2019 Offseason Rebuild Thread, Pt. 2 - What's the Yzerplan?

[Jonas Mahonas 1,872]

8 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

Only person I'd acquire this offseason is Ryan Callahan.  Take him for a year, get the pick/prospect, and leave the UFAs for next year when we sign Trouba.  Callahan can have Vanek's spot, Witkowski, and Frk will be gone and there's not harm in keeping Ehn down/waiving De La Rose if we really really want some combination of Zadina, Rasmussen, or Svech up this year. Lottery pick here we come baby!

 

What does Tampa have to give us?

[kipwinger 8,521]

1 minute ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

What does Tampa have to give us?

Not too familiar with their prospect pool, I've heard some people mention Raddysh and Barre-Boulet but I don't know enough about them to say.  I know their farm system is weak, and they've traded a lot of picks in recent years, so maybe trade one of our 2nd rounders plus whatever throw in is necessary to make the deal work, for Callahan and one of their better prospects.  But again, I don't know their farm too well. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

25 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

Only person I'd acquire this offseason is Ryan Callahan.  Take him for a year, get the pick/prospect, and leave the UFAs for next year when we sign Trouba.  Callahan can have Vanek's spot, Witkowski, and Frk will be gone and there's not harm in keeping Ehn down/waiving De La Rose if we really really want some combination of Zadina, Rasmussen, or Svech up this year. Lottery pick here we come baby!

Yeah, pretty much the only trade *acquisition* I'd like to make as well. I would be trying to ship out a player or two if possible though. Daley would be my first choice to move.

I do think Witkowski will be back as the 13th forward / 7th defenseman though, which I'm fine with.

[krsmith17 7,191]

27 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

What does Tampa have to give us?

Raddysh or Foote is who I'd be targeting. I'd be thrilled with either.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

$20 mil in cap space?
Needs Dmen?
Superstar Dman hitting the open market?

Gibs me one Karlsson plz

[Dabura 12,207]

24 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Raddysh or Foote is who I'd be targeting. I'd be thrilled with either.

Yep.

Feels like if you want Foote then you're going to have to be willing to work out a deal that goes beyond just the cap dump thing and probably sees us parting with a significant asset. The Bolts are really high on Foote, and for good reason. Unless they land Karlsson, I dunno that they can afford to part with their top D prospect.

Raddysh could probably be had for, like, a 2nd + taking on Callahan.

[Buppy 1,720]

I don't get why everyone thinks we should be awful again next year. I'm sick of it personally, I want to get back in the playoffs. We have some good young players, and promising prospects who could potentially be impact players as early as next year. Add a couple UFAs to shore up some weaknesses and I think we could be competitive.

Not a huge Karlsson fan; despite his individual ability he doesn't seem to have that much impact on his teams. Gardiner or Myers could maybe be decent on the right contract, but a trade would be a better way to add a defenseman. Brodie would be good if he's actually available. Gost moving seems more likely now with Philly getting Niskanen. Trouba obviously.

At forward I'd love to add Panarin. Probably not really worth what he's likely to get, but I think we're in a good enough spot that overpaying him wouldn't hurt us. I don't know if we could get him or not, but I'd sure try. Several other forwards who could at least add to our depth, and make for a better situation for any prospects we bring up.  Let TB solve their Callahan problem themselves. He's worse than Abdelkader. I'd be willing to "help" Toronto with Marleau for the right price, though, since he's still a decent depth scorer. We only have 8 proven NHL forwards right now, and 4 of them are Neilsen, Helm, Abby, and Glendening. More than enough room to add one or two without taking anything from our top prospects. And that's without trading anyone.

If we think we need a high 2020 pick to turn us around, we should just give up on this rebuild and stop wasting time. Trade Mantha, AA, Bert, and whatever else for as many picks as we can get. 

[Jonas Mahonas 1,872]

21 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

$20 mil in cap space?
Needs Dmen?
Superstar Dman hitting the open market?

Gibs me one Karlsson plz

Yah, Karlsson + Troiba + Broberg and our D and season outlook change completely.

Karlsson-DeKeyser

Trouba-Broberg

Hronek-Cholowski

 

Yes please.

 

[krsmith17 7,191]

14 minutes ago, Dabura said:

Yep.

Feels like if you want Foote then you're going to have to be willing to work out a deal that goes beyond just the cap dump thing and probably sees us parting with a significant asset. The Bolts are really high on Foote, and for good reason. Unless they land Karlsson, I dunno that they can afford to part with their top D prospect.

Raddysh could probably be had for, like, a 2nd + taking on Callahan.

Nah, I dont think it would be that costly for either. If they really want to trade Callahan's contract, it's going to cost them...

I think it would be more like...

To DET: Callahan, Raddysh, 2019 3rd round pick (TBL)

To TBL: 2019 2nd round pick (SJS)

OR

To DET: Callahan, Foote

To TBL: 2019 2nd round pick (DET), 2020 3rd round pick (WSH)

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

2 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

Better? Yes. $3.5M per season better? I don't think so. I'd take Trouba at 20 less points per season and his better defensive game, along with the cap savings, durability and youth over Karlsson.

Sure, in theory we could get both, but I don't see how you fit both under the cap long term, with Mantha, Athanasiou and Bertuzzi among others due for new contracts in the next few seasons.

IF 100% healthy, you're probably right. The problem is, he hasn't been, and I doubt he will be as he gets older.

First I don’t think AA will be here longterm I don’t invision it especially if he gets 30 again , we had a hard time negotiating with him and I can totally see it happening again and yzerman would cut him in a heart beat , think mantha would be bigger priority to resign and he should 

plus we’ll have the 6th pick and who knows who else in the 2nd rd,zadina ,veleno etc... we have a ton of kids who’ll fill up the top 6 lines no problem

 

The thing with Karlsson is he’s got hockey smarts on the offensive side and will always be a force, especially on the ppl he will get his 60-75 pts , he’s 29 not dead, as long as he takes care of himself which more athletes do these days he should be productive at 35. Burns was 33 and got like 80 pts I love Brent burns but there’s no way he’s a better offensive defensemen than Karlsson, I think 100% he’ll still put up big numbers as well , giordano 35 yrs old 70+ I’m sorry no way he’s better ... your concerned about the injuries and that’s fine I’m not as much, if he plays 60-70 and is ready for the playoffs that’s all that matters to me 

2 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

What does Tampa have to give us?

Don’t want any prospects , they won’t give us Foote and not too interested in anyone else. If we can land the 27th for the 60th or 66th and some other picks or lower assets involved and we somehow ended up with a John beecher I’d be pumped with that alone 

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

30 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Nah, I dont think it would be that costly for either. If they really want to trade Callahan's contract, it's going to cost them...

I think it would be more like...

To DET: Callahan, Raddysh, 2019 3rd round pick (TBL)

To TBL: 2019 2nd round pick (SJS)

OR

To DET: Callahan, Foote

To TBL: 2019 2nd round pick (DET), 2020 3rd round pick (WSH)

Foote is a nice pipe dream but there’s zero chance Tampa will involve trading away a 14th overall pick in Foote , he’s gonna be one of the younger future dmen of the team learning from hedman etc..  if worse comes to worse they’d just offer the 2020 2nd and Callahan and someone will bite on it 100% 

 

if they said its it’s that or nothing to Holland I’d do it but I’d try and get the 27th for 60 or 66th and maybe like a 4th or 5th in 2020 and send back like delarose or something on the lower end if we have to add 

39 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Yah, Karlsson + Troiba + Broberg and our D and season outlook change completely.

Karlsson-DeKeyser

Trouba-Broberg

Hronek-Cholowski

 

Yes please.

 

Where’s broberg coming from? Zero chance we take him at #6 

1 hour ago, Dabura said:

Yep.

Feels like if you want Foote then you're going to have to be willing to work out a deal that goes beyond just the cap dump thing and probably sees us parting with a significant asset. The Bolts are really high on Foote, and for good reason. Unless they land Karlsson, I dunno that they can afford to part with their top D prospect.

Raddysh could probably be had for, like, a 2nd + taking on Callahan.

Ya Foote isn’t happening at all , rather keep the second over raddysh and try and land a kotchekov,fagemo,holmstrom,kolyachonok,thrun,struble ... someone with upside don’t wanna have to give up a 2nd round pick for a forward when we already have a ton of forwards with potential coming real soon + the 6th pick , Foote different story but I don’t see them trading him at all 

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

43 minutes ago, Buppy said:

I don't get why everyone thinks we should be awful again next year. I'm sick of it personally, I want to get back in the playoffs. We have some good young players, and promising prospects who could potentially be impact players as early as next year. Add a couple UFAs to shore up some weaknesses and I think we could be competitive.

Not a huge Karlsson fan; despite his individual ability he doesn't seem to have that much impact on his teams. Gardiner or Myers could maybe be decent on the right contract, but a trade would be a better way to add a defenseman. Brodie would be good if he's actually available. Gost moving seems more likely now with Philly getting Niskanen. Trouba obviously.

At forward I'd love to add Panarin. Probably not really worth what he's likely to get, but I think we're in a good enough spot that overpaying him wouldn't hurt us. I don't know if we could get him or not, but I'd sure try. Several other forwards who could at least add to our depth, and make for a better situation for any prospects we bring up.  Let TB solve their Callahan problem themselves. He's worse than Abdelkader. I'd be willing to "help" Toronto with Marleau for the right price, though, since he's still a decent depth scorer. We only have 8 proven NHL forwards right now, and 4 of them are Neilsen, Helm, Abby, and Glendening. More than enough room to add one or two without taking anything from our top prospects. And that's without trading anyone.

If we think we need a high 2020 pick to turn us around, we should just give up on this rebuild and stop wasting time. Trade Mantha, AA, Bert, and whatever else for as many picks as we can get. 

This is just the impatience talking , 2020 is going to be an unreal draft I wouldn’t be pissed at all if we didnt make any moves outside of taking bad contracts like Callahan and getting a top 5 pick , we have a great draft this season along with 2020 and the 2020-2021 season we’ll be scaring a lot of teams and be on a huge upswing 

it sucks nlt being in the playoffs but it sucks more to get in every year for 25-30 years and getting outed yearly and getting 19th overall , we need some top A prospects 

[Buppy 1,720]

12 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

This is just the impatience talking , 2020 is going to be an unreal draft I wouldn’t be pissed at all if we didnt make any moves outside of taking bad contracts like Callahan and getting a top 5 pick , we have a great draft this season along with 2020 and the 2020-2021 season we’ll be scaring a lot of teams and be on a huge upswing 

it sucks nlt being in the playoffs but it sucks more to get in every year for 25-30 years and getting outed yearly and getting 19th overall , we need some top A prospects 

Impatient maybe, but we're about to make our 3rd top-10 pick. Our current best young players were all drafted while we were still a playoff team. Even without making any moves we could end up picking in the 10-20 range, if a couple more kids step up. 

If what we have already; Larkin, Mantha, AA, Bert, Ras, Zadina, Veleno, Hronek, Cholowski, McIssaac, whatever fringe prospects you want to include, the 6th OA, 4 more picks from 35-66, + whoever I'm forgetting; isn't enough then I don't think picking 5th instead of 19th in 2020 is going to fix anything. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

29 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

The thing with Karlsson is he’s got hockey smarts on the offensive side and will always be a force, especially on the ppl he will get his 60-75 pts , he’s 29 not dead, as long as he takes care of himself which more athletes do these days he should be productive at 35. Burns was 33 and got like 80 pts I love Brent burns but there’s no way he’s a better offensive defensemen than Karlsson, I think 100% he’ll still put up big numbers as well , giordano 35 yrs old 70+ I’m sorry no way he’s better ... your concerned about the injuries and that’s fine I’m not as much, if he plays 60-70 and is ready for the playoffs that’s all that matters to me 

Burns is also a freak of a human being and hasn't missed a game in over 5 years. Again, not even close to a similar situation.

52 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

 Don’t want any prospects , they won’t give us Foote and not too interested in anyone else. If we can land the 27th for the 60th or 66th and some other picks or lower assets involved and we somehow ended up with a John beecher I’d be pumped with that alone 

Taylor Raddysh > John Beecher

45 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

Foote is a nice pipe dream but there’s zero chance Tampa will involve trading away a 14th overall pick in Foote , he’s gonna be one of the younger future dmen of the team learning from hedman etc..  if worse comes to worse they’d just offer the 2020 2nd and Callahan and someone will bite on it 100% 

I'm sure you would have said Teuvo Teravainen would have been a "pipe dream" in the Bryam Bickell trade too. It's probably unlikely that BriseBois would want to part with Foote, but I doubt he's untouchable. He's a high end prospect that I would like to add to the system, but I doubt he's that number one defenseman we're looking for.

53 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

Ya Foote isn’t happening at all , rather keep the second over raddysh and try and land a kotchekov,fagemo,holmstrom,kolyachonok,thrun,struble ... someone with upside don’t wanna have to give up a 2nd round pick for a forward when we already have a ton of forwards with potential coming real soon + the 6th pick , Foote different story but I don’t see them trading him at all 

The chance of any of those players being better than Raddysh is slim, and the chance of the one we pick being better than Raddysh is even smaller. You take the known over the unknown every time.

[LeftWinger 4,951]

imagine this place if next summer Krug and Trouba pull a Suter, Parise and both come home to play!

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

1 hour ago, Buppy said:

Impatient maybe, but we're about to make our 3rd top-10 pick. Our current best young players were all drafted while we were still a playoff team. Even without making any moves we could end up picking in the 10-20 range, if a couple more kids step up. 

If what we have already; Larkin, Mantha, AA, Bert, Ras, Zadina, Veleno, Hronek, Cholowski, McIssaac, whatever fringe prospects you want to include, the 6th OA, 4 more picks from 35-66, + whoever I'm forgetting; isn't enough then I don't think picking 5th instead of 19th in 2020 is going to fix anything. 

I wouldn’t put too much stock into Rasmussen at #9 , we might have had 3 top 10 picks, (one which we haven’t even picked yet) but zero cracks at a top 3 let alone top 5 which is where the game changers are, our current best players and how’s that working out for us ? Doesn’t work out  when we have a handful of good players that weee drafted with us getting in since like 2010 and the rest are pretty much scrubs, we had a great 2018 draft when we didn’t get in and we should again in 2019 this is what we need as tough as it is , 2017 draft was basically a crapshoot 

veleno,zadina,mcisaac haven’t even played one nhl game and cholowski and hronek are still young and learning , Same can be said about the 2019 picks who haven’t even been drafted yet you need to be patient 

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

2 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

Burns is also a freak of a human being and hasn't missed a game in over 5 years. Again, not even close to a similar situation.

Taylor Raddysh > John Beecher

I'm sure you would have said Teuvo Teravainen would have been a "pipe dream" in the Bryam Bickell trade too. It's probably unlikely that BriseBois would want to part with Foote, but I doubt he's untouchable. He's a high end prospect that I would like to add to the system, but I doubt he's that number one defenseman we're looking for.

The chance of any of those players being better than Raddysh is slim, and the chance of the one we pick being better than Raddysh is even smaller. You take the known over the unknown every time.

Freak of nature ha , you realize outside of last season Karlsson has played 70+ a season you seem to have this inexplicable hate for the guy, your right it’s not even close to a similar situation he’s 4 years younger and his ppg is  better than burns

Beecher = beecher 

Foote is basically the only d they have in the pipeline like the last 5+ years that was drafted within the first 3 rounds , it’s nice to think we’d have a shot but it won’t happen, especially not to get rid of a contract 

You take the known over the unknown any day? If that’s the case there would never be steals in trades between teams , it’s called scouting and doing your due diligence, what’s so known about raddysh?last Ive checked he played 0 nhl games and was drafted 58 what makes him such a good player? 40 pts in the ahl?

 

Lots of guys get 40 pts and become nothing , hosang got 36 pts in 50 games and became nothing but this raddysh is such a known commodity , if he is Tampa won’t give him away for one year of Callahan , if they threw him in so easily I’d be thinking twice about making that deal 

 

Edited June 15, 2019 by nyqvististhefuture

[krsmith17 7,191]

3 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

Freak of nature ha , you realize outside of last season Karlsson has played 70+ a season you seem to have this inexplicable hate for the guy, your right it’s not even close to a similar situation he’s 4 years younger and his ppg is  better than burns

Karlsson has endured several different injuries, significant one's in my opinion over the past two seasons. That's (part of the reason) why I don't want him, not because I have "inexplicable hate for the guy"...

Why does it matter if he's 4 years younger? The point of YOU bringing him up was to show where Karlsson could be in 4 years...

10 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

 Foote is basically the only d they have in the pipeline like the last 5+ years that was drafted within the first 3 rounds , it’s nice to think we’d have a shot but it won’t happen, especially not to get rid of a contract 

Vegas acquired Shea Theodore from Anaheim in order to protect Sami Vatanen in the expansion draft. Not the exact same situation, but similar to a salary dump. Theodore was arguably a better prospect at the time than Foote is now as well.

GM's do dumb things when their backs are up against the wall. BriseBois has to move that Callahan contract. Again, I'm not saying it's likely they give up Foote, but it's certainly not impossible. MUCH stranger trades have happened.

18 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

You take the known over the unknown any day? If that’s the case there would never be steals in trades between teams , it’s called scouting and doing your due diligence, what’s so known about raddysh?last Ive checked he played 0 nhl games and was drafted 58 what makes him such a good player? 40 pts in the ahl?

Lots of guys get 40 pts and become nothing , hosang got 36 pts in 50 games and became nothing but this raddysh is such a known commodity , if he is Tampa won’t give him away for one year of Callahan , if they threw him in so easily I’d be thinking twice about making that deal 

What are you taking about?... Taylor Raddysh was drafted 3 years ago, and just finished his first pro season. He put up a very respectable 46 points in 70 games. John Beecher has yet to be drafted. So yes, Raddysh is a much more well known commodity than Beecher...

Lots of guys put up 40 points and become solid top 6 wingers too... What's your point??? Mantha put up 33 points in 62 games and he seems to be doing alright... Again, what's your point???

[Buppy 1,720]

29 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Karlsson has endured several different injuries, significant one's in my opinion over the past two seasons. That's (part of the reason) why I don't want him, not because I have "inexplicable hate for the guy"...

Not to advocate for Karlsson, but this injury thing is being vastly overstated.

In 10 years he's had 3 significant injuries: Groin this year, broken foot/ankle at the end of 16/17 (recovery from surgery caused him to miss first 5 games of 17-18, but he did not actually have any injuries that year), and a cut achilles in 2013. 324 consecutive games played between the achilles and the broken foot. It's not like he has chronic, recurring injuries. Trouba has 3 significant injuries in 6 seasons.

 

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

Karlsson has endured several different injuries, significant one's in my opinion over the past two seasons. That's (part of the reason) why I don't want him, not because I have "inexplicable hate for the guy"...

Why does it matter if he's 4 years younger? The point of YOU bringing him up was to show where Karlsson could be in 4 years...

Vegas acquired Shea Theodore from Anaheim in order to protect Sami Vatanen in the expansion draft. Not the exact same situation, but similar to a salary dump. Theodore was arguably a better prospect at the time than Foote is now as well.

GM's do dumb things when their backs are up against the wall. BriseBois has to move that Callahan contract. Again, I'm not saying it's likely they give up Foote, but it's certainly not impossible. MUCH stranger trades have happened.

What are you taking about?... Taylor Raddysh was drafted 3 years ago, and just finished his first pro season. He put up a very respectable 46 points in 70 games. John Beecher has yet to be drafted. So yes, Raddysh is a much more well known commodity than Beecher...

Lots of guys put up 40 points and become solid top 6 wingers too... What's your point??? Mantha put up 33 points in 62 games and he seems to be doing alright... Again, what's your point???

Yet outside this seasons 53 games he’s played 71+ every season , the fact of bringing up he’s 4 years younger is to say if burns at 33 can be this productive Karlsson sure as s*** will be

 

and you don’t think teams saw what Vegas did and learned? There’s already talk of how Seattle will get f***ed over now cause teams saw what happened with Vegas and won’t make the same mistake , many strange things have happened but trading Foote to get rid of Callahan with one year deal left has a zero % chance of happening, now if your talking a hockey trade Foote for a young d prospect or a 1st or an impact player coming back that’s a different story 

 

not sure if you saw the world juniors and seen beecher play but the kids got huge upside and I’m sure  if you’d ask Ppl in the hockey world they’d say they’d pick beecher if they had to pick between one or the other , so what that raddysh was drafted 3 years ago and finished first pro season and got 40 pts? We suppose to be exited now?pretty sure beecher would be more we’ll known around the hockey circles than raddysh

What makes this kid such a special prospect that you keep insisting we ask for him , if he’s that good surely Tampa would decline , I haven’t seen you say anything you like about him just that you keep insisting we demand this kid in a trade and I just can’t understand why , anyways it’s your perogative to like who you like I’d personally try and flip a pick and get the 27th if we can 

 

Edited June 15, 2019 by nyqvististhefuture

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

11 minutes ago, Buppy said:

Not to advocate for Karlsson, but this injury thing is being vastly overstated.

In 10 years he's had 3 significant injuries: Groin this year, broken foot/ankle at the end of 16/17 (recovery from surgery caused him to miss first 5 games of 17-18, but he did not actually have any injuries that year), and a cut achilles in 2013. 324 consecutive games played between the achilles and the broken foot. It's not like he has chronic, recurring injuries. Trouba has 3 significant injuries in 6 seasons.

 

Wish more people would say it

[Buppy 1,720]

1 hour ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

I wouldn’t put too much stock into Rasmussen at #9 , we might have had 3 top 10 picks, (one which we haven’t even picked yet) but zero cracks at a top 3 let alone top 5 which is where the game changers are, our current best players and how’s that working out for us ? Doesn’t work out  when we have a handful of good players that weee drafted with us getting in since like 2010 and the rest are pretty much scrubs, we had a great 2018 draft when we didn’t get in and we should again in 2019 this is what we need as tough as it is , 2017 draft was basically a crapshoot 

veleno,zadina,mcisaac haven’t even played one nhl game and cholowski and hronek are still young and learning , Same can be said about the 2019 picks who haven’t even been drafted yet you need to be patient 

You're kind of missing the point. What we have is what we have. Our first pick in 2020 is only going to be one piece, and it is extremely unlikely that he will be someone so good as to dramatically change our fortunes. Even without adding any UFAs I'd say we're much more likely to pick later than 6th than in the top 3, and even if we did get a top 3, it's more likely that player would be another Larkin than another McDavid. 

We've been patient. (Some of us at least.) Years of slow decline and then three lottery years. I don't want to be "patient" if that means deliberately keeping the team s***ty enough for however long it takes to actually win a lottery. Holland left us with a bunch of good young players and prospects, and in fantastic position cap-wise. It's time to start moving back up the ranks. Not saying we need to win the Cup, or make a deep run, or even make the playoffs. Just that the playoffs should be a reasonable goal to shoot for. We have room and we have cap space. If there's players we can get that fill our holes, and don't cost anything but that, we should try to get them. The future has already started. No more waiting.

[nyqvististhefuture 1,002]

5 minutes ago, Buppy said:

You're kind of missing the point. What we have is what we have. Our first pick in 2020 is only going to be one piece, and it is extremely unlikely that he will be someone so good as to dramatically change our fortunes. Even without adding any UFAs I'd say we're much more likely to pick later than 6th than in the top 3, and even if we did get a top 3, it's more likely that player would be another Larkin than another McDavid. 

We've been patient. (Some of us at least.) Years of slow decline and then three lottery years. I don't want to be "patient" if that means deliberately keeping the team s***ty enough for however long it takes to actually win a lottery. Holland left us with a bunch of good young players and prospects, and in fantastic position cap-wise. It's time to start moving back up the ranks. Not saying we need to win the Cup, or make a deep run, or even make the playoffs. Just that the playoffs should be a reasonable goal to shoot for. We have room and we have cap space. If there's players we can get that fill our holes, and don't cost anything but that, we should try to get them. The future has already started. No more waiting.

All depends where we obviously draft in 2020, there’s a ton of amazing kids next year lafraniere,Raymond,holtz,lundell,byfield,the Russian goalie who’s name escapes me plus more guys , very deep draft ... one of those pieces plus the pieces in this draft and what we already have is what will change our fortunes , we need to stockpile top assets 

well hopefully we win the lottery and go from 6 to 2 or something like that , and maybe we don’t get a mcdavid but a draisaitl , or another Larkin .... having 2 Larkin’s on the same team + zadina etc.. wouldn’t be such a bad thing 

i don’t wanna be patient forever but I’m willing to go till next year if it means not being a bottom team for another 20-30 years ,I don’t wanna just toy with playoffs every year I want our team to dominate, Holland didn’t leave us with as many high end talent as you’d like to think , and he also left us with a bunch of horrible contracts 

every team that isn’t a cup contenders goal is to make the playoffs , I wanna aim higher, if zadina plays full time he’ll still be a rookie and good chances Rasmussen and cholowski start down so we’ll basically have one stud line and then AA (and who knows if he’ll get 30 again) in the top 6 ?hirose had a nice end to the season but he’d still be a rookie so who knows how he would be in a full season , a lot of question marks still and not enough overall high end skill and our overall defense right now is still brutal so I wouldn’t be expecting us to be competing for a spot March/April 

[Buppy 1,720]

41 minutes ago, nyqvististhefuture said:

All depends where we obviously draft in 2020, there’s a ton of amazing kids next year lafraniere,Raymond,holtz,lundell,byfield,the Russian goalie who’s name escapes me plus more guys , very deep draft ... one of those pieces plus the pieces in this draft and what we already have is what will change our fortunes , we need to stockpile top assets 

well hopefully we win the lottery and go from 6 to 2 or something like that , and maybe we don’t get a mcdavid but a draisaitl , or another Larkin .... having 2 Larkin’s on the same team + zadina etc.. wouldn’t be such a bad thing 

i don’t wanna be patient forever but I’m willing to go till next year if it means not being a bottom team for another 20-30 years ,I don’t wanna just toy with playoffs every year I want our team to dominate, Holland didn’t leave us with as many high end talent as you’d like to think , and he also left us with a bunch of horrible contracts 

every team that isn’t a cup contenders goal is to make the playoffs , I wanna aim higher, if zadina plays full time he’ll still be a rookie and good chances Rasmussen and cholowski start down so we’ll basically have one stud line and then AA (and who knows if he’ll get 30 again) in the top 6 ?hirose had a nice end to the season but he’d still be a rookie so who knows how he would be in a full season , a lot of question marks still and not enough overall high end skill and our overall defense right now is still brutal so I wouldn’t be expecting us to be competing for a spot March/April 

That's some very inconsistent logic. You think we're going to pick someone in 2020 who will make us dominant and a playoff team for 20-30 years (longer than he will even be on the roster), yet the same team just with a later 2020 pick can only toy with the playoffs. It doesn't make any sense.

It doesn't matter how good or bad you think our current team and prospects are/will be. One player, no matter how good, is not going to be the difference between dominating and mediocre. Even if by some miracle we did end up winning the lottery .vs picking 20th, it wouldn't, and again the odds of 1st OA, or even top-3 are very slim. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

6 hours ago, Buppy said:

Not to advocate for Karlsson, but this injury thing is being vastly overstated.

It may seem like it's being vastly overstated because that's what's currently being discussed. However, the injury concerns is just one small part of why I don't want to sign Karlsson. The biggest reason I don't want to sign him is that he's 4 years older and closing in on his prime years. Trouba is in that same age range as the rest of our young core.

Speaking on the injury again though, when a player misses 30 games and 11 games the past two seasons, and is going to command north of $10-11M per season, I think it's fair to say buyer beware. He may play the next three seasons without missing a single game, but I wouldn't bet on it.

Karlsson is a player you add when you're a piece away, not several pieces / years away. I don't doubt that Karlsson will be a great signing for whoever signs him, because that team will be a legit contender, and he very well may put them over the top. For a bottom third of the league team to sign him though would be dumb in my opinion. It doesn't make sense for either side, and it's not going to happen.