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LeftWinger

2021 Off-Season (Too Soon?)

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7 hours ago, BarkBurgerman said:

I couldn't have asked for a better summer so far. Remember this offseason. This is the offseason when Yzerman started shifting gears up and pushing down on the accelerator. No ones talking about us now, but they will look back on this offseason as the offseason that the Yzerman-built championship Red Wings stopped tearing down and started building up. 

I wanted decent depth guys in the 27-32 year old age range, who at least have the potential to stick around if we start turning a corner now. The fact that we got this, plus a legit top pairing Dman in Leddy, plus we went out and got two decently good 25 year olds knocked my socks off

And we are still lean AF on the cap.

I think our goal-tending looks the same next year (and was never really that bad), but I'm just relieved to have some youth for the future there in Ned. The fact that we went from the bleakness of losing Bernier and Petruzzelli to where we are now almost overnight is remarkable.

OUT------------IN
Bernier -------Nedelijkovic
Petruzzelli----Cossa

A+ changes

Our defense is going to be radically different:

OUT--------------IN
Nemeth---------Seider
Merrill-----------Leddy
Djoos-----------Oesterle
Cholowski------Murphy
Biega-----------Newpower
McIlrath--------Barton
Hicketts

That's a damn good shift

There's less to say about the forwards. But I think we all know it's time to start clearing spots and shifting kids in. Smith, Pearson, Veleno, Raymond, Berggren... it's time boiz.

OUT-----------------IN
Glendening -------Suter
Panik---------------Veleno
Svechnikov-------Smith

I've been a Holland fanboy, but this is good work. He drafted my boy Seider, he's taken my boy Oesterle, and more. I don't doubt Yzerman anymore. The deal is real. Lets go. We won't be drafting so high next year.

I see the Guelph line being a real thing next year Fabbri - Suter - Bertuzzi. Each has career numbers. Seider comes in as the clear calder winner. Long way to go for us, and players will shift in and out, but this team is on the up and up. God bless Yzerman and all the players and all of you.

I agree that this has been a great offseason so far. Some quality upgrades while continuing to get younger. Our goaltending has improved (or at least on par and younger). Our defense has improved drastically. Leddy and Seider alone should provide some much needed offense and stability on the back end. Oesterle is just added depth, another Merrill / Nemeth. Our offense still needs a lot of work, and I think there's a good chance we lose a couple players up front in trades at some point this season.

I still think it's in the team's best interest to wait another season before we really start to turn things around. Yzerman knows this, and I think at least one, potentially all three of Vrana, Bertuzzi, Fabbri will be traded at some point this season. We have a lot of really nice pieces coming, but we're still an elite player or two away from ending this rebuild. I fully expect another bottom 5-10 finish this season, which to me isn't the worst thing.

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18 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I agree that this has been a great offseason so far. Some quality upgrades while continuing to get younger. Our goaltending has improved (or at least on par and younger). Our defense has improved drastically. Leddy and Seider alone should provide some much needed offense and stability on the back end. Oesterle is just added depth, another Merrill / Nemeth. Our offense still needs a lot of work, and I think there's a good chance we lose a couple players up front in trades at some point this season.

I still think it's in the team's best interest to wait another season before we really start to turn things around. Yzerman knows this, and I think at least one, potentially all three of Vrana, Bertuzzi, Fabbri will be traded at some point this season. We have a lot of really nice pieces coming, but we're still an elite player or two away from ending this rebuild. I fully expect another bottom 5-10 finish this season, which to me isn't the worst thing.

Wouldn't mind another top ten pick, obviously. But I think the defense upgrades alone move us up into the 10-15 pick range. I hope we finish 10 and win the draft lottery :P finally cash in on all that bad lotto luck 

 

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I missed this one yesterday:

Buffalo has acquired Will Butcher and a fifth-round pick in the 2022 NHL Draft from New Jersey in exchange for future considerations. 

 

It's not a bunch in return, but I honestly would not have minded that for us, at least before the d-man signing.. might be a little bit of a log jam of we added him now. But butcher shows a little promise as a puck moving type.. bet they'll be able to flip him at the trade deadline. 

 

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21 minutes ago, amato said:

Wouldn't mind another top ten pick, obviously. But I think the defense upgrades alone move us up into the 10-15 pick range. I hope we finish 10 and win the draft lottery :P finally cash in on all that bad lotto luck 

A trade or two, acquiring futures (which I fully expect) could have a major impact on our overall standing this season though... But yeah, finishing 22nd and moving up the max number of spots to get Shane Wright is the dream scenario.

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22 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

A trade or two, acquiring futures (which I fully expect) could have a major impact on our overall standing this season though... But yeah, finishing 22nd and moving up the max number of spots to get Shane Wright is the dream scenario.

And that is exactly what it is. A dream. 

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4 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

And that is exactly what it is. A dream. 

A team has to win the draft lottery. We'll once again be in striking distance. Could be us. Regardless whether or not we win the lottery though, this team needs a top 3 talent out of next year's draft. Yzerman knows this.

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11 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

A team has to win the draft lottery. We'll once again be in striking distance. Could be us. Regardless whether or not we win the lottery though, this team needs a top 3 talent out of next year's draft. Yzerman knows this.

It's a shame he improved the team then, because we won't finish bottom 3. The odds of jumping into the top 2 won't be pretty either. 

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30 minutes ago, BarkBurgerman said:

Yzerman isn't banking on a top3 next year and I'm honestly floored you're dumb enough to think this

28 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

It's a shame he improved the team then, because we won't finish bottom 3. The odds of jumping into the top 2 won't be pretty either. 

So I guess it's safe to say you both think Yzerman is done? This is the team we will see all season? None of Vrana, Bertuzzi, Fabbri, etc will be traded for futures? I think it's pretty naive ("dumb") to think Yzerman is satisfied where this team / organization / prospect pool is at. He's stressed over, and over, and over again that this is going to take a long time. He's nowhere near done. No he's not "banking" on a top 3 pick next year, but we'll certainly be in the running (by design).

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Just now, krsmith17 said:

So I guess it's safe to say you both think Yzerman is done? This is the team we will see all season? None of Vrana, Bertuzzi, Fabbri, etc will be traded for futures? I think it's pretty naive ("dumb") to think Yzerman is satisfied where this team / organization / prospect pool is at. He's stressed over, and over, and over again that this is going to take a long time. He's nowhere near done. No he's not "banking" on a top 3 pick next year, but we'll certainly be in the running (by design).

Where did I say Yzerman was done? I'm simply stating if we added a high end center such as Pettersson, this team would see a drastic improvement, when combined with already made changes. Bert is the only guy I can picture being traded this season. MAYBE Fabbri, but I'd imagine that would be more of a deadline deal. It's simply too soon to shop Vrana unless Yzerman gets an offer he can't refuse. Maybe see how he does with this team in a full season before trading him, yeah?

Losing Bert wouldn't move the needle nearly as much as adding Pettersson would. Trading Bert would also likely bring a young, NHL ready player back. Similar to the Mantha trade. 

And once again, I already stated I do not think nor expect an offer sheet to happen. It's a discussion of a 'what if' scenario. I know what Yzerman said and I know he will follow through with that. 

Buffalo and Arizona are in the running for a top 3 pick by design. Yzerman knows he has to build via the draft. But he also knows he doesn't need top 3 picks to do it.

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5 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

Where did I say Yzerman was done? I'm simply stating if we added a high end center such as Pettersson, this team would see a drastic improvement, when combined with already made changes. Bert is the only guy I can picture being traded this season. MAYBE Fabbri, but I'd imagine that would be more of a deadline deal. It's simply too soon to shop Vrana unless Yzerman gets an offer he can't refuse. Maybe see how he does with this team in a full season before trading him, yeah?

Losing Bert wouldn't move the needle nearly as much as adding Pettersson would. Trading Bert would also likely bring a young, NHL ready player back. Similar to the Mantha trade. 

And once again, I already stated I do not think nor expect an offer sheet to happen. It's a discussion of a 'what if' scenario. I know what Yzerman said and I know he will follow through with that. 

Buffalo and Arizona are in the running for a top 3 pick by design. Yzerman knows he has to build via the draft. But he also knows he doesn't need top 3 picks to do it.

If you know a Pettersson offersheet isn't going to happen, why are you talking about where this team would be if we added Pettersson? No one is disputing that we would be a much improved team with Pettersson. I'm talking about where this team will be this coming season. Not where this team will be if we add Pettersson. We agree that it's never going to happen, so what's the point?

So now that we have that behind us, where do you realistically think this team will finish WITHOUT Pettersson, and potentially losing two of Vrana, Bertuzzi, Fabbri, and the inevitable injuries? I think we finish bottom 5-10 again. 

We're headed in the right direction, but we're not there yet.

If you believe what Yzerman has been saying, I assume you would agree that he's not done with this rebuild quite yet. I'm sure Yzerman is quite confident in himself and his staff. Yeah, I'm sure he knows they don't "need" a top 3 pick, but I'm also sure he knows it would help significantly.

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1 minute ago, krsmith17 said:

If you know a Pettersson offersheet isn't going to happen, why are you talking about where this team would be if we added Pettersson? No one is disputing that we would be a much improved team with Pettersson. I'm talking about where this team will be this coming season. Not where this team will be if we add Pettersson. We agree that it's never going to happen, so what's the point?

So now that we have that behind us, where do you realistically think this team will finish WITHOUT Pettersson, and potentially losing two of Vrana, Bertuzzi, Fabbri, and the inevitable injuries? I think we finish bottom 5-10 again. 

We're headed in the right direction, but we're not there yet.

If you believe what Yzerman has been saying, I assume you would agree that he's not done with this rebuild quite yet. I'm sure Yzerman is quite confident in himself and his staff. Yeah, I'm sure he knows they don't "need" a top 3 pick, but I'm also sure he knows it would help significantly.

It's a dying discussion form, and now we're only allowed to talk about things that are likely to happen? Tough crowd. It's something to chat about. During the offseason. On a dying forum. If you don't like the conversation, change the thread. 

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8 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

It's a dying discussion form, and now we're only allowed to talk about things that are likely to happen? Tough crowd. It's something to chat about. During the offseason. On a dying forum. If you don't like the conversation, change the thread. 

I never once said you're "not allowed to talk about" this or anything else. I don't see the point, but by all means, continue if you'd like. I was talking about what this team will look like WITHOUT Pettersson, and why it doesn't make sense to offersheet Pettersson, but you kept bringing it back to "if" we were to offersheet Pettersson...

8 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

A Pettersson offer sheet is the kind of move you make when you've solidified the rest of your roster and that is the last piece. That's when you can afford to lose those 1st round draft picks. Not before, while in the middle of a rebuild.

Exactly.

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3 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I never once said you're "not allowed to talk about" this or anything else. I don't see the point, but by all means, continue if you'd like. I was talking about what this team will look like WITHOUT Pettersson, and why it doesn't make sense to offersheet Pettersson, but you kept bringing it back to "if" we were to offersheet Pettersson...

What context am I supposed to use here. When?

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21 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

What is your obsession with Koekkoek? He's a below average defenseman at best. 

There's probably half a dozen or so guys on the market that I would take over Koekkoek...

I dunno why he has such an obsession about trading Bertuzzi, either. Pretty much every trade pkg he dreams up starts with Bertuzzi. 

19 minutes ago, marcaractac said:

It's a dying discussion form, and now we're only allowed to talk about things that are likely to happen? Tough crowd. It's something to chat about. During the offseason. On a dying forum. If you don't like the conversation, change the thread. 

This board has gone woke.

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