confidence heard things about himself in the media gets determined to play at his best to silence his critics, he's probably someone you want to keep a look out for behind you.

I doubt Howard thinks the job will be easy to hang on to.


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[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

13 minutes ago, chaps80 said:

 

He's already unseated Howard before with minimal NHL experience under his belt. Can easily do it again after the season he just went through. If a guy with his skill set and confidence heard things about himself in the media gets determined to play at his best to silence his critics, he's probably someone you want to keep a look out for behind you.

I doubt Howard thinks the job will be easy to hang on to.


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Howard's already unseated Mrazek before with minimal NHL games (26) under his belt. Can easily do it again after the season he just went through. If a guy with his skill set and confidence heard things about himself in the LGW Forums gets determined to play at his best to silence his critics, he's probably someone you want to keep a look out for in front of you.

I doubt Mrazek thinks the job will be easy to grab on to.

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Edited July 24, 2017 by ChristopherReevesLegs

[chaps80 1,591]

I'm not arguing which of the two makes the team better. It's very clear that Howard was the better goaltender last season, and if he continues to be again this season, of course you ride him. What I'm saying is that it's natural to hope that the younger goalie unseats the goalie that will in all likelihood soon be on the decline of his career.
Yeah, we definitely need to unseat the 21 year old Larkin. He's way past his prime anyway...  Forget that ridiculous example, do you not hope that Larkin unseats Zetterberg as the top line center in the next year or so? No? Bulls***. Yes? Why? Because Zetterberg likely only has another couple good years (if we're lucky) in him before he starts to drastically decline.
This has nothing to do with me liking Mrazek over Howard (I've always been a Howard supporter), this is about what's better for the team going forward. I do hope the younger goalie gets back on track and unseats the older goalie. And if all things are equal, I go with the younger goalie (player) every time. (Note: I'm not talking a few years, I'm talking significant difference in age (8 years)).

Exactly. I don't "hate" Howard either. But who knows how much longer he has with all his past issues. Some younger goalie has to take the reigns soon by necessity. If not Mrazek or Coreau, then another will. Howard is one of those players I swear has things given to him as a veteran. Gets too much benefit of the doubt from management and coaches. Osgood couldn't even have the starting job back after Legace until he won the damn team a Cup, but sure Jimmy, take the net back based on 1/3 of the season you were actually available to the team.


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[chaps80 1,591]

Howard's already unseated Mrazek before with minimal NHL games (26) under his belt. Can easily do it again after the season he just went through. If a guy with his skill set and confidence heard things about himself in the LGW Forums gets determined to play at his best to silence his critics, he's probably someone you want to keep a look out for in front of you.

I doubt Mrazek thinks the job will be easy to grab on to.

Sent from my PC using interwebs

26? Add about 7 seasons worth to that total.


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