mackel 679 Report post Posted May 9, 2019 55 minutes ago, krsmith17 said: You're going to look so dumb when Zadina pots 30 in a few years... Since that won't happen, I'm willing to chance it... it's just as likely he'll be playing the the Czech beer leagues by then. 1 amato reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted May 9, 2019 9 minutes ago, mackel said: Since that won't happen, I'm willing to chance it... it's just as likely he'll be playing the the Czech beer leagues by then. So dumb... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,953 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) On 5/9/2019 at 5:16 PM, mackel said: Worst case would be taking a one-dimensional player who is free falling in the draft and thinking you got a steal. AKA. A repeat of the 2018 draft. Edited January 7, 2021 by LeftWinger 1 mackel reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mackel 679 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 2 hours ago, krsmith17 said: So dumb... That was of course a bit of hyperbole, but I have no expectations of Zagina being an impactful player for us. It was a bad pick and all the waning signs were there... we should have drafted for our needs ie. The best available defenceman. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Euro_Twins 4,475 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 23 minutes ago, mackel said: That was of course a bit of hyperbole, but I have no expectations of Zagina being an impactful player for us. It was a bad pick and all the waning signs were there... we should have drafted for our needs ie. The best available defenceman. To whom are you referring? Hughes or Boqvist or Bouchard? We dont know how it will play out yet. Zadina will be a great player for us... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wheelchairsuperhero 1,453 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) 45 minutes ago, mackel said: That was of course a bit of hyperbole, but I have no expectations of Zagina being an impactful player for us. It was a bad pick and all the waning signs were there... we should have drafted for our needs ie. The best available defenceman. lol The way you believe this with such certainty despite a virtually unanimous opinion to the contrary is actually impressive. It's very reminiscent of watching an adolescent argue. Edited May 10, 2019 by Wheelchairsuperhero 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,953 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 1 hour ago, mackel said: That was of course a bit of hyperbole, but I have no expectations of Zagina being an impactful player for us. It was a bad pick and all the waning signs were there... we should have drafted for our needs ie. The best available defenceman. I think that nickname outdoes my Francine one for Franzen! Yikes! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 5 hours ago, derblaueClaus said: This. We need defense and badly. By the way Krebs means Cancer in German. You really want Cancer on this team?! I would have thought that Krebs means Crabs. Not sure that I would want Crabs on the team either. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mackel 679 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Wheelchairsuperhero said: lol The way you believe this with such certainty despite a virtually unanimous opinion to the contrary is actually impressive. It's very reminiscent of watching an adolescent argue. Dropping like a stone isn't a warning sign?? Opting to take a one-dimensional winger, who is the 1st round version of Martin Frk was a bad decision, especially when this team desperately needs as many top of the draft defensive prospects as possible. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 9 hours ago, mackel said: That was of course a bit of hyperbole, but I have no expectations of Zagina being an impactful player for us. That's because you're dumb... 9 hours ago, mackel said: It was a bad pick and all the waning signs were there... we should have drafted for our needs ie. The best available defenceman. You never draft for need that high in the draft. To do so, would be dumb... Zadina was the consensus best player available at 3, 4, 5 AND 6. To pass on him would have been dumb... 7 hours ago, mackel said: Dropping like a stone isn't a warning sign?? Like Neo said... 7 hours ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said: I didnt know that falling 3 spots in the draft was considered free falling "dropping like a stone"... Really good players "fall three spots" (or more) every single year in the draft. It's very common... 7 hours ago, mackel said: Opting to take a one-dimensional winger, who is the 1st round version of Martin Frk was a bad decision... You're literally the only person that thinks Zadina is a "one-dimensional winger". Every scout, hockey analyst, even coaches and our (previous) GM, have gone out of their way to speak highly on his "two-way" game. Zadina is a shoot first winger, which is something we're lacking, but he can also set up plays and is responsible defensively. 7 hours ago, mackel said: ... especially when this team desperately needs as many top of the draft defensive prospects as possible. Again, you do NOT draft for need that high in the draft EVER, unless you value two prospect (one forward and one defenseman) exactly the same, which is rarely the case. If the Red Wings brass were not that high on Zadina, they could have (would have) traded back and taken a defenseman. That clearly wasn't the case, and for good reason. Same thing this upcoming draft. Byram likely won't be available at 6, and York, Harley, Broberg or Soderstrom would be a reach. If the Red Wings aren't that high on Cozens, Dach, Krebs, Turcotte, Zegras, Caufield or Podkolzin, they may opt to trade back for one of the defenseman. That most certainly will not happen though, as one of those forwards available will assuredly be much higher on their list than any of the aforementioned defensemen... 2 1 BringBack19, Wheelchairsuperhero and Akakabuto reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BringBack19 110 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 11 minutes ago, krsmith17 said: That's because you're dumb... You never draft for need that high in the draft. To do so, would be dumb... Zadina was the consensus best player available at 3, 4, 5 AND 6. To pass on him would have been dumb... Like Neo said... Really good players "fall three spots" (or more) every single year in the draft. It's very common... You're literally the only person that thinks Zadina is a "one-dimensional winger". Every scout, hockey analyst, even coaches and our (previous) GM, have gone out of their way to speak highly on his "two-way" game. Zadina is a shoot first winger, which is something we're lacking, but he can also set up plays and is responsible defensively. Again, you do NOT draft for need that high in the draft EVER, unless you value two prospect (one forward and one defenseman) exactly the same, which is rarely the case. If the Red Wings brass were not that high on Zadina, they could have (would have) traded back and taken a defenseman. That clearly wasn't the case, and for good reason. Same thing this upcoming draft. Byram likely won't be available at 6, and York, Harley, Broberg or Soderstrom would be a reach. If the Red Wings aren't that high on Cozens, Dach, Krebs, Turcotte, Zegras, Caufield or Podkolzin, they may opt to trade back for one of the defenseman. That most certainly will not happen though, as one of those forwards available will assuredly be much higher on their list than any of the aforementioned defensemen... Bruce Arians said it best “You draft for need, you get fired.” 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 Maybe should have taken Q Hughes because I think he's the better prospect now, but he wasn't at the time, and the Zadina pick was also a good one. Dude's going to be more than fine. 1 Wheelchairsuperhero reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AtlantaHotWings 984 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 9 hours ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said: I would have thought that Krebs means Crabs. Not sure that I would want Crabs on the team either. Wings getting an itch in their pants for a cup...LOL Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 16 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: Maybe should have taken Q Hughes because I think he's the better prospect now, but he wasn't at the time, and the Zadina pick was also a good one. Dude's going to be more than fine. Key word there, "maybe". You can't say with any more certainty now that Hughes would have been a better pick, than saying Zadina was the better pick last June. I still say Zadina has a better chance at being a top line winger, than Hughes has at being a top pair defenseman, but we'll see... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Euro_Twins 4,475 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, krsmith17 said: Key word there, "maybe". You can't say with any more certainty now that Hughes would have been a better pick, than saying Zadina was the better pick last June. I still say Zadina has a better chance at being a top line winger, than Hughes has at being a top pair defenseman, but we'll see... That was my point when I asked to which defenseman he was referring. Since Hughes has seemingly become this far the best one drafted, but he wasnt "the best defenseman" available. So how do you know which one to pick? Unless you own a time machine. But I still firmly believe that this year zadina will take a big step forward whether it be in GR or Detroit.. but hey, we should have picked chychrun err.. Hughes, I mean boqvist.... ahhhhhh 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 24 minutes ago, Euro_Twins said: That was my point when I asked to which defenseman he was referring. Since Hughes has seemingly become this far the best one drafted, but he wasnt "the best defenseman" available. So how do you know which one to pick? Unless you own a time machine. But I still firmly believe that this year zadina will take a big step forward whether it be in GR or Detroit.. but hey, we should have picked chychrun err.. Hughes, I mean boqvist.... ahhhhhh I wanted Bouchard over Hughes last year (before Zadina dropped to us), and I still think he'll be the better defenseman of that draft, but who knows... No one knew for sure back then, and no one knows for sure now. Still way too early. It's all personal projections and guess work at this point. But yeah, I guess that's why it's so mind boggling that someone is so adamant that a 19 year old kid is undoubtedly going to be a bust... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 51 minutes ago, krsmith17 said: Key word there, "maybe". You can't say with any more certainty now that Hughes would have been a better pick, than saying Zadina was the better pick last June. I still say Zadina has a better chance at being a top line winger, than Hughes has at being a top pair defenseman, but we'll see... Hockey News latest issue has QHughes as a top three NHL affiliated prospect and Zadina at 7. (no link cuz they still want to sell paper) In his midseason rankings Pronman has QHughes at #1, Zadina at 4. Button's midseason rankings has QHughes at #8, Zadina at 17. I can't really find anyone who thinks, post-draft, that Zadina is a better prospect than QHughes. Just saying. All of this being said, the margin appears to be fairly slim, and there's a way to go yet for either guy. Like I said, I would have been happy with either pick. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Euro_Twins said: That was my point when I asked to which defenseman he was referring. Since Hughes has seemingly become this far the best one drafted, but he wasnt "the best defenseman" available. So how do you know which one to pick? Unless you own a time machine. But I still firmly believe that this year zadina will take a big step forward whether it be in GR or Detroit.. but hey, we should have picked chychrun err.. Hughes, I mean boqvist.... ahhhhhh I think you mean Tippett, I mean Vilardi, I mean............ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 20 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said: Hockey News latest issue has QHughes as a top three NHL affiliated prospect and Zadina at 7. (no link cuz they still want to sell paper) In his midseason rankings Pronman has QHughes at #1, Zadina at 4. Button's midseason rankings has QHughes at #8, Zadina at 17. I can't really find anyone who thinks, post-draft, that Zadina is a better prospect than QHughes. Just saying. All of this being said, the margin appears to be fairly slim, and there's a way to go yet for either guy. Like I said, I would have been happy with either pick. I'm well aware of the rankings. It still means absolutely nothing at this point. Is it possible that Quinn Hughes becomes a better player than Filip Zadina in 3+ years from now? Absolutely. Is it possible that Filip Zadina becomes a better prospect than Quinn Hughes in 3+ years from now? Absolutely. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 2 minutes ago, krsmith17 said: I'm well aware of the rankings. It still means absolutely nothing at this point. Is it possible that Quinn Hughes becomes a better player than Filip Zadina in 3+ years from now? Absolutely. Is it possible that Filip Zadina becomes a better prospect than Quinn Hughes in 3+ years from now? Absolutely. So who's the better prospect? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,953 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 3 hours ago, krsmith17 said: You never draft for need that high in the draft. To do so, would be dumb... Zadina was the consensus best player available at 3, 4, 5 AND 6. To pass on him would have been dumb... Really good players "fall three spots" (or more) every single year in the draft. It's very common... You're literally the only person that thinks Zadina is a "one-dimensional winger". Every scout, hockey analyst, even coaches and our (previous) GM, have gone out of their way to speak highly on his "two-way" game. Zadina is a shoot first winger, which is something we're lacking, but he can also set up plays and is responsible defensively. Again, you do NOT draft for need that high in the draft EVER, unless you value two prospect (one forward and one defenseman) exactly the same, which is rarely the case. But was it ok to draft for need in 2017? Rasmussen was NOT the best player available at that spot. Holland drafted him because he was looking for a PP/Net Front Player. He drafted him for need. Not arguing Zadina, but just saying... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 26 minutes ago, LeftWinger said: But was it ok to draft for need in 2017? Rasmussen was NOT the best player available at that spot. Holland drafted him because he was looking for a PP/Net Front Player. He drafted him for need. Not arguing Zadina, but just saying... The Red Wings never said they drafted Rasmussen based on need Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 4 hours ago, krsmith17 said: Zadina was the consensus best player available at 3, 4, 5 AND 6. To pass on him would have been dumb.. Really good players "fall three spots" (or more) every single year in the draft. It's very common... You're literally the only person that thinks Zadina is a "one-dimensional winger". Every scout, hockey analyst, even coaches and our (previous) GM, have gone out of their way to speak highly on his "two-way" game. Zadina is a shoot first winger, which is something we're lacking, but he can also set up plays and is responsible defensively. Zadina didnt actually drop. Just before the draft, everyone knew Dahlin and Svechnikov were going 1-2. Montreal was taking Kotkaniemi at 3. Again, everyone knew. The only deviation was that everyone expected Ottawa and Arizona to take Zadina and Tkachuk with their picks, because that was the consensus top 5 players in the draft. Noone expected AZ to take Hayton (including Holland). That's why Zadina was there at 6. Arizona went off the reservation (pun intended) drafting for need with a guy noone had in the top 10. You can't say Zadina "dropped like a stone" in that context. You can't fault him in anyway for AZ making a bad decision (IMO). Every analyst had him going top 5 ( to my knowledge). He went 6th. I don't get the criticism. 2 BringBack19 and krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 1 hour ago, The 91 of Ryans said: So who's the better prospect? Not sure if serious... 1 hour ago, LeftWinger said: But was it ok to draft for need in 2017? Rasmussen was NOT the best player available at that spot. Holland drafted him because he was looking for a PP/Net Front Player. He drafted him for need. Not arguing Zadina, but just saying... In my opinion, no it was not okay to pick Rasmussen at 9 in 2017. I believe they reached when better players were still on the board. That has nothing to do with what happened in 2018 though... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The 91 of Ryans 3,014 Report post Posted May 10, 2019 4 minutes ago, krsmith17 said: Not sure if serious... In my opinion, no it was not okay to pick Rasmussen at 9 in 2017. I believe they reached when better players were still on the board. That has nothing to do with what happened in 2018 though... I'm asking you who you think the best prospect is between Zadina and QHughes. What's there to be coy about? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
