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GoWings1905

Member Since 27 Mar 2007
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#2531294 Wings re-sign Cleary $1.5 mill + $1mill in game bonuses

Posted by roboturner on 10 July 2014 - 06:33 PM

I think it would lighten the mood in the locker room if they had a team/teammates that they could be proud of and have confidence in.

 

I don't understand telling Alfie (who was actually pretty good last year, and actually has great leadership) he has to wait and see if he's healthy enough to play, but Cleary, who can barely stand up (and even if he could is totally useless anyway) gets a pass.




#2531287 Wings re-sign Cleary $1.5 mill + $1mill in game bonuses

Posted by roboturner on 10 July 2014 - 06:19 PM

How much of this signing has to do with the fact there is no vitality in that locker room. Waaaay too much seriousness, no Drapes, Malts, DMac, Shanny. The Room has to have characters, chemistry, and a certain amount of looseness to it.

Got to be a main reason for the signing.

I don't think bringing back the worst player on the team is going to lighten the mood in the locker room...




#2531269 Who has been Ken Holland's worst recent free agent signing?

Posted by b.shanafan14 on 10 July 2014 - 05:53 PM

All of the above. What does that tell us?




#2531200 Wings re-sign Cleary $1.5 mill + $1mill in game bonuses

Posted by GoalieManPat on 10 July 2014 - 04:49 PM

 

This same article also has Holland saying Cleary will have to beat out other players to be in the lineup. But lets ignore that because it isn;t in line with Holland bashing.

 

Do you really believe that Holland will release or demote Cleary over a youngster that can be sent down even if the youngster completely outplays Cleary?? What message does it send to the young players in the organization? They preach to them to work hard and youll earn your spot but all they end up seeing is those spots theyve earned given to players that should have been put out to pasture years ago.




#2531196 Wings re-sign Cleary $1.5 mill + $1mill in game bonuses

Posted by roboturner on 10 July 2014 - 04:47 PM

 

This same article also has Holland saying Cleary will have to beat out other players to be in the lineup. But lets ignore that because it isn;t in line with Holland bashing.

Get with it man, we all know by now that's not how it works with Holland and Babs. They say s*** like this and then do the opposite. Standard Procedure.




#2529285 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by FlashyG on 02 July 2014 - 03:25 AM

Forget Cleary, I guess we have a new 3rd Amigo

 

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#2529393 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by b.shanafan14 on 02 July 2014 - 10:47 AM

I'll say this: Holland did as well as he could with his offers to other FA that chose to go elsewhere - besides maybe Gilbert which could have been a cheap improvement and still left room for the top-2 or -4 defenseman we were seeking. Despite his compounded failure to "nut-up" in previous off-seasons, I honestly believe he did all within his power to get the players we needed this off-season (given the current sad state of the team, which is his doing). If they don't want to come here, you can't force them and shouldn't grossly overpay them.

 

However, there is absolutely ZERO excuse for the Quincey signing. That is disappointment turning into full-blown, unavoidable, mature, objective, and justified RAGE. Holland did what he always does when he misses out on his target: slaps some tape and shoe-polish on trash and tries to pass it off as a "bargain" or a "consolation prize". We aren't getting the sirloin because they ran out of prime rib; we've been fed a steady diet of cold spam. For that, Holland should be replaced.




#2529384 TANK IT! 2014-2015 Season

Posted by kipwinger on 02 July 2014 - 10:26 AM

Going a little far here.  I'm as irritated as the next guy, and probably more than most.  But rather than "tank it" how about we just give open spots to deserving kids and see what they can do?  Seemed to work out well last year.  I don't know about anybody else but I'd love to add a 6'4 200+ lb Mantha, and a 6'4 200+ lb Sproul to our lineup.  As long as he doesn't trade anything valuable away and/or sign some washed up old guy (Alfie) we could very well see

 

Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Mantha

Franzen-Weiss-Nyquist

Jurco-Sheahan-Tatar

Abby-Helm-Miller

 

Kronwall-Ericsson

Smith-Dekeyser

Quincey-Sproul

 

Probably won't compete for a Cup, maybe won't make the playoffs even.  But maybe, just maybe, we get a little bigger, a little faster, a little bit more hungry, and a little harder to play against. 




#2529338 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by kipwinger on 02 July 2014 - 08:33 AM

Some thoughts.

1. LOL!

2. I can handle not landing any UFA's. That is always a crap shoot. You can wine and dine those guys, throw lots of years and money at them, and they still may go somewhere else.

3. BUT resigning Qunicey? Terrible.

4. Holland needs to make a major move by August 1 to flip this around.

5. Those expecting us to be better because "we are healthy", please wake up and join the real world. We haven't been healthy in 3 seasons now. Most of the same old and injury prone players are coming back. Man games lost will not change much.

6. The last 3 years have produced worse winning % each year. 11/12 we won 43 games, just over 50%. in 12/13 we won 24-50%, this last season we won 39 just under 50%. That is trending the wrong way.

 

 

We consistently become less and less competitive, and yet, pundits like Malik are blaming the state of Joe Louis Arena.  Unbelievable. 

 

As I've said a thousand times.  Please, Ken Holland, don't do something stupid to make this worse.  You're already a huge embarrassing failure.  Losing Tatar or Jurco in a lopsided panic move is only going to make it worse. 

 

Don't bring anyone else in, don't over think things, don't kick tires or pick up the phone.  Just give the remaining spots to Ryan Sproul and Mantha, and in a couple years (despite your best efforts) we should be respectable again (under head coach Jeff Blashill). 




#2529320 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by Euro_Twins on 02 July 2014 - 07:52 AM

So. After a night's sleep on this I have come to realise one thing. If I tried to ignore all the posts I didn't like in this thread, I'd be left with virtually nothing to read.  :lol:
 
Seriously though, everyone really does need to just chill. We've still got a very good, competitive team that will see improvement from our kids (both at forward and D), hopefully a return to form from our number 1 goalie, hopefully a healthy season from Weiss and a full season from Datsyuk and Z. That alone should get us a good solid seeding for the playoffs. I'll bet on that. 
 
Yes the Quincey move does look a little panicked, but I still believe that he had a solid second half (I saw it with my own eyes after all, and I'm sure several others did). The thing with a D man like Quincey is, that when he is playing well, you don't notice he's there, such that if anyone asked you if he had a solid second half, you wouldn't be able to remember because he never did anything spectacularly good or bad. 
 
There is, in my opinion, absolutely no reason to panic, because we haven't had a losing season since 1991. I don't need to sit here and regurgitate the facts. But the point is, I could understand if people were being defeatist and calling for KH's head if we had a horrendous season, but the fact, is, we didn't. By all accounts it was a good season, if not miraculous. And we saw the future develop right before us that I believe will be our core for years to come. They might not contain the next D or Z, but let's face it, when those guys were rookies, did anyone ever envisage them turning into the stars they are today?
 
The point is, this team didn't get any worse at all this offseason. In fact, it got better as the kids will have another year's worth of season and playoff experience, we;ll be healthy again (touch wood), and we subtracted some old worn out parts (Bertuzzi, Samuelsson - and hopefully Cleary but that remains to be seen). Oh yea, and we've got Mantha turning pro, and several kids in GR ready to step in and actually challenge for jobs in training camp.
 
So why all the doom and gloom? There is actually a lot to like about this teams future.  


We did have a horrendous season. Barely making it into the playoffs. All the injuries. Goaltending and defense issues. What part of the season was miraculous? Just because nyquist went on an absolute tear in the last half doesn't make it a miraculous season. In fact it shows how bad we were that one (basically rookie) had to carry our team. Holland can talk about us needing that right hand shot on the blue line all he wants. Until he actually does something useful for once he has lost this loyal Holland defenders confidence.


#2529213 2014 Offseason League Signings and Trades

Posted by gcom007 on 01 July 2014 - 09:57 PM

Not sure where else to post this. Article sums up much of what has been said and speculated here.

 

http://blogs.windsor...e-agent-frenzy/

 

Brutal, but pretty dead on across the board. I hate to admit it, but this is literally the first time in all my years of being a Red Wings fan that I feel like our team is a joke in the sight of the league. I know people have disliked us for years, and I know that many are just jealous while many others it was just competitiveness, and they still clearly had respect for us. But right now, I feel like this team has become the butt of a league-wide joke, and there's enough people with long memories that are no doubt relishing in our fate.

 

It's really sad.

 

It doesn't make me feel any less love for this team, and if anything, it affirms how much I do love this team, because I hate what's happening right now, and yet I still feel as passionately as I ever have about them as a fan. All I can hope for at this point is that someone in the Illitch family steps in to make the call to reassign or fire Holland and we get someone in the GM position that's willing to make some serious changes to shake things up. As I said in another post, it may turn out good though it might turn out horribly, but we've got to try something to turn it around. Worst case scenario, we end up getting in a position to draft the talent we'll need for a real rebuild. Either way, the days of the Holland descent into mediocrity need to end, as soon as they possibly can. He's failed for too long to do what everyone including himself says they need to do, and he's gone on to sign too many players to bad deals. Enough is enough.




#2529197 2014 Offseason League Signings and Trades

Posted by VM1138 on 01 July 2014 - 09:44 PM

"My first priority was to be on a good team."  -Ehrhoff.

 

Holy crap.  Just humiliating.

 

That article also takes a dig at the Wings not being able to buy their team.  That pisses me off.  That wasn't even really the case in the pre-cap era. We spent a lot, but we got the right players. 

 

I'm thinking it's Babcock.  Almost every player suffers individually under his reign, and that lowers their future value.  Case in point: no one really wants any of our players except for Nyquist, Jurco or maybe Tatar.  So coming to Detroit could actually be bad for their careers.  He just doesn't seem to utilize some players where they would be strongest (Smith, Cleary, Quincey, Kindl, etc.)




#2529211 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by VM1138 on 01 July 2014 - 09:55 PM

 

I think a lot of people realize how terrible this Quincey signing is, but I don't think as many has a grasp of how much it means in the big picture. It's just utterly horrendous. Even if they guy wasn't as bad as he is, it's just a such a terrible thing to go and do with our image already in the toilet. You do nothing and you can at least go on trying to minimize what happened today, but signing Quincey to that deal was a grand acknowledgement of the fact that this off-season is already an epic disaster for the Detroit Red Wings.

 

Their whole reaction has made the Red Wings' image suffer.  Holland coming out and admitting he is baffled, the signing of Quincey, the big public spectacle about everyone rejecting the Wings, it does some serious damage long-term.  We can't build a successful team only through the draft.  Sooner or later we'll have to make a trade to supplement.  But I guess it's set in stone, the team's goal is to "wait and see" by struggling for a few more years and hope enough of our prospects all turn into all-stars.




#2529194 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by VM1138 on 01 July 2014 - 09:41 PM

I think it wasnt being stagnant, it was because NO ONE wanted to sign here. Holland probably got scared and did something to do something because he's lost.

 

He gave up. I can see the "lack of drive" argument.  He could've waited all summer to find a deal somewhere else.  Maybe Europe?  Instead, he signed our worst defensemen who actually cost us at least 16 games last season, gave him a raise, and closed up a roster spot.  So basically...we're done on defense.  A kid needs to get a chance.  Maybe we add someone like Vrbata, but we're basically done up front, too.

 

So on day one of free agency...Holland has already given up.  Sure, we discarded some chaff, but not enough, and we didn't actually get any better.  We can only hope we're good enough to get a higher seed in the playoffs and maybe get a more favorable matchup until we run into a team like the Bruins who are built to beat our team.




#2529166 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by Jesusberg on 01 July 2014 - 09:04 PM

You know, it really amazes me how quickly everyone seems to just want to fire KH and blow up the ship. And because of what exactly? We re-signed a guy who played well for us in the second half and has a proven track record of being a solid 3-4 D man. So we didn't sign any big name free agents, and? Did we really want Boyle here for 3 years? No. Orpik for 5 years and $5.5m? No. Niskanen for 7 years? I didn't. Stralman for 5 years? No. The list goes on and on. Guys who are cashing in on one or two good years (besides Boyle) and using the thin market to drive up their prices. It is frankly, a joke. The worst thing the wings could have done was to sign someone like that for a massive term which locks us in, blocking the path for 1 or 2 kids when they are ready either this season or next. 

 

Why is it that we are so quick to lambast something that we don't like, yet it takes 100 things to satisfy us? I mean, for crying out loud, we're not the Leafs. It's not like we haven't won a cup in the last 50 years. And also, it's not even like we're not competitive anymore. This team was a playoff team. Granted, the last 2 years have been touch and go, but 2 years ago we took the cup champs to 7 and had them on the ropes. In that 2012-13 roster, there were 26 players who were part of this seasons roster. 26!!!!!!!! And this season, most were injured, and yet somehow, due to some strong play of guys who will form the future of this team, we made it in. 

 

There is, quite clearly, a rebuild in progress at the moment. And it amazes me how people can't seem to get excited about the future prospects of Dekeyser, Tatar, Nyquist, Sheahan, Jurco, Sproul, Marchenko, Ouellet, Mantha, Mrazek. Combined with a healthy D and Z and the other GOOD pieces we have on this team. So what's changed? Why has everyone become so despondent, when really, I think our time is coming right around the corner. Maybe not this year, but the year after for sure. If our kids continue trending upwards, we'll be right up there. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but to ignore the obvious positives that are emanating from this teams future and insist on throwing everything out in the trash just because we struck out on 1 day of the year is, in my eyes, nuts. 

Honestly, I don't disagree with you on several of these points. However, in my opinion, there's very little to like about signing Kyle Quincey. Many people (including myself) were advocating a stop-gap, someone to let the kids slip into the line-up without them being overwhelmed. At the very least, those stop-gaps brought something extra to the table - Boyle and Gilbert could help the PP, Stralman and Morris the PK. What does Quincey bring? Dead serious, I don't have a real answer to that question, no matter how hard I try.

To call the guy a solid #3-4 defender just doesn't ring true to me. He doesn't put up points, he doesn't hit or block many shots. He takes several, poorly timed penalties. To his credit, the guy's swept a few pucks out from right in front of the goal line, but all in all, I'd say Kyle Quincey is just... there. He exists and has the physical endurance to play "top 4 minutes" on this team, and he was given a raise?

I think the real issue behind the signing is that it comes off as a panic move - it feels like it was made to just barely cling on, to "play it safe". I think playing it safe would have been grabbing Boyle, Gilbert, Morris, etc. I know those guys didn't want to be here, wanted term, etc. but grabbing Kyle Quincey strikes me as playing it scared. It reminds me of grabbing Legwand because Holland needed this team to squeeze into the post-season.

I see the positives going forward - I see the youth of this team and the defensive core that is shaping up. What I also see is that Kyle Quincey is a bane on this team's blueline - he's not going to pass anything onto the kids, and he won't be adding anything positive to this team's defense corps for the next two seasons. He doesn't ruin this team's future - he just wades in the water doing nothing around it.