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The 91 of Ryans

New New Prospects Thread

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1 minute ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

We will have to wait to see.  The lineups of Colorado, Tampa Bay, and Pittsburg, Washington, Chicago. and LA (last 10 years of cup champions) have had exactly TWO Swedes (Backstrom and Hedman).  I think it's a bit early to start proclaiming Sweden the talent factory.

I don't think the point was the nationality. I think the point is that the leagues are better. Zadina, or instance, came to the CHL to play and I think you could argue he was trained badly. Might have been better off training in a Euro men's league. Svechnikov, same story. I think the CHL is trash, they just succeed because they have the best talent pool. I also think the CHL agreement keeps guys in their leagues longer than some of them should be. Plenty of instances in which guys are rushed to the NHL too early because they're too good for the CHL and can't go to the AHL.

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6 minutes ago, kipwinger said:

I don't think the point was the nationality. I think the point is that the leagues are better. Zadina, or instance, came to the CHL to play and I think you could argue he was trained badly. Might have been better off training in a Euro men's league. Svechnikov, same story. I think the CHL is trash, they just succeed because they have the best talent pool. I also think the CHL agreement keeps guys in their leagues longer than some of them should be. Plenty of instances in which guys are rushed to the NHL too early because they're too good for the CHL and can't go to the AHL.

Ahhhhh, ok.  Yah, I definiyely believe the SHL is 2nd best to the NHL, with the AHL a close 3rd.  The US Dev program has top notch talent.  After that, the Canadian Junior leagues are a real crapshoot.  Veleno was granted exceptional status in the Q and fell from top 5 pick to grinding out a bottom 6 career.  Im in agreement with you here.

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22 hours ago, kipwinger said:

I don't think the point was the nationality. I think the point is that the leagues are better. Zadina, or instance, came to the CHL to play and I think you could argue he was trained badly. Might have been better off training in a Euro men's league. Svechnikov, same story. I think the CHL is trash, they just succeed because they have the best talent pool. I also think the CHL agreement keeps guys in their leagues longer than some of them should be. Plenty of instances in which guys are rushed to the NHL too early because they're too good for the CHL and can't go to the AHL.

This is the entire story right here.

SY is writing the book on how much more effective it is to develop young players in mens leagues overseas. 

Tangent: I really do think we are living in the best timeline right now. I dont think we should look back and say "Illitch should have handed the team to SY in 2011". Best thing that ever could have happened was Holland ramming this team into the rocks for 10 years while SY cut his teeth else where. Now to return and recieve a blank slate and unlimited mandate with a refined agenda. I think we are witnessing SYs best work. His magnum opus. Hes building us a dream team. Turn of the century Wings round 2 Yzerman boogaloo. 

Edited by bIueadams

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1 hour ago, bIueadams said:

This is the entire story right here.

SY is writing the book on how much more effective it is to develop young players in mens leagues overseas. 

Tangent: I really do think we are living in the best timeline right now. I dont think we should look back and say "Illitch should have handed the team to SY in 2011". Best thing that ever could have happened was Holland ramming this team into the rocks for 10 years while SY cut his teeth else where. Now to return and recieve a blank slate and unlimited mandate with a refined agenda. I think we are witnessing SYs best work. His magnum opus. Hes building us a dream team. Turn of the century Wings round 2 Yzerman boogaloo. 

I agree.  I think this team is going to look magnificent in 2 years.  I dont see a weakness with the exception of a superstar center and a superstar winger.  We need a couple of our draft picks to blossom.  Perhaps Kasper and Soderblom will.

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6 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

https://detroithockeynow.com/2022/08/21/red-wings-prospect-sebrango-makes-world-junior-history/

 

This guy will see NHL minutes this year.  I cant believe how underrated Sebrango is amongst our fanbase.

Not sure how being the oldest player to win a wjc is impressive basically shoulda been aged out only for the shutdown last winter. I remember fans getting hyped for Ouellet thats basically Sebrangos ceiling. We dont need to get excited about these prospects anymore we have actual blue chip prospects to get excited about that will leave Sebrango in the lurch.  

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3 hours ago, redw1ngs said:

Not sure how being the oldest player to win a wjc is impressive basically shoulda been aged out only for the shutdown last winter. I remember fans getting hyped for Ouellet thats basically Sebrangos ceiling. We dont need to get excited about these prospects anymore we have actual blue chip prospects to get excited about that will leave Sebrango in the lurch.  

disagree.  I think hes gonna be great.  a perfect fit for Seider.

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7 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

disagree.  I think hes gonna be great.  a perfect fit for Seider.

I thought you were talkin bout making it but your talkin bout top pair? lol

Sebrango is around 10 or 11 on the LHD depth chart imo. Chiarot Maata Hagg Walman Oesterle Edvinsson Johansson Wallinder Buium McIsaac are ahead of him imo. 3 or 4 will probly be gone after this season but thats alot to pass to make it let alone top pair.

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2 hours ago, redw1ngs said:

I thought you were talkin bout making it but your talkin bout top pair? lol

Sebrango is around 10 or 11 on the LHD depth chart imo. Chiarot Maata Hagg Walman Oesterle Edvinsson Johansson Wallinder Buium McIsaac are ahead of him imo. 3 or 4 will probly be gone after this season but thats alot to pass to make it let alone top pair.

We will see how Grand Rapids goes this year.   If he gets top pair minutes with the Griffs, I wouldnt be surprised to see him fill in for injuries with the big club.

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1 hour ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

We will see how Grand Rapids goes this year.   If he gets top pair minutes with the Griffs, I wouldnt be surprised to see him fill in for injuries with the big club.

Hes not getting top pair minutes in D ever or GR anytime soon. Lashoff and Mcisaac are ahead of Sebrango and dont be shocked if Johansson jumps him this season to. This is assuming Edvinsson makes it in Detroit which isnt a lock either.

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28 minutes ago, redw1ngs said:

Hes not getting top pair minutes in D ever or GR anytime soon. Lashoff and Mcisaac are ahead of Sebrango and dont be shocked if Johansson jumps him this season to. This is assuming Edvinsson makes it in Detroit which isnt a lock either.

Not sure where Lashoff fits in anymore now that we have so many Dmen, especially when Pysyk and Walman return and Lash is on an AHL contract. Gotta think Pysyk at least gets played as a forward mostly. 

DET: Seider, Chiarot, Hronek, Maata, Oesterle, Lindstrom, Walman (7)

GR: Hagg, Kampfer, Edvinsson, Mcisaac, Sebrango, Johansson, Viro (7)

Toledo: Lashoff, Newpower, Barton (3)

Edited by bIueadams

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44 minutes ago, bIueadams said:

Not sure where Lashoff fits in anymore now that we have so many Dmen, especially when Pysyk and Walman return and Lash is on an AHL contract. Gotta think Pysyk at least gets played as a forward mostly. 

DET: Seider, Chiarot, Hronek, Maata, Oesterle, Lindstrom, Walman (7)

GR: Hagg, Kampfer, Edvinsson, Mcisaac, Sebrango, Johansson, Viro (7)

Toledo: Lashoff, Newpower, Barton (3)

Lashoff has been and imo still is 1 of GRs top dmen. Hes not going down to Toledo will probly still be top pair or 2 worst case.

Walman and Pysyk will be on LTIR to start and SY will probly go 13-8-2.

DET LD: Chairot/Maata/Edvinsson/Hagg/Oesterle RD: Seider/Hronek/Lindstrom

GR LD: Lashoff/Mcisaac/Sebrango/Johansson/Viro RD: Kampfer/Newpower/Barton

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2 hours ago, redw1ngs said:

Hes not getting top pair minutes in D ever or GR anytime soon. Lashoff and Mcisaac are ahead of Sebrango and dont be shocked if Johansson jumps him this season to. This is assuming Edvinsson makes it in Detroit which isnt a lock either.

I have the pairings going like this:

 

Edvinsson - Sebrango

Johansson - McIsaac

Lashoff - Newpower

 

I don't think Edvinsson gets more than 9 games in Detroit this year, and I'll bet they will be late in the season.

 

Detroit is going to carry these dmen:

 

Chiarot - Seider

Maata - Hronek

Haag - Lindstrom

Osterle - Walman (IR)

 

When Walman returns from Injury, they'll find a different Dman that needs some time on IR to heal.  The GM's know what they're doing nowadays to not have roster problems.

 

Let's see who's right!

1 hour ago, redw1ngs said:

Lashoff has been and imo still is 1 of GRs top dmen. Hes not going down to Toledo will probly still be top pair or 2 worst case.

Walman and Pysyk will be on LTIR to start and SY will probly go 13-8-2.

DET LD: Chairot/Maata/Edvinsson/Hagg/Oesterle RD: Seider/Hronek/Lindstrom

GR LD: Lashoff/Mcisaac/Sebrango/Johansson/Viro RD: Kampfer/Newpower/Barton

This is 14/7/2 in Detroit.  Or do you mean in GR?  I would agree with you that they might keep Kampfer up in Detroit to make 8.

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8 hours ago, redw1ngs said:

Lashoff has been and imo still is 1 of GRs top dmen. Hes not going down to Toledo will probly still be top pair or 2 worst case.

Walman and Pysyk will be on LTIR to start and SY will probly go 13-8-2.

DET LD: Chairot/Maata/Edvinsson/Hagg/Oesterle RD: Seider/Hronek/Lindstrom

GR LD: Lashoff/Mcisaac/Sebrango/Johansson/Viro RD: Kampfer/Newpower/Barton

Seider, Chiarot, Maata, Hronek, Hagg, Lindstrom, Oesterle, Kampfer, Pysyk (IR), Walman (IR). Thats 8 in Detroit. 

Edvinsson, Lashoff, McIsaac, Sebrango, Johansson, Viro, Barton, Newpower. That's 8 in GR. 

All due respect to the good soldier that is Brian Lashoff, but I'm not all that interested in icing a 32 year old career AHL Dman - who doesnt even have a contract with the Red Wings - while x2 actual prospects in need of ice time ride the bench. This is like benching Andreasson so that Dominik Shine can play.

SY seems to have moved past the Lashoff era, and so have I. I suspect he was only even re-signed to an AHL contract bc he is settled with his family in GR and doesnt want to play anywhere else. So why not keep him on the team as insurance for AHL peanuts. Least we can do for a guy who so loyal for so long anyway...

Kampfer, Hagg, and Pysyk may all be joining GR at different points this season as well. Lash just isn't needed much anymore. This year is likely his victory lap while they find him a spot in coaching or development. 

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17 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

This is 14/7/2 in Detroit.  Or do you mean in GR?  I would agree with you that they might keep Kampfer up in Detroit to make 8.

Try counting them again.

9 hours ago, bIueadams said:

Seider, Chiarot, Maata, Hronek, Hagg, Lindstrom, Oesterle, Kampfer, Pysyk (IR), Walman (IR). Thats 8 in Detroit. 

Edvinsson, Lashoff, McIsaac, Sebrango, Johansson, Viro, Barton, Newpower. That's 8 in GR. 

All due respect to the good soldier that is Brian Lashoff, but I'm not all that interested in icing a 32 year old career AHL Dman - who doesnt even have a contract with the Red Wings - while x2 actual prospects in need of ice time ride the bench. This is like benching Andreasson so that Dominik Shine can play.

SY seems to have moved past the Lashoff era, and so have I. I suspect he was only even re-signed to an AHL contract bc he is settled with his family in GR and doesnt want to play anywhere else. So why not keep him on the team as insurance for AHL peanuts. Least we can do for a guy who so loyal for so long anyway...

Kampfer, Hagg, and Pysyk may all be joining GR at different points this season as well. Lash just isn't needed much anymore. This year is likely his victory lap while they find him a spot in coaching or development. 

I think Edvinsson will make the team over Kampfer but well see.

Lashoff is still better then alot of the dmen on that team. Shine is probly better then Andreasson to. Not saying I would play Shine over Andreasson but dont be suprised if he does.

16 hours ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Lashoff has always been underrated.

yup.

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2 hours ago, redw1ngs said:

Try counting them again.

I think Edvinsson will make the team over Kampfer but well see.

Lashoff is still better then alot of the dmen on that team. Shine is probly better then Andreasson to. Not saying I would play Shine over Andreasson but dont be suprised if he does.

yup.

Not saying Lashoff isnt a solid AHL Dman. Im saying he doesnt have a contract with the wings, and we have more than enough prospects who do. AHL is a development league and he shouldnt be taking spots from guys like Viro and Barton who need the icetime. 

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8 minutes ago, bIueadams said:

Not saying Lashoff isnt a solid AHL Dman. Im saying he doesnt have a contract with the wings, and we have more than enough prospects who do. AHL is a development league and he shouldnt be taking spots from guys like Viro and Barton who need the icetime. 

Its a tough call, because he agreed to be papa Lash for the last 8 years.  He didnt have to give up his NHL dream, but he did and agreed to mentor the young guys for Detroit.  He could be a very big reason we havent had many prospects (zero recently) go total douchebag tinkywinky.

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31 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Its a tough call, because he agreed to be papa Lash for the last 8 years.  He didnt have to give up his NHL dream, but he did and agreed to mentor the young guys for Detroit.  He could be a very big reason we havent had many prospects (zero recently) go total douchebag tinkywinky.

GR development coach B Lash. Dan Cleary lite. 

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You can almost guarantee he'll be on the development staff at some point in the near future. He's a ride or die Red Wing company man and they'll reward him accordingly. I've never been a bit bothered by having Lashoff in GR. I think 99% of all prospects need some time learning how to be a pro hockey player in a minor league, regardless of their skill level. And guys like Lashoff are the ones who teach them how to do it.

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1 hour ago, bIueadams said:

Not saying Lashoff isnt a solid AHL Dman. Im saying he doesnt have a contract with the wings, and we have more than enough prospects who do. AHL is a development league and he shouldnt be taking spots from guys like Viro and Barton who need the icetime. 

Not having a contract with the Wings is irrelevent. Lashoff is the perfect pro to mentor these young prospects. Hes more likely to be top pair playing 20+mins/gp then Toledo. If Sebrango is Ouellet Viro and Barton are Backman and Sproul.

Edited by redw1ngs

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1 hour ago, redw1ngs said:

Not having a contract with the Wings is irrelevent. Lashoff is the perfect pro to mentor these young prospects. Hes more likely to be top pair playing 20+mins/gp then Toledo. If Sebrango is Ouellet Viro and Barton are Backman and Sproul.

I cant say what anyone is. Sebrango and Viro have entered mens leagues and played very well abormally early relative to typical routes. Barton hasnt had a chance to play much at all. 

If Newpower goes down to toledo so be it. But ill be a bit dissapointed if SY brought Viro over to the states just for Horcoff to bench or send him to Toledo in favor of a career AHLer in the twighlight of his career.

We have plenty of vets and rookies under contract. Lashoff has become a redundancy. 

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16 minutes ago, bIueadams said:

I cant say what anyone is. Sebrango and Viro have entered mens leagues and played very well abormally early relative to typical routes. Barton hasnt had a chance to play much at all. 

If Newpower goes down to toledo so be it. But ill be a bit dissapointed if SY brought Viro over to the states just for Horcoff to bench or send him to Toledo in favor of a career AHLer in the twighlight of his career.

We have plenty of vets and rookies under contract. Lashoff has become a redundancy. 

Viro sucks.

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