2020 Offseason

[krsmith17 7,191]

It's not quite the offseason yet, but we're getting close, with a dozen games remaining.

Alex Biega was re-signed today, 1 year, $875K.
Good depth signing, but I hope we're in a position next season where he slots in as the 7th defenseman...

It'll be interesting to see what happens with the rest of the UFA's / RFA's this spring / summer...

UFA's - Gagner, Ericsson, Daley, Goloubef, Howard, *Franzen, *Brodziak
RFA's - Mantha, Bertuzzi, Fabbri, Perlini, Erne, Hirose, Svechnikov, Timashov, Ehn, Turgeon, Bowey

Of all the UFA's the only one that I'd re-sign is Gagner. Something around $2.5-3.5M for 1-2 years.
It would be great if Yzerman could somehow pull off a Nielsen trade...

Mantha, Bertuzzi and Fabbri will all be re-signed. I'd try to lock Mantha up long-term, 7-8 years at around $6-7M, Bertuzzi, 5-6 years at $4-5M, and Fabbri, similar to Bert, maybe slightly lower AAV.

I'd also re-sign Perlini, Hirose, Svechnikov, Timashov, Turgeon and Bowey for around $1M for 1-2 years each. Erne and Ehn I can take our leave, but I'd be okay with either / both on a similar deal as well, for depth.

Other than that, I'd sign a goaltender in free agency and stand pat at forward / defense.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

Alex Biega was re-signed today, 1 year, $875K.
Good depth signing, but I hope we're in a position next season where he slots in as the 7th defenseman...

Like. Guy is a great fill-in Dman.

1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

UFA's - Gagner, Ericsson, Daley, Goloubef, Howard, *Franzen, *Brodziak

RFA's - Mantha, Bertuzzi, Fabbri, Perlini, Erne, Hirose, Svechnikov, Timashov, Ehn, Turgeon, Bowey

Bolded are the only ones I see coming back.

Gagner - I could see the team wanting his vet presence, but if he leaves who really cares.
Mantha/Bertuzzi/Fabbri - Obvious re-sign's.
Erne - For better or worse I think Yzerman will be loyal to this guy. He was only expected to be a grinder anyway.
Hirose/Svechnikov - Young and inexperienced still, cheap re-signs.
Timashov - Undecided about what I think about this player
Ehn - Great depth player, easy re-sign
Bowey - As much as I hate how he plays sometimes, he seems to VERY well liked by his teammates. I could see him catching a re-sign just for this.

Perlini - What can I say, he's still young enough on paper to maybe re-sign, but between him offering absolutely nothing on the ice and the rumors of his lazy work ethic and personality, I can see us just taking the loss on this one and moving on.
Turgeon - I see this player as the next Emmerton/Andersson/Ferraro, and maybe even worse than some of those names. There's too many better players in front of him already (Svechnikov/Smith/Hirose/Rasmussen) and he's probably going to get leapfrogged by Veleno and whoever we add in the 1st round this year. If we do re-sign, I think its really only for GR depth.

2 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

Of all the UFA's the only one that I'd re-sign is Gagner. Something around $2.5-3.5M for 1-2 years.

It would be great if Yzerman could somehow pull off a Nielsen trade...

Right, I think Gagner is already ahead of Fil and Niel in my book.

2 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

I'd also re-sign Perlini, Hirose, Svechnikov, Timashov, Turgeon and Bowey for around $1M for 1-2 years each. Erne and Ehn I can take our leave, but I'd be okay with either / both on a similar deal as well, for depth.

I guess I don't understand what you see in Turgeon over Ehn. Both are probably only ever gonna be 4th liners, but Ehn is already a pretty good 4th liner wih 100+ games under his belt and he's the same age as Turgeon. Turgeon is looking like he may not even make the NHL...

2 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

Other than that, I'd sign a goaltender in free agency and stand pat at forward / defense.

First off, you can call me a band-wagoner if you like, but if Yzerman stands pat at all skating positions I most likely will be Audi 500 next season. Maybe only watch GR and games where Seider is up. There's just nothing to be gained or enjoyed by watching this same lineup another season.

That said, I don't think it's possible for Y to remain pat. We will be losing 3 NHLers at D (Daley, Ericsson, Goldbeef) and possibly also Bowey and Kyle Wood. Plus we already subtracted Mike Green a short time ago, so really we're losing 4 this season.

Dekeyser - Hronek
Nemeth - Bowey
Biega - Lindstrom

Cholowski - Seider
McIsaac - Wood
Hicketts - McIlrath
Lashoff

I assume Yzerman will want to add at least 2, if not 3, Dmen to that depth chart. Ideally I would want those to be NHLers who can force Biega/Lindstrom/Bowey/Cholowski/Seider to fight for NHL spots. Unfortunately this most likely would have been a good time to get Alec Regula under contract, but maybe Yzerman wants to sign Tuomisto and Johansson already? IDK despite their success it seems kinda early on those two still. I think I'd like to sign a solid defender to put on top of Dekyser to play with Hronek, and another Nemeth style depth guy.

In regards to forwards we can probably stand pat though, unless Yzerman purges a buncha RFAs. We probably have at the very least Rasmussen and another forward coming up next season like Smith/Hirose/Lafreniere. I wouldn't mind Yzerman spinning the wheel on a 2nd line C again (especially if Gagner is gone) but otherwise we probably have enough wingers.

 

[The 91 of Ryans 3,014]

Yzerman's absolutely going to bring in at least one veteran D man this summer. 

And Mantha will sign for less than 6. 

I'd rather ditch Perlini and keep one of Erne or Ehn. 

Otherwise, I agree with you. @krsmith17

Edited March 9, 2020 by The 91 of Ryans

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

3 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Yzerman's absolutely going to bring in at least one veteran D man this summer.

The Detroit Red Wings have signed UFA Mike Green...

There's actually a semi decent pool of defenders possibly on the market this year

• Pietrangelo
• Krug
• Vatanen
• Schultz
• Barrie
• Andy Greene
• Brodie
• Ceci
• Tanev
• Kulikov
• Scandella
• Hamonic
• Braun
• Gudas
• Dillon
• Edmundson
• Shattenkirk
• Stone
• Polak
• Sekera

Stevie will get at least one. I could see Andy Greene coming home to Michigan to play his final season. I like Gudas for the entertainment value. Other than that even a lot of the crappier names I listed are probably upgrades over what we currently have. Hopefully Stevie can grab the one with character and good leadership.

[krsmith17 7,191]

11 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I guess I don't understand what you see in Turgeon over Ehn. Both are probably only ever gonna be 4th liners, but Ehn is already a pretty good 4th liner wih 100+ games under his belt and he's the same age as Turgeon. Turgeon is looking like he may not even make the NHL...

Ehn sucks. He would not be in the NHL with any other organization, and hopefully not much longer in Detroit. Turgeon is still a bit of an unknown at the NHL level. Maybe that's for good reason. Maybe not. I don't know. What I do know, is that Turgeon is a very good defensive center, strong penalty killer and great in the faceoffs. I also know that Ehn brings nothing offensively, and based on NHLe calculator, Turgeon would have approximately 15 points this season to Ehn's 3.

I'm not saying Turgeon would definitely be better than Ehn, but I do think there's a strong possibility that he could provide a little more offensive punch, while not giving up much, if anything defensively.

[krsmith17 7,191]

24 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

First off, you can call me a band-wagoner if you like, but if Yzerman stands pat at all skating positions I most likely will be Audi 500 next season. Maybe only watch GR and games where Seider is up. There's just nothing to be gained or enjoyed by watching this same lineup another season.

That said, I don't think it's possible for Y to remain pat. We will be losing 3 NHLers at D (Daley, Ericsson, Goldbeef) and possibly also Bowey and Kyle Wood. Plus we already subtracted Mike Green a short time ago, so really we're losing 4 this season.

Dekeyser - Hronek
Nemeth - Bowey
Biega - Lindstrom

Cholowski - Seider
McIsaac - Wood
Hicketts - McIlrath
Lashoff

I assume Yzerman will want to add at least 2, if not 3, Dmen to that depth chart. Ideally I would want those to be NHLers who can force Biega/Lindstrom/Bowey/Cholowski/Seider to fight for NHL spots. Unfortunately this most likely would have been a good time to get Alec Regula under contract, but maybe Yzerman wants to sign Tuomisto and Johansson already? IDK despite their success it seems kinda early on those two still. I think I'd like to sign a solid defender to put on top of Dekyser to play with Hronek, and another Nemeth style depth guy.

In regards to forwards we can probably stand pat though, unless Yzerman purges a buncha RFAs. We probably have at the very least Rasmussen and another forward coming up next season like Smith/Hirose/Lafreniere. I wouldn't mind Yzerman spinning the wheel on a 2nd line C again (especially if Gagner is gone) but otherwise we probably have enough wingers.

Subtracting Ericsson, Daley and Goloubef would be addition by subtraction. We've had this conversation before, and like I said back then, I'm not completely opposed to adding another depth defenseman. When I say "stand pat", I'm more so talking about not going after any big name free agents. If we sign another Nemeth type defenseman, I'd be fine with it. However, I don't see how there's room for 2-3 new defensemen added to the mix.

We currently have DeKeyser, Nemeth, Hronek, Seider, Cholowski, Biega, and Lindstrom under contract going into next season. I think Bowey will be back as well. That's 7, possibly 8 defensemen without adding any.

If we're looking to add a defenseman, I'd love to see Yzerman go the offer sheet route, and take advantage of his old buddy in Tampa, and offer Sergachev a contract of $4.225M  for 4 years (2nd round pick)...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

3 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Ehn sucks. He would not be in the NHL with any other organization, and hopefully not much longer in Detroit. Turgeon is still a bit of an unknown at the NHL level. Maybe that's for good reason. Maybe not. I don't know. What I do know, is that Turgeon is a very good defensive center, strong penalty killer and great in the faceoffs. I also know that Ehn brings nothing offensively, and based on NHLe calculator, Turgeon would have approximately 15 points this season to Ehn's 3.

I'm not saying Turgeon would definitely be better than Ehn, but I do think there's a strong possibility that he could provide a little more offensive punch, while not giving up much, if anything defensively.

I think Ehn's defensive abilities are light years ahead of Turgeon's. Which is why Turgeon find himself in the AHL and Ehn finds himself in the NHL despite them being the same age.

I'll disagree with the translation factor on this one. I don't think Turgeon gets 15 pts on this team. Maybe on a different one. I think Ehn probably gets 15 pts on a different team as well. When players like Abdelkader, Nielsen, Perlini, Erne, Ehn, Glendening, Helm, and Filppula are all struggling to put up 5, 10, 15, 20 pts, I highly doubt Turgeon would jump on board and provide 15.

I think Turgeon is finished. Way too many better forwards ahead of him.

[krsmith17 7,191]

33 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Mantha will sign for less than 6. 

You think? I doubt it, but that would be fantastic, as long as it's long(ish) term.

[marcaractac 3,962]

8 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Ehn sucks. He would not be in the NHL with any other organization, and hopefully not much longer in Detroit. Turgeon is still a bit of an unknown at the NHL level. Maybe that's for good reason. Maybe not. I don't know. What I do know, is that Turgeon is a very good defensive center, strong penalty killer and great in the faceoffs. I also know that Ehn brings nothing offensively, and based on NHLe calculator, Turgeon would have approximately 15 points this season to Ehn's 3.

I'm not saying Turgeon would definitely be better than Ehn, but I do think there's a strong possibility that he could provide a little more offensive punch, while not giving up much, if anything defensively.

Ehn is the ideal extra forward. Good enough to fill in during injuries and not be useless and prevent the youth we want to build around from being bench warmers. Not to mention he could still turn out to become a very good fourth line center at some point. I see nothing that shows Turgeon would be any better offensively than Ehn. No chance Turgeon scores 15 points playing with Abby. Ehn put up 9 points in 60 last season when the team was all around far less terrible. Ehn is younger and proved he can play at the NHL level. I'd take Ehn over Turgeon 100% of the time. Do not understand the Ehn hate what so ever.  

[The 91 of Ryans 3,014]

4 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

You think? I doubt it, but that would be fantastic, as long as it's long(ish) term.

Ah, but it may be short term. He needs to prove he can stay healthy and score 30 (which I have no doubt he will if he can play 70ish games)

 

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

1 minute ago, krsmith17 said:

Subtracting Ericsson, Daley and Goloubef would be addition by subtraction. We've had this conversation before, and like I said back then, I'm not completely opposed to adding another depth defenseman. When I say "stand pat", I'm more so talking about not going after any big name free agents. If we sign another Nemeth type defenseman, I'd be fine with it. However, I don't see how there's room for 2-3 new defensemen added to the mix.

We currently have DeKeyser, Nemeth, Hronek, Seider, Cholowski, Biega, and Lindstrom under contract going into next season. I think Bowey will be back as well. That's 7, possibly 8 defensemen without adding any.

If we're looking to add a defenseman, I'd love to see Yzerman go the offer sheet route, and take advantage of his old buddy in Tampa, and offer Sergachev a contract of $4.225M  for 4 years (2nd round pick)...

Biega shouldn't be in the lineup most nights. Lindstrom and Seider are both two very big question marks still. I think Cholowski should be ideally in the AHL still. That leaves 3 players (half a defense) guaranteed to be on the team. That and we will have injuries like always. Heaven forbid two Dmen go down like always and we will be calling up Lashoffs/Hicketts/McIlraths/McIsaacs/Lashoffs/Woods again. I'd rather be calling up one or two of Cholo/Seider/Lindstrom/Biega when those injuries occur.

I think Krug would be a mistake, but any solid Dman at $5 mil would be a welcome addition to me.

[krsmith17 7,191]

1 minute ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I think Ehn's defensive abilities are light years ahead of Turgeon's. Which is why Turgeon find himself in the AHL and Ehn finds himself in the NHL despite them being the same age.

I'll disagree with the translation factor on this one. I don't think Turgeon gets 15 pts on this team. Maybe on a different one. I think Ehn probably gets 15 pts on a different team as well. When players like Abdelkader, Nielsen, Perlini, Erne, Ehn, Glendening, Helm, and Filppula are all struggling to put up 5, 10, 15, 20 pts, I highly doubt Turgeon would jump on board and provide 15.

I think Turgeon is finished. Way too many better forwards ahead of him.

I don't entirely disagree with the points you're making, just with the conclusion you've come to. And it's not even like I think Turgeon would be this massive upgrade or anything. At worst, I think it would be a wash. At best, Turgeon could be a slight upgrade. If he isn't re-signed, I won't lose any sleep, but I'd just like to see him given more than a few games before writing him off.

I think the only forward Turgeon really needs to be worried about jumping him (as a 4th line center), is Pearson, and that very well may happen (if it hasn't already)... None of the players you mentioned previously (Veleno, Rasmussen, Svechnikov, Smith, etc) are 4th line centers.

[krsmith17 7,191]

9 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

Ehn is the ideal extra forward. Good enough to fill in during injuries and not be useless and prevent the youth we want to build around from being bench warmers. Not to mention he could still turn out to become a very good fourth line center at some point. I see nothing that shows Turgeon would be any better offensively than Ehn. No chance Turgeon scores 15 points playing with Abby. Ehn put up 9 points in 60 last season when the team was all around far less terrible. Ehn is younger and proved he can play at the NHL level. I'd take Ehn over Turgeon 100% of the time. Do not understand the Ehn hate what so ever.  

There's no Ehn "hate". I just don't think he's an NHL quality player. He's replacement level. I'm not saying that Turgeon will be his replacement. Maybe it's Pearson. Maybe it's Smith. Maybe it's some other prospect in or outside the organization. But in my opinion, he needs to replaced *in the lineup*. I don't give a s*** if he's signed specifically to be the extra forward.

For whatever reason, Red Wings fans completely overrate Ehn and his defensive game. Sure, he's decent defensively, but he's far from great, and the lack of offensive instincts leaves much to be desired. I don't think Ehn would play in any more than a handful of games with any of the other 30 teams in the NHL.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

13 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I don't entirely disagree with the points you're making, just with the conclusion you've come to. And it's not even like I think Turgeon would be this massive upgrade or anything. At worst, I think it would be a wash. At best, Turgeon could be a slight upgrade. If he isn't re-signed, I won't lose any sleep, but I'd just like to see him given more than a few games before writing him off.

I think the only forward Turgeon really needs to be worried about jumping him (as a 4th line center), is Pearson, and that very well may happen (if it hasn't already)... None of the players you mentioned previously (Veleno, Rasmussen, Svechnikov, Smith, etc) are 4th line centers.

Sure but barring some tough buyouts or trades I think our C depth looks like this:

Larkin
Filppula
Glendening
Nielsen
Ehn
Rasmussen
Turgeon
Veleno
Pearson

You could even throw Helm and Gagner in there to some extent

I think there's gonna have to be a few key injuries to our Cs before Turgeon ever sniffs the lineup. Couple that with the fact that Veleno and Pearson are about to leapfrog him on the depth chart, Berggren is probably gonna join the organization soon, and we may very well have a new high profile C joining us after the draft, and I don't see how this player will make the lineup. He's getting pushed farther down the depth chart, not up it, me thinks. And when a wing spot on the 4th line opens up I see Hirose/Smith/Svechnikov/Rasmussen taking it over him.
 

Edited March 9, 2020 by ChristopherReevesLegs

[krsmith17 7,191]

14 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Biega shouldn't be in the lineup most nights. Lindstrom and Seider are both two very big question marks still. I think Cholowski should be ideally in the AHL still. That leaves 3 players (half a defense) guaranteed to be on the team. That and we will have injuries like always. Heaven forbid two Dmen go down like always and we will be calling up Lashoffs/Hicketts/McIlraths/McIsaacs/Lashoffs/Woods again. I'd rather be calling up one or two of Cholo/Seider/Lindstrom/Biega when those injuries occur.

I think Krug would be a mistake, but any solid Dman at $5 mil would be a welcome addition to me.

You've been clamoring all season to get Seider in the lineup. Now he's a "very big question mark"? I think Lindstrom has been one of our better defensemen for this stretch. Small sample size, but I think he's at least earned a long hard look to make the team out of camp next season. I know we'll disagree on Cholowski, but I think his development would be better served in the NHL.

I agree that Krug / Pietrangelo would be a mistake, but I wouldn't sign any more than one more depth defenseman. 2-3 would be excessive in my opinion...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

4 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

There's no Ehn "hate". I just don't think he's an NHL quality player. He's replacement level. I'm not saying that Turgeon will be his replacement. Maybe it's Pearson. Maybe it's Smith. Maybe it's some other prospect in or outside the organization. But in my opinion, he needs to replaced *in the lineup*. I don't give a s*** if he's signed specifically to be the extra forward.

For whatever reason, Red Wings fans completely overrate Ehn and his defensive game. Sure, he's decent defensively, but he's far from great, and the lack of offensive instincts leaves much to be desired. I don't think Ehn would play in any more than a handful of games with any of the other 30 teams in the NHL.

Why can't Ehn get better? You seem to think Turgeon may still grow into something worthwhile, and Ehn is younger than him with a much better track record of success.

 

[krsmith17 7,191]

7 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I think there's gonna have to be a few key injuries to our Cs before Turgeon ever sniffs the lineup. Couple that with the fact that Veleno and Pearson are about to leapfrog him on the depth chart, Berggren is probably gonna join the organization soon, and we may very well have a new high profile C joining us after the draft, and I don't see how this player will make the lineup. He's getting pushed farther down the depth chart, not up it, me thinks. And when a wing spot on the 4th line opens up I see Hirose/Smith/Svechnikov/Rasmussen taking it over him.

Again, he's one of the few that would be in line for that 4th line center role. The only players that he would have to leapfrog are Nielsen and Ehn. I think if given the opportunity, he could be as good or better than either. Berggren is a winger, not a center.

Maybe Turgeon is another Ferraro and never makes it. I'd just like to see him given an opportunity. He's been very good in Grand Rapids, and looked solid in pre-season games the past two years.

7 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Why can't Ehn get better? You seem to think Turgeon may still grow into something worthwhile, and Ehn is younger than him with a much better track record of success.

I've never said or implied Ehn CAN'T get better, but I personally don't think he will.

I've said before that I'd love to be proven wrong on Ehn, and he turn into a Glendening lite, but I just don't see it. Everything about him reminds me of Joakim Andersson. I think he'll be back in Sweden within a couple years.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

1 minute ago, krsmith17 said:

You've been clamoring all season to get Seider in the lineup. Now he's a "very big question mark"? I think Lindstrom has been one of our better defensemen for this stretch. Small sample size, but I think he's at least earned a long hard look to make the team out of camp next season. I know we'll disagree on Cholowski, but I think his development would be better served in the NHL.

I agree that Krug / Pietrangelo would be a mistake, but I wouldn't sign any more than one more depth defenseman. 2-3 would be excessive in my opinion...

Yes I personally want Seider in the lineup, but I can't pretend a 19 year old Dman is definitely 100% gonna make the team next year and play meaningful minutes. Especially if Yzerman is gonna run the boat into the rocks again. Until he does make the team I have to consider him a ?.

Lindstrom has been pretty steady from what I've seen of him. I think he's still waiver exempt next year though, which makes me think he should be used as a callup for one more year. He still has less than a full season on NA ice.

I look at the lineup like this

Dekeyser (4D) - Hronek (2D)
Nemeth (6D) - Bowey (6D)
Biega (7D) - Lindstrom (7D)
Seider (7D) - Cholowski (7D)

I think hoping that Bowey/Seider/Lindstrom/Cholowski are better than 6/7Ds next year is wishful thinking, and not where I'd put all my eggs. And the Top4 needs significant upgrading. I think there's very much a need to add another 4D or something like that.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

9 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Again, he's one of the few that would be in line for that 4th line center role. The only players that he would have to leapfrog are Nielsen and Ehn. I think if given the opportunity, he could be as good or better than either. Berggren is a winger, not a center.

Glendening and Rasmussen can't play 4C? Why? Hell If we weren't so desperate for quality 2nd and 3rd line C's, I'd even put Filppula there.

12 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Maybe Turgeon is another Ferraro and never makes it. I'd just like to see him given an opportunity. He's been very good in Grand Rapids, and looked solid in pre-season games the past two years.

See I'd like to hear what you see in him that makes you think so fondly of him. He's the most boring player for the Griffins IMO, and not in a good way.

He doesn't seem to particularly good at anything to me, and that includes defense. I see no NHL future in this player whatsoever, and being a below-average AHLer at 24 makes me think it's time to move on from him.

17 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I've never said or implied Ehn CAN'T get better, but I personally don't think he will.

Why do you think Turgeon will and Ehn won't?

[marcaractac 3,962]

9 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Yes I personally want Seider in the lineup, but I can't pretend a 19 year old Dman is definitely 100% gonna make the team next year and play meaningful minutes. Especially if Yzerman is gonna run the boat into the rocks again. Until he does make the team I have to consider him a ?.

Lindstrom has been pretty steady from what I've seen of him. I think he's still waiver exempt next year though, which makes me think he should be used as a callup for one more year. He still has less than a full season on NA ice.

I look at the lineup like this

Dekeyser (4D) - Hronek (2D)
Nemeth (6D) - Bowey (6D)
Biega (7D) - Lindstrom (7D)
Seider (7D) - Cholowski (7D)

I think hoping that Bowey/Seider/Lindstrom/Cholowski are better than 6/7Ds next year is wishful thinking, and not where I'd put all my eggs. And the Top4 needs significant upgrading. I think there's very much a need to add another 4D or something like that.

Seeing you talk about Seider in a conservative manner is the weirdest s***. What have you done with the real CRL?!

[krsmith17 7,191]

7 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Yes I personally want Seider in the lineup, but I can't pretend a 19 year old Dman is definitely 100% gonna make the team next year and play meaningful minutes. Especially if Yzerman is gonna run the boat into the rocks again. Until he does make the team I have to consider him a ?.

Lindstrom has been pretty steady from what I've seen of him. I think he's still waiver exempt next year though, which makes me think he should be used as a callup for one more year. He still has less than a full season on NA ice.

I look at the lineup like this

Dekeyser (4D) - Hronek (2D)
Nemeth (6D) - Bowey (6D)
Biega (7D) - Lindstrom (7D)
Seider (7D) - Cholowski (7D)

I think hoping that Bowey/Seider/Lindstrom/Cholowski are better than 6/7Ds next year is wishful thinking, and not where I'd put all my eggs. And the Top4 needs significant upgrading. I think there's very much a need to add another 4D or something like that.

I'm very confused about where you stand on Seider. I think he could step in next season, and be *this team's* 3rd or 4th best defenseman. That, in my opinion, deserves a roster spot. Unless you think his development would be better served in the AHL. For most young defenseman, I'd agree. Seider doesn't appear to be anything like most young defensemen though...

Regarding the bold, I've already agreed with this. The only thing I'm disagreeing on, is that we should add "2-3 new defensemen)...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

Seeing you talk about Seider in a conservative manner is the weirdest s***. What have you done with the real CRL?!

I think (in all things) you have to plan for the worst case scenario - within reason - and act accordingly.

Do I think Seider will be the 1D on this team very soon? Absolutely, but it's smarter to plan that that doesn't happen, than to plan that it will.

If Seider is the 1D I think he is then he will have no trouble climbing over Nemeth, Bowey, Dekeyser, and whatever FA we sign.

[marcaractac 3,962]

2 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I think (in all things) you have to plan for the worst case scenario - within reason - and act accordingly.

Do I think Seider will be the 1D on this team very soon? Absolutely, but it's smarter to plan that that doesn't happen, than to plan that it will.

If Seider is the 1D I think he is then he will have no trouble climbing over Nemeth, Bowey, Dekeyser, and whatever FA we sign.

Oh for sure. Any GM going into a season expecting a rookie to take the reigns with no backup in place is not a good GM. 

[krsmith17 7,191]

5 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Glendening and Rasmussen can't play 4C? Why? Hell If we weren't so desperate for quality 2nd and 3rd line C's, I'd even put Filppula there.

If Rasmussen is our 4C we're either in big trouble (terrible pick) or in great shape (best center depth in the league)... I doubt either will be the case. Rasmussen should be a middle six center / winger. Glendening and Filppula can absolutely play 4C, but Turgeon wouldn't have the leapfrog them if they're playing above him (3rd / 4th line center)...

8 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

See I'd like to hear what you see in him that makes you think so fondly of him. He's the most boring player for the Griffins IMO, and not in a good way.

He doesn't seem to particularly good at anything to me, and that includes defense. I see no NHL future in this player whatsoever, and being a below-average AHLer at 24 makes me think it's time to move on from him.

Why do you think Turgeon will and Ehn won't?

It's amazing how often you misconstrue what I'm saying. This was never about Turgeon. Like I said, if we move on from him (don't sign him), I won't lose any sleep. I don't care about having Turgeon in the lineup. I care about not having scrubs in the lineup. Maybe Turgeon isn't any better than Ehn. I don't know, and I don't care. What I do know and care about, is that there are better players in the organization that will eventually (hopefully sooner than later) replace Ehn.

The last thing I'll say regarding Turgeon is, if you haven't seen how good his defensive game has been *at the AHL level* we're clearly watching very different games.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

3 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I'm very confused about where you stand on Seider. I think he could step in next season, and be *this team's* 3rd or 4th best defenseman. That, in my opinion, deserves a roster spot. Unless you think his development would be better served in the AHL. For most young defenseman, I'd agree. Seider doesn't appear to be anything like most young defensemen though...

Regarding the bold, I've already agreed with this. The only thing I'm disagreeing on, is that we should add "2-3 new defensemen)...

See above.

I think you have to assume our young players are what they are for now. And move forward with that mentality. Is Larkin a bonafide productive 1C again next year? Possibly. Is Seider an impact top4 D? Possibly. Is Lindstrom a steady bottom pairing? Possibly. Is Mantha a 30+ goal elite winger? Possibly.

But I will treat those possibilities as happy surprises ala Frank Grimes when they happen. I'm not worried about any truly talented players being forced out of the lineup by this roster.