2020 Trade Deadline Thread (aka Veleno vs Rasmussen vs Fabbri vs Zadina)

[krsmith17 7,191]

27 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

Here are the playoff teams and the top 4 Wild Cards in each Conference.

We know we aren't getting more than picks for most of the players we might deal, but with each of these teams, what would you like to see in return for a AA package?  Let's say A team wants AA and Helm (50% salary retained for Helm.)

I doubt any team interested in Athanasiou would also have interest in another one of our players, other than maybe Holland. If we're trading Athanasiou and Helm to Edmonton, I'd want something like 2020 1st round pick, conditional 2021 2nd round pick, and a prospect.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,014]

hoooo boy ppl gonna be dissapoint

[krsmith17 7,191]

27 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

hoooo boy ppl gonna be dissapoint

I'm aware that those pieces would be overpayment, but I don't think Athanasiou will be traded, unless it's an overpayment. There's no rush to trade him.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

That's part of it (including Rasmussen), but more than that, I just don't want to overpay again in free agency.

We sign Namestinkov to a six year, $5.5M contract to be our 2nd line center, because he would currently be our 2nd best center. However, he's not a 2nd line center, and one (or both) of Veleno and Rasmussen could very well be better than him in a year or two. All of a sudden we have another bad contract on the books for another 3-4 seasons...

You're saying "four" forwards again, when it was only "one". I didn't say we shouldn't add any forwards. I said we shouldn't add any forwards *via free agency*. More specifically, *overpay* for any free agent forwards, which is almost always the case. I'm all for more low-risk, high-reward trades.

Let me rephrase it... I don't think we should sign any big name free agents on July 1st to bloated contracts. If we sign another stop gap center or defenseman, I won't care. I just don't want to sign any big money, long-term contracts. That's what you do when you're a legit contender, not when you're the worst team in the league...

I will also say though, if Namestnikov wants to come to Detroit because of his uncle Vyacheslav, and is willing to sign a team friendly deal in the neighborhood of four years at $3.5M, I'd be okay with that. Of course, we know whoever he signs with, it will be for much more than that though...

Aha we will have over $40 million to play with as the worst team in the league and you would like no meaningful signings. Good.

A couple more Regula's for Perlini's should do the trick. Maybe one will be a Fabbri.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

34 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

hoooo boy ppl gonna be dissapoint

No worries, as soon as what folks don't want to happen happens the mental gymnastics will start to make it ok. Yzerman does no wrong.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,014]

4 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

No worries, as soon as what folks don't want to happen happens the mental gymnastics will start to make it ok. Yzerman does no wrong.

Yeah. Like if we don't pull in at least a 1st, a couple 2nds, and a few mid-round picks in exchange for the carrion laying around the Wings dressing room, this'll be me

 

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

17 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Yeah. Like if we don't pull in at least a 1st, a couple 2nds, and a few mid-round picks in exchange for the carrion laying around the Wings dressing room, this'll be me

 

AA for 3rd + 6th

Green for 5th

Hoorah

[gcom007 1,465]

Just now, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

AA for 3rd + 6th

Green for 5th

Hoorah

Gonna be split open and melt happening all over. 

[greenrebellion 415]

37 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Aha we will have over $40 million to play with as the worst team in the league and you would like no meaningful signings. Good.

A couple more Regula's for Perlini's should do the trick. Maybe one will be a Fabbri.

Problem is you can't sign big name free agents without giving term in most cases.  Term is pointless because by the time this team is good, the big name FA will be in decline and overpaid and you'll have another Nielsen on your hands.

[krsmith17 7,191]

29 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Aha we will have over $40 million to play with as the worst team in the league and you would like no meaningful signings. Good.

A couple more Regula's for Perlini's should do the trick. Maybe one will be a Fabbri.

Just because we have cap space, doesn't mean we should carelessly throw it away. There are other, much more beneficial ways to utilize all that cap space.

26 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

No worries, as soon as what folks don't want to happen happens the mental gymnastics will start to make it ok. Yzerman does no wrong.

Yzerman has made mistakes and will continue to make mistakes. If Yzerman signs Namestnikov (or another mid level player) to a big contract, my initial reaction will be WTF? but I'm sure I'll get over it. That has nothing to do with Yzerman.

8 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

AA for 3rd + 6th

Not gonna happen.

9 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Green for 5th

Yeah, maybe.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2 minutes ago, greenrebellion said:

Problem is you can't sign big name free agents without giving term in most cases.  Term is pointless because by the time this team is good, the big name FA will be in decline and overpaid and you'll have another Nielsen on your hands.

Namestnikov is neither a big name nor old by any respects.

I'm not sure what fantasy land everyone is living in, but after about half a dozen names this roster is complete bungus. I'm in no way saving a spot for anyone after those names and most all need to be replaced and we have the money to do it. I suggest possibly signing one young 3rd liner to help out and you all act like I'm committing the team to Nielsen/Abby cap hell lol this will be a fun off-season .

5 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Just because we have cap space, doesn't mean we should carelessly throw it away. There are other, much more beneficial ways to utilize all that cap space.

Oh yeah? How would you utilize it?

[krsmith17 7,191]

11 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Namestnikov is neither a big name nor old by any respects.

I'm not sure what fantasy land everyone is living in, but after about half a dozen names this roster is complete bungus. I'm in no way saving a spot for anyone after those names and most all need to be replaced and we have the money to do it. I suggest possibly signing one young 3rd liner to help out and you all act like I'm committing the team to Nielsen/Abby cap hell lol this will be a fun off-season .

Namestnikov is a 3rd line center that will get paid like a 2nd line center, because "Free Agent Frenzy"... A rebuilding team does not need that. There's no way we're signing him cheap, short-term, but if we could sign him cheap ($3M), long(ish)-term (4-5 years) OR expensive ($6M), short-term (1-2 years), I'd consider it. Chances are, he's going to want more money, longer term though, and that I wouldn't be interested in, in any free agent. If we need to sign anyone, sign stop gaps like last summer.

16 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Oh yeah? How would you utilize it?

I've already explained this numerous times in different threads, but here it is again... Trade for bad contracts and acquire future assets (picks / prospects)...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Namestnikov is a 3rd line center that will get paid like a 2nd line center, because "Free Agent Frenzy"... A rebuilding team does not need that. There's no way we're signing him cheap, short-term, but if we could sign him cheap ($3M), long(ish)-term (4-5 years) OR expensive ($6M), short-term (1-2 years), I'd consider it. Chances are, he's going to want more money, longer term though, and that I wouldn't be interested in, in any free agent. If we need to sign anyone, sign stop gaps like last summer.

You think Namestnikov is gonna sign somewhere for 6 mil for 5 years? lol

5 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I've already explained this numerous times in different threads, but here it is again... Trade for bad contracts and acquire future assets (picks / prospects)...

Ah so you don't wanna add young talent cause they might end up as dead weight so you can add dead weight contracts

Wait a minute...

[krsmith17 7,191]

7 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

You think Namestnikov is gonna sign somewhere for 6 mil for 5 years? lol

I originally said 6 years at $5.5M, so yes, I think he will sign a contract somewhere in that ballpark. What do you think he'll sign? Much lower cap hit, for less years I assume?

9 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Ah so you don't wanna add young talent cause they might end up as dead weight so you can add dead weight contracts

Wait a minute...

Umm yeah...

Sign mid level player to a bad contract, and you have nothing but a mid level player on a bad contract.

Trade for a mid level player already on a bad contract, and you now have a mid level player on a bad contact AND extra assets...

It's really not that complicated...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

8 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I originally said 6 years at $5.5M, so yes, I think he will sign a contract somewhere in that ballpark. What do you think he'll sign? Much lower cap hit, for less years I assume?

Uh yeah... Anybody who hands Namestnikov 5.5 for 6 years outta be taken out back n shot. That's ridiculous.

10 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Umm yeah...

Sign mid level player to a bad contract, and you have nothing but a mid level player on a bad contract.

Trade for a mid level player already on a bad contract, and you now have a mid level player on a bad contact AND extra assets...

It's really not that complicated...

And when Yzerman doesn't do this cause he's not gonna add 4 more abdelkaders and neilsens. What should he do?

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

 

[krsmith17 7,191]

12 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Uh yeah... Anybody who hands Namestnikov 5.5 for 6 years outta be taken out back n shot. That's ridiculous.

And that would be a first, a true shocker if an NHL GM overpaid for a free agent on July 1st...

13 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

And when Yzerman doesn't do this cause he's not gonna add 4 more abdelkaders and neilsens. What should he do?

No one said he should add "four more bad contracts"... One would be a start.

What should Yzerman do? AGAIN, in my opinion, if he wants to add a player or two via free agency, it should be a low cost stop gap ala Filppula / Nemeth last off-season.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

And that would be a first, a true shocker if an NHL GM overpaid for a free agent on July 1st...

Which is why I'm not advocating for random overpaid FA's. I mentioned a player who has connections to Detroit and Yzerman. If someone else wants to hand Namestnikov a dog s*** contract like you seem to think he's worth, by all means take it elsewhere.

4 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

What should Yzerman do? AGAIN, in my opinion, if he wants to add a player or two via free agency, it should be a low cost stop gap ala Filppula / Nemeth last off-season.

Yes. Let's add more 35 year old 25 pt Filppulas for $3 mil for multiple seasons, that's what this team needs. 27 year old players who can actually help the team for around 1 mil more? Forget em. We can't afford that.

[krsmith17 7,191]

5 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Which is why I'm not advocating for random overpaid FA's. I mentioned a player who has connections to Detroit and Yzerman. If someone else wants to hand Namestnikov a dog s*** contract like you seem to think he's worth, by all means take it elsewhere.

Namestnikov doesn't have a connection with Detroit, his uncle does. He does have a connection with Yzerman though. He drafted him, but also traded him away.

I never said Namestnikov is "worth" that sort of contract. If I thought he was worth it, I'd obviously have no problem giving it to him.

10 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Yes. Let's add more 35 year old 25 pt Filppulas for $3 mil for multiple seasons, that's what this team needs. 27 year old players who can actually help the team for around 1 mil more? Forget em. We can't afford that.

Again, if we can get Namestnikov for cheap, by all means, but I think he's going to cost close to double what Filppula is making.

[kipwinger 8,524]

Some of my favorite things to do on LGW are compare what people A) think someone is worth in a trade vs. what they actually get in return, or B) compare what people think a UFA will sign for vs. what they actually do. It's hilarious how bad most fans are at player valuation.

Anybody who thinks a guy who's never scored 50 pts in the NHL is going to get a 6 million dollar contract for (near) max term is delusional. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

11 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

Some of my favorite things to do on LGW are compare what people A) think someone is worth in a trade vs. what they actually get in return, or B) compare what people think a UFA will sign for vs. what they actually do. It's hilarious how bad most fans are at player valuation.

Anybody who thinks a guy who's never scored 50 pts in the NHL is going to get a 6 million dollar contract for (near) max term is delusional. 

Kevin Hayes - career high 49 points (in 76 games) - signs a 7 year, over $7M contract last off-season at the age of 27.

Vladislav Namestnikov - career high 44 points (in 62 games) - 27 years old. Will NOT sign a long term, big money ($5.5M) contract (because kipwinger says so)...

That's just one example. There are others. To pretend there aren't dumb NHL GM's is, well, dumb...

[marcaractac 3,963]

39 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

Some of my favorite things to do on LGW are compare what people A) think someone is worth in a trade vs. what they actually get in return, or B) compare what people think a UFA will sign for vs. what they actually do. It's hilarious how bad most fans are at player valuation.

Anybody who thinks a guy who's never scored 50 pts in the NHL is going to get a 6 million dollar contract for (near) max term is delusional. 

No shortage of actual GMs being delusional then

[kipwinger 8,524]

2 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

No shortage of actual GMs being delusional then

For a 50 point defenseman maybe.  Which forwards are making 6 million long term and have never scored 50 points?  I'll wait.

[marcaractac 3,963]

5 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

For a 50 point defenseman maybe.  Which forwards are making 6 million long term and have never scored 50 points?  I'll wait.

If only you took the time to read the post before mine. You'd have avoided the egg on your face. 

[kipwinger 8,524]

4 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

If only you took the time to read the post before mine. You'd have avoided the egg on your face. 

And if you fact checked that dummy you'd realize he's wrong.  Kevin Hayes scored 55 points in 18-19. 

So is the egg on both your faces for being reactionary dipsh*ts, or just his?

Edit:  Also, providing one (factually inaccurate) example isn't even close to your insinuation that there are "no shortage" of GMs giving out these types of contracts to these types of players, which implies it happens with regularity.

Edited February 19, 2020 by kipwinger