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The Wings sucked last year because their defense couldn't play defense not because AA couldn't. He's got a higher ceiling than only 3-4 guys on the team, his trade value is higher and he's just a better player. Not once last year did I turn on the television to watch any member of our defense and it likely won't happen again this year. I don't understand the logic in anyone saying they'd rate Howard or any member of our defense above him. We've got a good young core at Forward and have done nothing to address the gaping hole on defense.

If the argument is lets trade AA or some other talent to get a defenseman sure lets do it but lets not act like any of these role players and mid-level talent is anything close to Larkin, Mantha, AA or Zadina. AA is a special talent and I think he'll have a breakout year, glad we resigned him.

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28 minutes ago, MileHighWingsGuy said:

The Wings sucked last year because their defense couldn't play defense not because AA couldn't. He's got a higher ceiling than only 3-4 guys on the team, his trade value is higher and he's just a better player. Not once last year did I turn on the television to watch any member of our defense and it likely won't happen again this year. I don't understand the logic in anyone saying they'd rate Howard or any member of our defense above him. We've got a good young core at Forward and have done nothing to address the gaping hole on defense.

If the argument is lets trade AA or some other talent to get a defenseman sure lets do it but lets not act like any of these role players and mid-level talent is anything close to Larkin, Mantha, AA or Zadina. AA is a special talent and I think he'll have a breakout year, glad we resigned him.

Larkin, Mantha, Zadina, AA:

:tenor.gif?itemid=11251276

That doesn't excuse AA from not playing a 2 way game, nor is it an excuse for being selfish. He needs to play some defense like every other forward on the team.

He may have a higher ceiling, but that doesn't make him 3rd or 4th best now. He has a lot to learn and he will never reach that potential if he continues to be one dimensional.

Because he has "potential". His trade value will start to go down if he doesn't wise up.

PLaying D isn't entertaining, but You can't win without it. AA may be entertaining to watch, but that doesn't win you any games.

Edited by Neomaxizoomdweebie

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1 hour ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Larkin, Mantha, Zadina, AA:

:tenor.gif?itemid=11251276

That doesn't excuse AA from not playing a 2 way game, nor is it an excuse for being selfish. He needs to play some defense like every other forward on the team.

He may have a higher ceiling, but that doesn't make him 3rd or 4th best now. He has a lot to learn and he will never reach that potential if he continues to be one dimensional.

Because he has "potential". His trade value will start to go down if he doesn't wise up.

PLaying D isn't entertaining, but You can't win without it. AA may be entertaining to watch, but that doesn't win you any games.

And if he can be moved NOW in a package to bring a top 4 (YOUNGER) d-man, you freaking do it. Drafting Zadina made him expendable. What does this team lack more than anything? Defense.

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Same AA debate going on in multiple threads, and I can't decide which idiotic extreme I want to debunk more. :\

We need some new rumors or something. How about a hypothetical: If you had a chance to get Weber from Montreal super cheap; Nyquist + Daley; BUT you knew ahead of time that Weber would play out all 8 years remaining on his contract...do you do it anyway?

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8 minutes ago, F.Michael said:

Is it me or has Weber been a shell of his former self since joining the Habs?

Injuries, age, and playing on a crappy team...

You mostly. He's only been there two years and was injured for 2/3rds of one of them. Starting to decline for sure, but he's been good in Montreal.

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7 hours ago, MileHighWingsGuy said:

The Wings sucked last year because their defense couldn't play defense not because AA couldn't. He's got a higher ceiling than only 3-4 guys on the team, his trade value is higher and he's just a better player. Not once last year did I turn on the television to watch any member of our defense and it likely won't happen again this year. I don't understand the logic in anyone saying they'd rate Howard or any member of our defense above him. We've got a good young core at Forward and have done nothing to address the gaping hole on defense.

If the argument is lets trade AA or some other talent to get a defenseman sure lets do it but lets not act like any of these role players and mid-level talent is anything close to Larkin, Mantha, AA or Zadina. AA is a special talent and I think he'll have a breakout year, glad we resigned him.

Exhibit A of my AA theory

AA is the most fun player to watch, which is making him overrated as all heck.

Zetterberg is boring as heck to watch. But the man plays winning hockey. 

Exciting does not equal good.

Larkin, now thats a player who is exciting and good.

I hope AA does really well and becomes the 50 pt player we all hope he can be. But he clearly has a lot to work on. Hes way behind Mantha and Larkin. And I think Bertuzzi is about leap frog him. 

Hes certanily not the 4th best player on this team in my book. The score sheet reflects that and the salary chart reflects that, even considering overpayments. 

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18 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

I didn't disrespect Larkin.

He ain't the captain.

18 hours ago, MileHighWingsGuy said:

Our two netminders struggle with mediocrity, have a hard time believing you aren’t joking.

 

so if I gave you a clean slate and said keep your best talent you’d keep Howard? Really? 

First, I am not joking.  I think that both of our goaltenders in the grand scheme of things are "better" than AA.  RIGHT NOW.  

Second, that wasn't the premise of the argument.  If we're clean slating here?  How do I get to choose my replacement goaltenders?  From available UFAs?  ...because I think we picked up the best one in this offseason and creating a tandem of Bernier/Howard is fine with me for this season.

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14 hours ago, Buppy said:

Same AA debate going on in multiple threads, and I can't decide which idiotic extreme I want to debunk more. :\

We need some new rumors or something. How about a hypothetical: If you had a chance to get Weber from Montreal super cheap; Nyquist + Daley; BUT you knew ahead of time that Weber would play out all 8 years remaining on his contract...do you do it anyway?

I am not so sure about Weber, but if Minny wanted to entertain me with Suter, I'd make a deal for him. Under the same circumstances of him playing out his entire contract.

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Here some stuff to discuss instead of who's better than AA.

 

https://mynhltraderumors.com/nhl-rumors-st-louis-blues-patrick-maroon-detroit-red-wings-andreas-athanasiou-tyler-myers/2018/07/09/

 

Still haven't heard any rumors or talk about Trouba.  Wonder what is happening with Faulk.

Edited by LeftWinger

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21 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

Here some stuff to discuss instead of who's better than AA

Still haven't heard any rumors or talk about Trouba.  Wonder what is happening with Faulk.

So.... Who's better in a trade than AA??

Here's some talk... Trouba will re-sign with the Jets.  Faulk will be traded.

Edited by e_prime

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2 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

I am not so sure about Weber, but if Minny wanted to entertain me with Suter, I'd make a deal for him. Under the same circumstances of him playing out his entire contract.

Too easy. Suter only has 7 years left, and his hit is like $300k less. :)

How about Suter and Parise, full term for both, but they take back Nielsen, Dekeyser, and Kronwall? 

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29 minutes ago, Buppy said:

That's the point. Kind of a hockey version of "Would you rather".

Now were getting to the tough questions

Would you rather have...

Saad or Panarin?

Sedin or Sedin?

Matt Cooke or Sean Avery?

Hossa or Franzen?

Dan Cleary or an $8.95 waste basket from Walmart?

Chicken tenders or chicken nuggets?

Roy as a coach or Gretzky as a coach?

Nyquist or Tatar?

Datsyuk or Zetterberg?

Kory Kocur or a 17th overall pick?

Go to an away game in Leafs land or Habs land?

Be best friends with Wayne Gretzky or date Paulina Gretzky?

Have bamboo shoved up your urethra everyday for 9 years or be an Avs fan?

Edited by ChristopherReevesLegs

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2 hours ago, e_prime said:

So.... Who's better in a trade than AA??

Here's some talk... Trouba will re-sign with the Jets.  Faulk will be traded.

I've said that if AA would bring us back a top line D, then I'd be fine with him being traded.

By Trouba "talk" I didn't mean here, I meant around the league.

5 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Now were getting to the tough questions

Would you rather have...

Saad or Panarin? Panarin

Sedin or Sedin? Neither

Matt Cooke or Sean Avery? Avery

Hossa or Franzen? duh

Dan Cleary or an $8.95 waste basket from Walmart? Dollar store waste basket

Chicken tenders or chicken nuggets? Tenders

Roy as a coach or Gretzky as a coach? f*** Me!

Nyquist or Tatar? AA

Datsyuk or Zetterberg? Datsyuk

Kory Kocur or a 17th overall pick? Tie Domi

Go to an away game in Leafs land or Habs land? Habs

Be best friends with Wayne Gretzky or date Paulina Gretzky? Wayne

Have bamboo shoved up your urethra everyday for 9 years or be an Avs fan? Tough Call

 

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21 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Now were getting to the tough questions

Would you rather have...

Saad or Panarin? Pandaren Monk 

Sedin or Sedin? Semin

Matt Cooke or Sean Avery? Sloppy Seconds

Hossa or Franzen? Toews

Dan Cleary or an $8.95 waste basket from Walmart? A handshake 

Chicken tenders or chicken nuggets? Are you insinuating that I'm black?

Roy as a coach or Gretzky as a coach? Roy's penis

Nyquist or Tatar? Jurco

Datsyuk or Zetterberg? Zettersyuk

Kory Kocur or a 17th overall pick?  Idk?

Go to an away game in Leafs land or Habs land? Jump off a cliff

Be best friends with Wayne Gretzky or date Paulina Gretzky? Date Wayne, be friends with Paulina

Have bamboo shoved up your urethra everyday for 9 years or be an Avs fan? Up my ass

 

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11 minutes ago, joesuffP said:

Nobody seems to care that the Red Wings captain may or may not retire? Isn’t his decision supposed to be made in mid July?

I think no one is mentioning it because they don't want it to happen.

But, as negative as it could be, let's look at the positives that could come from it. Larkin would take over as our #1 guy, he would play all the important minutes and become the elite player we hope he is. It opens up a roster spot and a ton of cap room. I listed a team before without Z, but tool some slack as I put AA in the #2 C spot, but even if he played Wing or was #3C, I am sure we'd be ok without Z. Well not 100% ok, but we'd survive and move forward with kids. 

Mantha - Larkin  - Zadina 

Nyquist - Nielsen - Vanek 

Rasmussen - Helm - AA 

Abby - Glenny - Bertuzzi

I'd love to see Svech and Valeno make the team, but it would take some trades for sure. Maybe 2019 after the TDL.

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25 minutes ago, joesuffP said:

Nobody seems to care that the Red Wings captain may or may not retire? Isn’t his decision supposed to be made in mid July?

Screw him

Edited by kickazz

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2 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Now were getting to the tough questions

Would you rather have...

Saad or Panarin? Panera

Sedin or Sedin? Sundin

Matt Cooke or Sean Avery? MEH

Hossa or Franzen? Healthy Franzen

Dan Cleary or an $8.95 waste basket from Walmart? Cleary

Chicken tenders or chicken nuggets? Either/or as long as its white meat

Roy as a coach or Gretzky as a coach? Andre Roy or Brent Gretzky

Nyquist or Tatar? Nyquist. He;s better than AA.

Datsyuk or Zetterberg? :z:

Kory Kocur or a 17th overall pick? Joey Kocur

Go to an away game in Leafs land or Habs land? Habs. I wouldn't understand their obscenities directed at me.

Be best friends with Wayne Gretzky or date Paulina Gretzky? Date Janet.

Have bamboo shoved up your urethra everyday for 9 years or be an Avs fan? Avs fan, reluctantly.

 

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55 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

I think no one is mentioning it because they don't want it to happen.

But, as negative as it could be, let's look at the positives that could come from it. Larkin would take over as our #1 guy, he would play all the important minutes and become the elite player we hope he is. It opens up a roster spot and a ton of cap room. I listed a team before without Z, but tool some slack as I put AA in the #2 C spot, but even if he played Wing or was #3C, I am sure we'd be ok without Z. Well not 100% ok, but we'd survive and move forward with kids. 

Mantha - Larkin  - Zadina 

Nyquist - Nielsen - Vanek 

Rasmussen - Helm - AA 

Abby - Glenny - Bertuzzi

I'd love to see Svech and Valeno make the team, but it would take some trades for sure. Maybe 2019 after the TDL.

I like this lineup, although I think it was the Athanasiou-Nielsen-Vanek line that absolutely tore it up when we had Vanek 2 season ago. I also would hope for Nyquist to get traded. 

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