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SwedeLundin77

Andreas Athanasiou Officially Signed 2 yrs. $3M AAV

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Just now, F.Michael said:

And this is why I want someone else behind the bench (Bylsma would be a good start).

Blashill is nothing more than a Babcock wannabe.

I don't even have that big of an issue with Blash. He actually gives AA decent minutes now. Some people in the boards act like AA is worse than he actually is. From what I'm seeing this contract 3 million per year x2 speaks volumes about what the org thinks of AA's potential.  

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5 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

 

 

Damn, you might be worse at debating than Jonas.

 We had the 4th WORST offense in the league last year. You need to learn how to look up some stats and information. 

3 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Image result for scotty bowman stanley cup     Image result for mike babcock stanley cup

Too weak. Thanks for proving my point. Following players were allowed to excell at their strengths and didn't play a strong two way game. In fact 2 of them were known cherry pickers.   

8448091.jpg

 

 

544765afa237e_brendan_shanahan.jpg

 

45248c46472e501e7d893e0b08981e04.jpg

 

Edited by kickazz

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Just now, kickazz said:

Damn, you might be worse at debating than Jonas.

 We had the 4th WORST offense in the league last year. You need to learn how to look up some stats and information. 

NO.

So offense wins Cups? No.

https://pittsburghhockeynow.com/its-possible-to-win-a-stanley-cup-without-superstars-but-it-aint-easy/

The Los Angeles Kings won a pair of Stanley Cups (2012, 2014) with Anze Kopitar up front and Drew Doughty on the back. Doughty is considered one of the best defensemen in the game, and Kopitar is an annual Selke Trophy contender as best defensive forward. However, neither player is a generational talent. Los Angeles amassed as much shot blocking, physical, defensively responsible talent as the law allowed, then sprinkled in a few players like Marian Gaborik and Jeff Carter for just enough offense to win a pair of Cups.

In 2013-14, the Kings allowed the second-fewest Corsi-Against (shots/shot attempts). It was nearly impossible to score against them. It was the same story in 2011-12. In fact, in 2011-12, the Kings also scored the second-fewest goals. The didn’t drive their Corsi through the roof with puck possession; they did it by taking away space.

The 2010-11 Boston Bruins had Patrice Bergeron at center and Zdeno Chara on the blue line. They too were a physical, pounding bunch who won a Stanley Cup and advanced to another Stanley Cup Final by preventing their opponents from scoring and finding just enough offense. The 2011 Bruins had average regular season analytics but caught fire late in the season and steam-rolled through the playoffs.

Those teams didn’t have a prolific scorer like Patrick Kane or anything close to a Sidney Crosby. It’s debatable the Kings or Bruins Cup teams even had a “Phil Kessel” type scorer.

 

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13 minutes ago, kickazz said:

Damn, you might be worse at debating than Jonas.

 We had the 4th WORST offense in the league last year. You need to learn how to look up some stats and information. 

Too weak. Thanks for proving my point. Following players were allowed to excell at their strengths and didn't play a strong two way game. In fact 2 of them were known cherry pickers.   

8448091.jpg

 

 

544765afa237e_brendan_shanahan.jpg

 

45248c46472e501e7d893e0b08981e04.jpg

 

Hull? Yes. Shanny and Luc? No. They were also generational talents on STACKED teams. AA couldn't wear their jock straps. And this team now isnt very good. When AA is scoring 50 goals a season and 500+ for his career and the team is contending, he can float whenever he wants. But it will NEVER happen.

5 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

We'll never know until he gets though minutes.

Like Jurco. Mrazek, Smith......

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I'm just excited to have a future potential top 6 of:

Mantha-Larkin-Zadina 

AA-Rasmussen-Svechnikov

Barring trades or if we could actually get Jack Hughes.

3 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Hull? Yes. Shanny and Luc? No. They were also generational talents on STACKED teams. AA couldn't wear their jock straps. And this team now isnt very good. When AA is scoring 50 goals a season and 500+ for his career and the team is contending, he can float whenever he wants. But it will NEVER happen.

Like Jurco. Mrazek, Smith......

Jurco and Smith never had the electrifying game as AA has. Not a good comparison. 

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1 minute ago, LeftWinger said:

I'm just excited to have a future potential top 6 of:

Mantha-Larkin-Zadina 

AA-Rasmussen-Svechnikov

Barring trades or if we could actually get Jack Hughes.

Bertuzzi - Larkin - Mantha

Smith - Rass - Zadina

Most likely top 6 IMO.

AA - Veleno - Svech 3rd line. That spreads out the scoring over 3 lines.

 

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1 minute ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Bertuzzi - Larkin - Mantha

Smith - Rass - Zadina

Most likely top 6 IMO.

AA - Veleno - Svech 3rd line. That spreads out the scoring over 3 lines.

 

Those lines, no matter who gets the most minutes all look very, very good! 

Honestly though, I have a strange feeling that Berggren may be here within 3 years as well.

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10 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

I'm just excited to have a future potential top 6 of:

Mantha-Larkin-Zadina 

AA-Rasmussen-Svechnikov

Barring trades or if we could actually get Jack Hughes.

Jurco and Smith never had the electrifying game as AA has. Not a good comparison. 

I'll give u Smith. But Jurco and Mrazek were both electrifying players without a lot of skill. Pretty sure if I went back and looked, you yourself have said something to that effect

7 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

Those lines, no matter who gets the most minutes all look very, very good! 

Honestly though, I have a strange feeling that Berggren may be here within 3 years as well.

Yes. Forgot about him. Too early to know where to slot him tho.

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4 hours ago, kickazz said:

 If AA wants to run a breakaway play with Larkin then by all means let him. If he wants to pull a Hull and wait for a pass then by all means let him. He has the speed and acceleration for breakaways. THAT IS HIS STRENGTH. 

Of course he can. But then he's going to keep getting 15 minutes a night until he's traded in 2 years. 

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4 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

I'll give u Smith. But Jurco and Mrazek were both electrifying players without a lot of skill. Pretty sure if I went back and looked, you yourself have said something to that effect

Yes. Forgot about him. Too early to know where to slot him tho.

I was very high on Mrazek, that's for sure. 

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18 hours ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Hull? Yes. Shanny and Luc? No. They were also generational talents on STACKED teams. AA couldn't wear their jock straps. And this team now isnt very good. When AA is scoring 50 goals a season and 500+ for his career and the team is contending, he can float whenever he wants. But it will NEVER happen.

Like Jurco. Mrazek, Smith......

Shanahan was a notorious floater. Fedorov in his hall of fame interview said that Shanny used to talk to him privately to look for him in the opponent blue line for stretch passes. Look the interview up on youtube. That's why Shanahan loved played with Fedorov since Fedorov did it all and Shanahan just had to score.

 

18 hours ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Hull? Yes. Shanny and Luc? No. They were also generational talents on STACKED teams. AA couldn't wear their jock straps. And this team now isnt very good. When AA is scoring 50 goals a season and 500+ for his career and the team is contending, he can float whenever he wants. But it will NEVER happen.

Like Jurco. Mrazek, Smith......

Another weak argument. So because the team is bad, a player shouldn't play on his strength? Thankfully you're not the coach and Blash/Holland signed AA to a 2 year deal that you and others probably thought was overpaid.

4th worse offense in the league = need offense. AA should focus on offense as should Mantha. It would be different if our offense was middle of the pack. But we aren't. we're severely compromised on offense end of story. 

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19 hours ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

NO.

So offense wins Cups? No.

https://pittsburghhockeynow.com/its-possible-to-win-a-stanley-cup-without-superstars-but-it-aint-easy/

The Los Angeles Kings won a pair of Stanley Cups (2012, 2014) with Anze Kopitar up front and Drew Doughty on the back. Doughty is considered one of the best defensemen in the game, and Kopitar is an annual Selke Trophy contender as best defensive forward. However, neither player is a generational talent. Los Angeles amassed as much shot blocking, physical, defensively responsible talent as the law allowed, then sprinkled in a few players like Marian Gaborik and Jeff Carter for just enough offense to win a pair of Cups.

In 2013-14, the Kings allowed the second-fewest Corsi-Against (shots/shot attempts). It was nearly impossible to score against them. It was the same story in 2011-12. In fact, in 2011-12, the Kings also scored the second-fewest goals. The didn’t drive their Corsi through the roof with puck possession; they did it by taking away space.

The 2010-11 Boston Bruins had Patrice Bergeron at center and Zdeno Chara on the blue line. They too were a physical, pounding bunch who won a Stanley Cup and advanced to another Stanley Cup Final by preventing their opponents from scoring and finding just enough offense. The 2011 Bruins had average regular season analytics but caught fire late in the season and steam-rolled through the playoffs.

Those teams didn’t have a prolific scorer like Patrick Kane or anything close to a Sidney Crosby. It’s debatable the Kings or Bruins Cup teams even had a “Phil Kessel” type scorer.

 

Exactly my point. A few players like Anze Kopitar that took care of the two-way game much like Yzerman and Fedorov did in 2002 and Datsyuk and Zetterberg did in 2008. Meanwhile Hull put was left scoring goals as did Shanny. Franzen took care of the Avs in 08. Exactly why not everyone on this team needs to be a two-way forward. 

Larkin, Rasmussen, Helm, Abdelkader, Nielsen. Plenty of two-way forwards. Mantha, AA, and Zadina should be allowed to focus on offense at this point. 

Pittsburgh offense won 2 championships. FYI. They're defense was not nearly as good as their overall offense that season and even into the playoffs. They had the highest shot generation per game that season. 

Best shots per game state and middle of the pack in shots against per game in 2015/16.

The whole "offense wins games, defense wins championships" is a myth and something coaches teach little kids or heard in movies lol. 

What's hilarious is you've exposed yourself in at least 3 posts now with your insults towards AA. He's had 1 actual NHL season and somehow you've already judged him. Wat is it that you said? "AA couldn't wear their jock straps. And this team now isnt very good. When AA is scoring 50 goals a season and 500+ for his career and the team is contending, he can float whenever he wants. But it will NEVER happen."

Then you go to a middle ground and say "well i thin AA does have potential". Make up your mind. You're flip flopping more than your boy Trump has the last 3 years. 

AA hater alert. At least guys like Dabura simply want him to get better and think he has the potential for it. You're here saying s*** like "will NEVER happen". Cool. 

Edited by kickazz

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The notion that every player has to play a "200 foot game" infuriates me more than anything. We have a ton of two-way forwards that are great at both ends of the ice. Every team needs players that can sometimes cheat on offense. In saying that, Athanasiou is a player I'd like to see play a bit of a two-way game, because when he wants to, he can pickpocket as good as anyone in the league. I do think he's much better defensively than some are willing to give him credit for though.

If Athanasiou tops out as a 35-45 point, middle 6 winger, that's still good for us, and more than worth his current $3M x 2 year contract. I still think he has 45-55 point, top 6 winger potential though. And if he's doing that on a line with a defensively responsible center, and not negatively impacting the team, I'm more than happy with that sort of production out of a 4th round draft pick.

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4 hours ago, kickazz said:

Exactly my point. A few players like Anze Kopitar that took care of the two-way game much like Yzerman and Fedorov did in 2002 and Datsyuk and Zetterberg did in 2008. Meanwhile Hull put was left scoring goals as did Shanny. Franzen took care of the Avs in 08. Exactly why not everyone on this team needs to be a two-way forward. 

Larkin, Rasmussen, Helm, Abdelkader, Nielsen. Plenty of two-way forwards. Mantha, AA, and Zadina should be allowed to focus on offense at this point. 

Pittsburgh offense won 2 championships. FYI. They're defense was not nearly as good as their overall offense that season and even into the playoffs. They had the highest shot generation per game that season. 

Best shots per game state and middle of the pack in shots against per game in 2015/16.

The whole "offense wins games, defense wins championships" is a myth and something coaches teach little kids or heard in movies lol. 

What's hilarious is you've exposed yourself in at least 3 posts now with your insults towards AA. He's had 1 actual NHL season and somehow you've already judged him. Wat is it that you said? "AA couldn't wear their jock straps. And this team now isnt very good. When AA is scoring 50 goals a season and 500+ for his career and the team is contending, he can float whenever he wants. But it will NEVER happen."

Then you go to a middle ground and say "well i thin AA does have potential". Make up your mind. You're flip flopping more than your boy Trump has the last 3 years. 

AA hater alert. At least guys like Dabura simply want him to get better and think he has the potential for it. You're here saying s*** like "will NEVER happen". Cool. 

Did you even read the article? It clearly points out that teams who focus mostly on defense, keeping shots down, keeping scoring chances down, etc. are the ones who win. Their offense was totally secondary.

You do realize that that was 10 and 16 years ago, right? Not the same NHL today. Those teams were offensive juggernauts. The cup winning teams mentioned aren't built that way. Plus Hull and Shanny weren't noobs when they came to Detroit. They were already developed players. Totally different way of coaching. And yeah when you have guys that are that good offensively (AA is not), you probably get a little more leniency there. Plus those teams had much better defenses than this one. Forwards didn't have to cover for the D. In case you didn't notice, the D is the weakest link on this team. I would expect the forwards to help out more. Not re-inventing the wheel here.

How silly for coaches to instill a good work ethic into young players. And even more silly for them to coach in a way that clearly doesn't work. 

Yep. That's exactly what I said. If you think AA is comparable to a Hull, Shanny, or Robitaille, I won't even respond to that, just shake my head. I also said that AA scoring 50 goals a season or 500 for his career will NEVER happen because I don't think it will. DO YOU? Only 45 players in the history of the NHL have scored 500 or more goals. And no one has had a 50 goal season since 2015-16. Do YOU think he is capable of that? Seriously, he's that good? So, because I don't think AA is among the 5o best scorers of all time I am a hater? C'mon. I would say that makes me a realist.

He does have potential...to be a better player. He's a middle 6 F now, he has the POTENTIAL to be a 30 goal top 6 player IMO. 30 goal top 6 < top line elite scoring sniper. I said he was capable of the first, but not the second. That's not flip-flopping. It's an opinion, and a realistic one. Nothing more. If I didn't think he had potential, then why do I wish he would work on developing a more rounded game. If I truly thought he was a lost cause and he would never get any better, than why even argue for improvement? Makes no sense.

LOL.

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