Official 2018 Off Season *Rebuild* Thread

[LeftWinger 4,961]

We have the chance to draft THREE defenders in the 1st two rounds that are already better than what we have on our current team. Bouchard, Mat Samuelsson and Calen Addison.  Now that doesn't mean they'll bump three of our D out this season, but add to those three, Cholowski and Hronek and the outside remote possibility that we could land Karlsson, we really don't need to take away from our top 6 future to add another D.

Holland could go with Hughes, Boqvist or Dobsobn with #6 and they too are also better than anyone we have on D currently.  The remains, you don't trade away players like Larkin.

[krsmith17 7,191]

1 hour ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Trouba for Athanasiou and a 2nd.

Jets are in the Conference Finals.

Are you drunk? Your posts make no sense...

Theodore for Jensen and a 5th.

Vegas are in the Conference Finals.

......

[krsmith17 7,191]

1 minute ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Bertuzzi and a 5th for PK Subban.  The predators probably wouldnt go for it, tho.  - KRSmith

Good one bud... 

The Detroit Red Wings organization for Josh Manson. I eat crayons and sniff glue. - Jonas Mahonas

[krsmith17 7,191]

You're making s*** up. I've never proposed a trade as bad as you're suggesting. Your outlook on this team SUCKS. Your knowledge of hockey in general SUCKS. And your trade proposals are MUCH worse... I'm going to leave it at that. I was warned not to get sucked in. Unfortunately I didn't listen... 

[13dangledangle 965]

[Dabura 12,207]

https://www.tsn.ca/off-season-game-plan-detroit-red-wings-1.1083279

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

5 hours ago, Dabura said:

https://www.tsn.ca/off-season-game-plan-detroit-red-wings-1.1083279

I was at least open-minded until this gem:

Unheralded blueliner Nick Jensen, who was a fifth-round pick in 2009, played in 81 games and provided strong defensive play for the Red Wings, giving him positive shot differentials, and that shouldn’t be taken for granted. He didn’t reach the NHL until he was 26-years-old, but Jensen has been a solid player, and it may be time to give him more responsibility.

[krsmith17 7,191]

23 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

I was at least open-minded until this gem:

Unheralded blueliner Nick Jensen, who was a fifth-round pick in 2009, played in 81 games and provided strong defensive play for the Red Wings, giving him positive shot differentials, and that shouldn’t be taken for granted. He didn’t reach the NHL until he was 26-years-old, but Jensen has been a solid player, and it may be time to give him more responsibility.

One of the few things I somewhat I agreed with in that article...

Jensen was one of our better defenders last season. That's not a good thing...

[chaps80 1,591]

8 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

With all due respect to Lidstrom, he was not the reason nor the cornerstone for us winning the Cups in 97 and 98. He was great, but he was only one part in a machine.

I agree, you are offering way too much for Hamilton. As much as you need a "Hamilton" on the blueline, you also desperately need a Larkin in the top 6. There is nobody in the system that could replace Larkin. We'll draft our version of Hamilton (hopefully Bouchard) and we'll still have Larkin. Win-Win.

'97 no, but once Vladdy was forced into early retirement, he stepped up big time starting in '98. That was straight from Bowman.

[chaps80 1,591]

6 minutes ago, F.Michael said:

IMHO Larry Murphy did a great job of mentoring Lids...Murphy being so slow knew how to position himself, and went to where the puck was going...Lids game really took off from there.

Murphy was a smart pick up for sure. He and Shanny were the final pieces, along with Vernon who mentored Osgood and got him ready for full time starter duty. Back when the Wings had patience with goalies. They spent a few seasons grooming Ozzie after they saw he wasn't quite ready and it payed off.

[Buppy 1,720]

11 hours ago, Dabura said:

https://www.tsn.ca/off-season-game-plan-detroit-red-wings-1.1083279

I'll save everyone else the trouble of reading the article:

He forgot to include an off-season game plan in his off-season game plan article, instead choosing to sing the same "bad contracts" song we've heard 62 million times. Said "something something something shot differentials, something something something complete" a few times, and concluded with a projected roster where we apparently traded AA for OEL and signed a couple nobody forwards for the 4th line/press box.

I had thought TSN had better standards. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

3 hours ago, Buppy said:

I'll save everyone else the trouble of reading the article:

He forgot to include an off-season game plan in his off-season game plan article, instead choosing to sing the same "bad contracts" song we've heard 62 million times. Said "something something something shot differentials, something something something complete" a few times, and concluded with a projected roster where we apparently traded AA for OEL and signed a couple nobody forwards for the 4th line/press box.

I had thought TSN had better standards. 

Yup, it was one of the worst articles of read in a while. I was surprised to see such low standards from TSN...

[LeftWinger 4,961]

It'd be nice to get OEL, it would help our chances in landing Karlsson.

[krsmith17 7,191]

33 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

It'd be nice to get OEL, it would help our chances in landing Karlsson.

We'd never be able to afford both. Besides, Ekman-Larsson will be a UFA as well next offseason. I wouldn't give up the assets it would take to trade for either for only one guaranteed season. 

[LeftWinger 4,961]

Ya, but could imagine if we COULD land both? Stranger things have happened! I am sure cap will rise again, we are losing Kronwall and Howards contract.  Sure we'll be paying Larkin and Mantha more than now, but again, especially if we bomb out of the JT sweeps, we'd need about what, $16M-$18M to sign them? Maybe $20M? That's a lot to have tied up in 2 guys, but the quality of those 2 would be worth it IMO! If we don't waste anymore cash on average UFA's and just bring up our kids, we could swing $20M to those two guys...

OEL - Bouchard (PLEASE!)

Karlsson - Cholowski

Hronek - Ericsson

Extra

It's nice to imagine!

[LeftWinger 4,961]

Maybe we do make a deal for OEL under the pretenses that he re-signs or he already re-signed and then traded. I am sure it would be expensive, but AA and VEG's 1st is a good start.

[marcaractac 3,963]

3 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

Maybe we do make a deal for OEL under the pretenses that he re-signs or he already re-signed and then traded. I am sure it would be expensive, but AA and VEG's 1st is a good start.

An AA and a late first round pick for OEL would get Ken Holland hung up on, not get a conversation started. 

[kliq 3,755]

OEL will likely be traded at the TDL next year to a contender, then he'll be signed by the highest bidder in the off-season. I just can't see him staying in Arizona.

Zero reason for Holland to give up assets for an upcoming UFA.

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

"Rebuild" means you don't trade young roster players, prospects, or draft picks for high-priced soon to be free agents. You do totally the opposite.

[Dabura 12,207]

17 hours ago, Buppy said:

I had thought TSN had better standards. 

You thought wrong!

[LeftWinger 4,961]

7 hours ago, marcaractac said:

An AA and a late first round pick for OEL would get Ken Holland hung up on, not get a conversation started. 

Really? Thanks. That is why I said it would be a "good start."

Why don't you try and add something to the conversation instead of just trolling and trying to talk down to people?

[marcaractac 3,963]

8 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

Really? Thanks. That is why I said it would be a "good start."

Why don't you try and add something to the conversation instead of just trolling and trying to talk down to people?

I said it wouldn't be a good start. AA and a late first would not even garner a response from the Yotes. It would be balked at.  

You are severely overvaluing AA and what you yourself has said is basically a second round pick many times in these forums. There is no trolling here. There is no talking down to anyone. It's a legit response and you are simply being paranoid.  

[LeftWinger 4,961]

Being a good start means, "we're sending you AA and a 1st for sure, what else is it going to take in addition?" Then the negotiating begins. They'd be getting AA and a 1st in addition to other assets. That's just the "start." Its a good starting point.

[krsmith17 7,191]

16 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

I somewhat agree with Marc here, even though his attitude is less than pleasing.  It's a GREAT start for us.  Not even close to a start for Phoenix.  4th round pick and Thornton for Larkin?  No.  San Jose says "it's a start."  No.   It's not even anything for us.  Don't fall into the KRSmith method of trade offers.  If we don't have at least some hesitation, it's a trade that is not going to happen.  We are NOT going to get first pairing defensemen in the beginning of their primes for our 2nd line talent.  

Mikhail Sergachev for Svechnikov and a 2nd.  - KRSmith 

Keep spewing the same old bulls***...

Quote a single trade proposal that was anywhere close to what you're suggesting. You can't.

Mikhail Sergachev for Larkin, Rasmussen, Cholowski, 6th overall pick.  - Jonas Mahoron

[krsmith17 7,191]

45 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

2nd Line Center (and that is extremely generous) + Cholowski (best prospect)

For

Trouba (22 mins per night, Top 4 Dman entering his prime)

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/video/haggerty-jets-would-want-significant-package-jacob-trouba

1) we don't have a left handed damn Winnipeg would consider top 4 caliber.

2) they'd want Athanasiou AND Bouchard if we sold them on Cholowski.

Are you willing to give up those 3?  

IF Trouba doesn't want to re-sign in Winnipeg (which was one of the stipulations to my proposed trade), do you still think they'd get max value? They wouldn't. What if he demands a trade to Detroit? Where does that put his trade value?

I'm not saying I think this will happen (I don't), but if it did, I don't think Athanasiou, plus a prospect and / or a pick is that far off what Winnipeg would accept. A year or two ago, I think this sort of trade could have been possible. Now, not so much, which is why I said "probably won't ever happen"... Unfortunately, Winnipeg are a power-house team now and Trouba is finally getting the ice time he deserves, so at this point in his career, I highly doubt he wants to go anywhere, let alone Detroit.

I've also stated several times that I don't want to trade for any established top end defensemen, including Trouba, because the cost would be way more than I'd be willing to pay. If we want to acquire top end talent to solidify our back end, it should be through the draft, and / or trading for high end prospects.

This all started because you threw out an outlandish trade proposal for Dougie Hamilton. I called you out on it, and you're trying to spin it as if you make fair deals for both sides, and I don't offer near enough. I admit that the cost would be huge (not as high as you think it would be), which is why I don't want to make such trades. You think it would be a good idea to make these trades even if it guts our entire organization. It's dumb.