2018 Off-Season Trades / Signings / News

[krsmith17 7,191]

4 hours ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Because he is arguably the best overall D on the team, on a team with crappy D. Assuming there are 1 maybe 2 rookies on the blue line this season, why put them in a worse situation? Plus Daley is a solid 2 way dman on a good contract with a Stanley Cup pedigree. Exactly the kind of guy I want playing with the kids.

Meh, agree to disagree I guess. I just don't think Daley does anything exceptionally well. He's solid sure, but a bottom pairing defenseman at this point in his career. He could maybe teach the kids a thing or two, but nothing a Kronwall or Green couldn't. I'd trade the older guy that would fetch the bigger return, but that's just my opinion... Daley is not a player we must keep. 

[kickazz 5,459]

Had Green not been resigned I'd keep Daley as Kronwall exits. But with Green on the books for 2 years. No point. 

[e_prime 1,936]

1 hour ago, kickazz said:

Had Green not been resigned I'd keep Daley as Kronwall exits. But with Green on the books for 2 years. No point. 

Green and Daley, along with Ericsson all need to be re-signed for 20-21.  

If both Daley and Green are not here... then whom?

[krsmith17 7,191]

6 minutes ago, e_prime said:

Green and Daley, along with Ericsson all need to be re-signed for 20-21.  

If both Daley and Green are not here... then whom?

Not sure if serious...

None of these guys should be re-signed beyond the 2020-21 season, let alone all three... Green will be 35, and Daley and Ericsson will be 37. DeKeyser will be 31 and more than capable of "leading" the young guys. Maybe bring in another "veteran" in the 28-32 year old range, but all of the aforementioned defenseman should be done in Detroit.

Then whom? Hronek, Cholowski, McIsaac, Lindstrom, 2019 draft pick, free agent, trade, etc...

[kickazz 5,459]

43 minutes ago, e_prime said:

Green and Daley, along with Ericsson all need to be re-signed for 20-21.  

If both Daley and Green are not here... then whom?

My best case scenario is this:

 

Green, Kronwall, Daley stick around this year and Cholo, Hronek, Hickets make the cut and get a lot of games in this season, At least 20 games each at some point due to injuries and call ups. Next year I hope 1-2 of them steal some jobs, preferably all 3 but doubtful. Eventually 2 of Green, Daley, Ericsson sent off during trade deadline of 2019/20 season. We re-sign one of them for a year or two. If I had to pick it would be Green. In the mean time we will have 2 more years of solid drafts hopefully with 1-2 promising defensemen. Maybe we get lucky and end up with a great defensive pick. And if we're extremely lucky we land a defenseman through a trade which makes everything even better for us. 

20-21 our defensive core would be something like

Hronek- Green

Cholo- Dekeyser

Hicketts - Jensen

Saarijarvi, Lindstrom, McIsaac etc 

Your veterans at this point would be DK, Green, Jensen. Your young players entering primes would be Hronek, Cholo, Hicketts. 

 

Edited September 6, 2018 by kickazz

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

3 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

Meh, agree to disagree I guess. I just don't think Daley does anything exceptionally well. He's solid sure, but a bottom pairing defenseman at this point in his career. He could maybe teach the kids a thing or two, but nothing a Kronwall or Green couldn't. I'd trade the older guy that would fetch the bigger return, but that's just my opinion... Daley is not a player we must keep. 

No argument here. He's solid, but not the kind of player who "wows" you. But that's OK. He's does his job well without drawing attention to himself. Exactly what I want a young defenseman to emulate.

Disagree. Still a 2nd pair guy IMO. Jensen is a 3rd pair.

True. But I don't expect Kronwall back after this season, and I prefer having rookie/vet combos on the defense. Green-top pair, Daley-2nd pair, Ericsson-3rd pair. next season.

At the TDL next year? Sure. Get something for him instead of losing him for nothing. But until then, Daley is just more of an asset than Jensen IMO.Guys like Jensen are a dime a dozen.

Must keep? No. But I do think he's a much better dman than Jensen, who i don't expect to be re-signed. 

29 minutes ago, kickazz said:

My best case scenario is this:

 

Green, Kronwall, Daley stick around this year and Cholo, Hronek, Hickets make the cut and get a lot of games in this season, At least 20 games each at some point due to injuries and call ups. Next year I hope 1-2 of them steal some jobs, preferably all 3 but doubtful. Eventually 2 of Green, Daley, Ericsson sent off during trade deadline of 2019/20 season. We re-sign one of them for a year or two. If I had to pick it would be Green. In the mean time we will have 2 more years of solid drafts hopefully with 1-2 promising defensemen. Maybe we get lucky and end up with a great defensive pick. And if we're extremely lucky we land a defenseman through a trade which makes everything even better for us. 

20-21 our defensive core would be something like

Hronek- Green

Cholo- Dekeyser

Hicketts - Jensen

Saarijarvi, Lindstrom, McIsaac etc 

Your veterans at this point would be DK, Green, Jensen. Your young players entering primes would be Hronek, Cholo, Hicketts. 

 

Pretty much what I think the plan is.

54 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Not sure if serious...

None of these guys should be re-signed beyond the 2020-21 season, let alone all three... Green will be 35, and Daley and Ericsson will be 37. DeKeyser will be 31 and more than capable of "leading" the young guys. Maybe bring in another "veteran" in the 28-32 year old range, but all of the aforementioned defenseman should be done in Detroit.

Then whom? Hronek, Cholowski, McIsaac, Lindstrom, 2019 draft pick, free agent, trade, etc...

Don't have a problem with Green back as a 35 yo 3rd pair /PP guy, but the other 2 should not be brought back, I agree.

[e_prime 1,936]

9 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

Not sure if serious...

None of these guys should be re-signed beyond the 2020-21 season, let alone all three... Green will be 35, and Daley and Ericsson will be 37. DeKeyser will be 31 and more than capable of "leading" the young guys. Maybe bring in another "veteran" in the 28-32 year old range, but all of the aforementioned defenseman should be done in Detroit.

Then whom? Hronek, Cholowski, McIsaac, Lindstrom, 2019 draft pick, free agent, trade, etc...

That should have read Ericsson, Daley, and Green are here right now and would need to be resigned in 20-21. 

If we're trading away Green at the deadline and we also are trading Jensen and Daley... and literally, I don't care if all three go, immediately...  ...but if not them back there on the blueline, then whom?   That was my not well fleshed out thought/statement. 

Should any of them be re-signed then for 20-21.  No.    Do I think one might?  Yes, because Ken Holland is Ken Holland. Who do I think that player might be?  Trevor Daley.  1 year extension.  Over Mike Green -- because he will already be traded.

9 hours ago, kickazz said:

My best case scenario is this:

Green, Kronwall, Daley stick around this year and Cholo, Hronek, Hickets make the cut and get a lot of games in this season, At least 20 games each at some point due to injuries and call ups. Next year I hope 1-2 of them steal some jobs, preferably all 3 but doubtful. Eventually 2 of Green, Daley, Ericsson sent off during trade deadline of 2019/20 season. We re-sign one of them for a year or two. If I had to pick it would be Green. In the mean time we will have 2 more years of solid drafts hopefully with 1-2 promising defensemen. Maybe we get lucky and end up with a great defensive pick. And if we're extremely lucky we land a defenseman through a trade which makes everything even better for us. 

20-21 our defensive core would be something like

Hronek- Green

Cholo- Dekeyser

Hicketts - Jensen

Saarijarvi, Lindstrom, McIsaac etc 

Your veterans at this point would be DK, Green, Jensen. Your young players entering primes would be Hronek, Cholo, Hicketts. 

 

As I said before, I SHURE HOPE SUM DEM ROOOKIES IS GUD.  Because the above, while probably the reality we live in, sure does rely on a lot of luck.  While already implied, included in your outlook @kick should have been, "Beyond making the cut we have to consider it very lucky all three of Hronek, Cholo, and Hicketts steal jobs, get those 20+ games and ALL end up living up to or surpassing their prospect projections."

I don't like all of this luck that's involved.  Certainly, we NEED to draft the best defensive prospects we can over the course of the next couple years and hopefully that shot or a shot at another top forward prospect that could make other prospects or current roster players expendable in trades. Because we NEED to trade for better/ a top defensemen. We NEED to sign better UFA defensemen (when and if available) and we NEED to discard that chaff instead of holding onto hopes that they might pan out or are good enough.

Edited September 6, 2018 by e_prime

[krsmith17 7,191]

8 hours ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

No argument here. He's solid, but not the kind of player who "wows" you. But that's OK. He's does his job well without drawing attention to himself. Exactly what I want a young defenseman to emulate.

Disagree. Still a 2nd pair guy IMO. Jensen is a 3rd pair.

True. But I don't expect Kronwall back after this season, and I prefer having rookie/vet combos on the defense. Green-top pair, Daley-2nd pair, Ericsson-3rd pair. next season.

At the TDL next year? Sure. Get something for him instead of losing him for nothing. But until then, Daley is just more of an asset than Jensen IMO.Guys like Jensen are a dime a dozen.

Must keep? No. But I do think he's a much better dman than Jensen, who i don't expect to be re-signed. 

 

Don't have a problem with Green back as a 35 yo 3rd pair /PP guy, but the other 2 should not be brought back, I agree.

Best case scenario, Daley is a decent number 4 at this point in his career. In my opinion he's better suited as a 3rd pairing defenseman. I don't see how you can say that Daley is that much better than Jensen though. They're not that far apart in my opinion.

I disagree that you need a veteran on every pair. But even if you do have that philosophy, DeKeyser is a veteran at this point, so we could go with Green - top pair, DeKeyser - 2nd pair, Ericsson (or Jensen) - 3rd pair.

You think Daley and his $3.2M and a 6th round pick (Jensen trade) is more valuable than Jensen and his $800K and a 3rd round pick (Daley trade) (hypothetical). I disagree. If we could trade Daley at this year's trade deadline, I'd do it without thinking twice. Like has been mentioned, Green is the better veteran and with him being here for another 2 years (potentially longer), Daley isn't needed. I'd be open to bringing Green back in two years time, but I'm not ready to say sitting here today that that will be the best thing for the team at that point. A lot can happen in that time. It depends on how Green ages in the next two years, how our prospects develop in the next two years, who we draft next year, who else is available via free agency at that time, if any trades are made in that time, etc...

23 minutes ago, e_prime said:

That should have read Ericsson, Daley, and Green are here right now and would need to be resigned in 20-21. 

If we're trading away Green at the deadline and we also are trading Jensen and Daley... and literally, I don't care if all three go, immediately...  ...but if not them back there on the blueline, then whom?   That was my not well fleshed out thought/statement. 

Should any of them be re-signed then for 20-21.  No.    Do I think one might?  Yes, because Ken Holland is Ken Holland. Who do I think that player might be?  Trevor Daley.  1 year extension.  Over Mike Green -- because he will already be traded.

As I said before, I SHURE HOPE SUM DEM ROOOKIES IS GUD.  Because the above, while probably the reality we live in, sure does rely on a lot of luck.  While already implied, included in your outlook @kick should have been, "Beyond making the cut we have to consider it very lucky all three of Hronek, Cholo, and Hicketts steal jobs, get those 20+ games and ALL end up living up to or surpassing their prospect projections."

I don't like all of this luck that's involved.  Certainly, we NEED to draft the best defensive prospects we can over the course of the next couple years and hopefully that shot or a shot at another top forward prospect that could make other prospects or current roster players expendable in trades. Because we NEED to trade for better/ a top defensemen. We NEED to sign better UFA defensemen (when and if available) and we NEED to discard that chaff instead of holding onto hopes that they might pan out or are good enough.

I agree that one might be re-signed, but if one is, and I hope it's one at most, I'd hope it would be Green. There's also no saying that Green would be traded and Daley wouldn't.

We will need a lot of these kids to pan out, but I don't think it's much of a stretch to say that at least four of Hronek, Cholowski, McIsaac, Barton, Regula, Lindstrom, Kotkansalo, Sulak, Saarijarvi, Hicketts could develop into regular NHL defensemen. The problem is, none project to be high end top pair defenseman. We will need a little luck for any of them to exceed expectations, but I don't think that's out of the realm of possibility either. I'm not too concerned. We still have a couple drafts to nab a potential top pair (number one) defenseman, trades / free agency to improve the defense.

[LeftWinger 4,961]

if a team comers asking about Daley this TDL, I definitely move him. Next TDL, Green. I don't see anybody asking about E, so let him play out his contract and then bid adieu.

Either way, NONE of those players can be on this team in October 2020.

[kickazz 5,459]

Double post

Edited September 6, 2018 by kickazz

[e_prime 1,936]

29 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I'd be open to bringing Green back in two years time, but I'm not ready to say sitting here today that that will be the best thing for the team at that point. A lot can happen in that time. It depends on how Green ages in the next two years, how our prospects develop in the next two years, who we draft next year, who else is available via free agency at that time, if any trades are made in that time, etc...

I agree that one might be re-signed, but if one is, and I hope it's one at most, I'd hope it would be Green. There's also no saying that Green would be traded and Daley wouldn't.

We will need a lot of these kids to pan out, but I don't think it's much of a stretch to say that at least four of Hronek, Cholowski, McIsaac, Barton, Regula, Lindstrom, Kotkansalo, Sulak, Saarijarvi, Hicketts could develop into regular NHL defensemen. The problem is, none project to be high end top pair defenseman. We will need a little luck for any of them to exceed expectations, but I don't think that's out of the realm of possibility either. I'm not too concerned. We still have a couple drafts to nab a potential top pair (number one) defenseman, trades / free agency to improve the defense.

I think BOTH Green and Daley should be traded.  I don't think either of them are long term solutions to this team's defensive woes. If we can get an additional third rounder for Daley and a player/prospect/pick for Green.  It should be done.  Age catches up with players and I think both are headed in a downward trajectory.  Not that they are there now.  ...but by 20-21, I'm gonna go out there and say I'd rather have Trevor Daley (37) anchoring the third pairing with a youngster, than Mike Green (35) still pretending that it's 2015 and he's capable of putting up 45 points on the first or second pairing. 

...and it IS a problem.  None of those guys project to be high end top pairing defensemen.  If they're going to be good, but not going to be that -- TOP GUYS, then we need to assess this quickly and make moves to make us better.  Make a damn hockey trade.  Trade picks/prospects/players for other picks/prospects/players. It needs to be done.  We cannot afford to wait on a guy to possibly hit free agency.  We cannot afford to wait for the next generational talent to maybe just maybe if we suck just enough to fall into our laps.  Ken Holland needs to kick every tire available and then make some moves.

[kickazz 5,459]

1 hour ago, e_prime said:

That should have read Ericsson, Daley, and Green are here right now and would need to be resigned in 20-21. 

If we're trading away Green at the deadline and we also are trading Jensen and Daley... and literally, I don't care if all three go, immediately...  ...but if not them back there on the blueline, then whom?   That was my not well fleshed out thought/statement. 

Should any of them be re-signed then for 20-21.  No.    Do I think one might?  Yes, because Ken Holland is Ken Holland. Who do I think that player might be?  Trevor Daley.  1 year extension.  Over Mike Green -- because he will already be traded.

As I said before, I SHURE HOPE SUM DEM ROOOKIES IS GUD.  Because the above, while probably the reality we live in, sure does rely on a lot of luck.  While already implied, included in your outlook @kick should have been, "Beyond making the cut we have to consider it very lucky all three of Hronek, Cholo, and Hicketts steal jobs, get those 20+ games and ALL end up living up to or surpassing their prospect projections."

I don't like all of this luck that's involved.  Certainly, we NEED to draft the best defensive prospects we can over the course of the next couple years and hopefully that shot or a shot at another top forward prospect that could make other prospects or current roster players expendable in trades. Because we NEED to trade for better/ a top defensemen. We NEED to sign better UFA defensemen (when and if available) and we NEED to discard that chaff instead of holding onto hopes that they might pan out or are good enough.

If  really want another player that’s not a younginn then I would want us to get someone through free agency the way we got Mike Green. Some 30 year old that has about 2-3 years left of good hockey.

For example Pieterangelo is a UFA by then.

Like if the young players aren’t good enough then we gotta get a good defenseman thru free agency as they start becoming available. But resigning older dudes wouldn’t help.

Edited September 6, 2018 by kickazz

[e_prime 1,936]

14 minutes ago, kickazz said:

If  really want another player that’s not a younginn then I would want us to get someone in free agency the way we got Mike Green. Some 30 year old that has about 2-3 years left of good hockey.

For example Pieterangelo is a UFA by then.

...but you've still got to wrestle those players away from re-signing with their current team.  Will the Blues be ready to move on from Pietrangelo? Would Pietrangelo want to sign here with our current situation?

If you trade Green and/or Daley at the deadline this year, you're opening up yourself even more opportunities to snag a good player of Pietrangelo's calibre. The Tyler Myers', Anton Strahlman's (just examples) ...again... getting them to sign here will probably be a challenge which will cost both term and dollars.  Something we KNOW Ken Holland is keen on doing.  As long as he manages these things correctly and lets players go when they should go and trades them when they should be traded or have value.  I'm pretty okay with that too.

Edited September 6, 2018 by e_prime

[krsmith17 7,191]

16 minutes ago, e_prime said:

I think BOTH Green and Daley should be traded.  I don't think either of them are long term solutions to this team's defensive woes. If we can get an additional third rounder for Daley and a player/prospect/pick for Green.  It should be done.  Age catches up with players and I think both are headed in a downward trajectory.  Not that they are there now.  ...but by 20-21, I'm gonna go out there and say I'd rather have Trevor Daley (37) anchoring the third pairing with a youngster, than Mike Green (35) still pretending that it's 2015 and he's capable of putting up 45 points on the first or second pairing. 

...and it IS a problem.  None of those guys project to be high end top pairing defensemen.  If they're going to be good, but not going to be that -- TOP GUYS, then we need to assess this quickly and make moves to make us better.  Make a damn hockey trade.  Trade picks/prospects/players for other picks/prospects/players. It needs to be done.  We cannot afford to wait on a guy to possibly hit free agency.  We cannot afford to wait for the next generational talent to maybe just maybe if we suck just enough to fall into our laps.  Ken Holland needs to kick every tire available and then make some moves.

I agree. I've been advocating for this for years now.

18 minutes ago, kickazz said:

If  really want another player that’s not a younginn then I would want us to get someone through free agency the way we got Mike Green. Some 30 year old that has about 2-3 years left of good hockey.

For example Pieterangelo is a UFA by then.

Like if the young players aren’t good enough then we gotta get a good defenseman thru free agency as they start becoming available. But resigning older dudes wouldn’t help.

I agree, but I don't think there's any way a player of Pietrangelo caliber becomes available.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,014]

The Athletic: Most Intriguing Prospects to Watch at Every NHL Camp

Quote

Detroit: Joseph Veleno, C

Michael Rasmussen, Filip Zadina, and Filip Hronek are the Wings’ top prospects with realistic chances of making the opening day roster. The reason I’m mentioning Veleno is due to the fact he slid on draft day over concerns about his offensive potential, with many scouts I’ve talked to labeling him a third-line center at best. I think there’s a little more there, though. He’s shown it to be in flashes, and he’ll have a chip on his shoulder after what’s transpired in the summer. I’ll be curious to see if he can light the lamp a few times in the preseason.

This next one's for you @LeftWinger

Quote

Florida: Owen Tippett, RW

You couldn’t find anyone around the Panthers team last fall to say a negative thing about their 2017 first-round pick, as he made the team, albeit briefly, and looked dynamic during camp. However, after being sent back to the OHL, Tippett was very good but didn’t dominate as expected. He was a somewhat surprising cut from Canada’s U20 camp in December and a lot of scouts don’t have much time for his compete level. He has a lot to prove, but there’s a chance he breaks doors down and makes the team again.

 

[kickazz 5,459]

24 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

The Athletic: Most Intriguing Prospects to Watch at Every NHL Camp

This next one's for you @LeftWinger

 

EAT CROW @LeftWinger

[LeftWinger 4,961]

Nah, not yet. The article didn't say he was a bust, just a lot to prove.

I'll have a crow wing for me saying he was a Calder candidate last year. I'd say he may win it this year, but that'll be Zadina.

I'm still a fan of both him and Hague and hope they both make the NHL. I'd still love to have either of them in our organization. But, I am really pulling for Rasmussen to take off this year.

[Dabura 12,207]

18 hours ago, kickazz said:

The chance of landing him are about as good as you winning a fight against a certain pink fat ass tbh. 

Don't talk about Keith Tkachuk like that.

3 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

if a team comers asking about Daley this TDL, I definitely move him. Next TDL, Green. I don't see anybody asking about E, so let him play out his contract and then bid adieu.

Either way, NONE of those players can be on this team in October 2020.

I'm good with this.

[Dabura 12,207]

 

[krsmith17 7,191]

35 minutes ago, Dabura said:

 

WARNING: NSFW

[The 91 of Ryans 3,014]

HAWT DAMMMMMMM

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

40 minutes ago, Dabura said:

 

Jurco?

[Dabura 12,207]

2 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Jurco?

k

[The 91 of Ryans 3,014]

16 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Jurco?

a-hole!!

[e_prime 1,936]

59 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

WARNING: NSFW

FILTHY!