Wing Across The Pond

Heck no, I love meat.  I'm actually thinking about getting a burger for lunch.

This obviously goes deeper than polar bears.  If Henrik Zetterberg killed an endangered seal with a harpoon in Sweden, I'd be more willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, because I didn't start with the assumption that Zetterberg is a POS.

It was just tough for me to accept that we needed to pay a premium for a 29-year old hack would was a healthy scratch for a team that cleaned our clocks in April, yet can barely get to the cap floor in salaries.  I think part of their success was DUE to the fact that guys like Tootoo weren't running guys in the corner for no reason.

http://www.sportsnet..._predators_nhl/

So you basically admit that this topic is irrelevant? Insomuch as it's based entirely on your prejudice against a man that you simply don't like? You'd give Z the benefit of the doubt for much the same offense because he's not, as you put it, a POS... a man fiercely proud of his heritage which is slowly dying out, who is employed to play a role and has the added baggage of the hassle that comes with it, namely people saying he's a POS when they don't know him. I say let him play and then criticise dude.

Please oh please can the lockout end so that we can get back to hockey so that I don't have to hear about Jordin Tootoo's bear hunting desires?

Yeah, we really need to get playing again... getting way too political on here these days

This sucks. Was a horrible incident though and I guess taking a puck to the head is always going to take longer to recover from that a hit to the head. I think saving graces are that we're pretty flush on offense at the moment and a lockout could give him more time to recover but boy I want to see Eaves skating again soon.

Since there isn't much going on (still), thought I'd put up this picture that was just shared by the Detroit Red Wings Facebook...

Monster sure looks good in the red and white, and I have to say those pads look sweet. Simple, crisp white. Like an Ice Monster Excited for the new season when I see things like this.

Messier or Shanny are good shouts. Don't think Shanny would be offered it though, just something about him doesn't seem to fit as commish to me but Messier is pretty much perfect for it. As ogreslayer said though, it'll be that dude in the suit...

This is brought up a lot when it comes to replacing old Bettman. Being commissioner entails more than ust giving awkward stuttering interviews and handing over the cup to a new team each summer. It's a high demand position requiring an educational background in law and labor relations. I don't think any former player except maybe Ken Dryden could make a crack at it.

Thing is it only has to involve law and labour relations in terms of hockey. Any career player and coach/gm/league official could do it as they've lived it. Plus there will be advisors for that stuff. I think it'll be good to have a commish who can provide a much needed link between hockey talent (players, coaches, etc), and hockey businessmen. Think how much smoother negotiations with the NHLPA would be if a former player was commish?

He deserves a Cup, I don't think he will stay in Calgary if they don't make the playoffs

He wont stay. They don't want him and he doesn't want to stay... APPARENTLY. Rumour has it they want to rebuild and he doesn't/doesn't think he'll fit. I'd love him here.

Iggy is my favourite along with Vinny. Best days are behind them both but still love them. Vinny mainly for sticking with a sunbelt team (even though they are pretty good) and for all the work he's done in the community (children's hospital and all). Both just seem like guys I'd have a drink and a laugh with.

Who are the phylers?

The only shot the Wings always had of landing a #1 defenceman was by trading. Nashville has to spend 24 million just to get to the cap floor. They will match the offer and then thank Philly for helping them lock up Weber for life.

This is the most interest point made here you know... because say he had no intention of really resigning in NSH, this guarantees he will. HA! So Philly basically did the negotiating for them, found a contract he'd take, then just crossed out the name and wrote their own "Shea Weber signs with Philadelphia Flyer NAshWillE PredIITors"

Just to make it clear, I wasn't necessarily saying "come here" just wanted thoughts on his comeback in general. He is 42 after all. Don't think he'd fit here anymore, plus don't think he'd come back. Also makes that 1 day contract he signed to retire a Star all the more ridiculous in hindsight

Is it just me, or do teams that go deep into the playoffs not do so because of good defense, but because of good defense and a strong defensive forwards? I mean Lidstrom and Scott Niedermayer are the only two D men to win the Conn Smythe in the last 10 years and that was for their offense. Whereas a lot of the forwards who have won it have been defensively minded in their series (think Z, Toews, Richards - again thinking last 10 years). I mean more Goaltenders have won it that defensemen. I understand good D is still vital (that goal for NSH this year still haunts my thoughts... just watching all 3 players follow the puck... oh goodness) but if we get a good solid defensive structure and the players get some confidence in them going into the playoffs, does anything still think we could steal a round or two by having players like Z, or Dats, or Helm, or Flip, Abby, etc playing strong on D as well?

That and Jimmy keeping this season's early numbers rolling all year. Just looking for some positivity as I think we still have the best group of 2-way forwards in this league

Nah dood, if we overpay just one guy we'll be the laughing stock of the NHL and our franchise will be crippled for decades to come!  Hide the Money!  Corral the assets!

esteef

As I mentioned earlier, I don't think Holland is against overpaying, just not for guys that are going to be dogs*** in 10 years when we're still paying them $7-7.5 at 40. Overpay for someone like Weber who is going to remain a Top 5 D man for a good number of years, not for Suter who was the best of what was on offer. I mean think about it, if we get Weber next year for the same contract that Suter is on now, we get the better deal. After all Suter wasn't the best on the blue line in NSH whilst Weber was there, so surely we'd be getting the better player for the same price? In my mind that's better business than throwing the money at the best of what's available and then having someone else take a better player the next year. Hope I'm making sense in all this...

This sounds like the same cop-out you've been using since Suter was signed. You've constantly said that Holland should have made some move or another to secure a good replacement for Lidstrom, but you've just as constantly refused to give any examples of what you feel he should have done. Please give some, as your behavior is strongly indicating that you don't actually have any at all.

For one I don't think Holland expected the retirement this season. Yes he should have been planning a replacement but maybe giving Smith time this year was part of that. I think Lids' ankle injury forced his hand a bit and then Holland was feeling the strain and thought he needed to sign someone for this season. I would go out and say that most of us here probably couldn't give a definitive name to replace him because we'd all make snap decisions on what this team needs NOW without giving it all the though a GM necessarily would to assess the best possible solution. For example I wouldn't be able to give you a good name to replace Lidstrom, because I haven't seen our D in action yet and found the areas where they greatly need improving... if at all any of this makes sense?

We're sitting pretty. In order to address needs most teams will have to create other ones to do so.
When spending big bucks it's gotta be the right guy at the right price.
I think we overpayed a little for Tootoo and Gustavsson and I don't understand the Samuelsson signing but the biggest coup is that we didn't sign Parise and/or Suter to those ridiculous contracts, not throwing a crazy offer at Semin and not overpaying for the other defensemen that were available, I think by season's end Smith will be better than most if not all them for a lot less, an opportunity he never would have had had we signed one of them

Cheapness has nothing to do with it it's not his money and Illitch wants him to spend it. They're goal is winning the Cup and overpaying for players just because we have the cap space would make it harder to achieve that goal.

No, he'll spend when it makes sense, not chase and over pay for above average players, or mid range guys, just because we have money or cap space, thus hand cuffing our team...

There were only two prizes this year, THAT'S IT

They chose to play in Minnesota together, and for a ridiculous amount at that, and it didn't mater what anyone else offered them, because their minds were already made up...

No one else in this FA class is worth the money, and more importantly, the term they've been getting... Other teams can continue to f' themselves with horrible contracts (Ville Leino says hello), I'll just sit back and be grateful the horrendous arm-chair GM's on LGW don't run this team, and we have someone like Holland to know the difference...

So to summarize, Kenny's too cheap to get the players he really needs.  No one's saying blow the whole f***in' wad every year, that's just your tired response to any Holland criticism whatsoever.  I'm tired of seeing retreads and reclamation projects, and then a bunch of excuses on why he didn't do better in acquiring guys.  The "everybody's too expensive" excuse is starting to wear thin, especially when he's holding 16 miliion dollars.

esteef

Lumped these 4 quotes together because they all make good points. We didn't overpay this FA but still have a lot of cash left over. I agree, the contracts that were given to Suter and Parise were pretty horrible considering their length and price and I'm glad we didn't get stuck in that mess. Yet I also agree with esteef that we need to get someone big. I would say, however, that for the money that's on the table for players these days more ARE actually too expensive. Suter and Parise are good but they're not elite, best players in the league. Therefore I'm glad we didn't sign them to those levels of contract. I would offer it to Weber next year though, a long term, high money deal, as he is a Top 5 premier defenceman in this league and will continue to be for years to come. THAT, I think, is the difference with keeping the money and bringing in players to fill the gaps, and dolling out a large contract. They have to be worth the money when they're pushing 40 like Lids has been. I know it's incomparable with other defencemen in this era but he was worth the money after all those years. Much like Brodeur is worth the $5m or whatever it was that he got, because he's still a game changer even into his twilight. Suter and Parise wont be IMO, Weber could well be.

Overpaying? At $7.5 Million each? They were getting $110 Million dollar offers elsewhere. I call that a pretty damn good deal especially when they are far and away the top 2 guys in the free agent market.

When they're both 40 and you're still stuck with a cap hit of $7.5m it wont look like such a good deal. And you shoot yourself in the foot with the "far and away the top 2 guys in the free agent market". Means nothing in the context of the league. They could well be only top 50 in the league yet are earning top 5 numbers because they were all that was on offer. They're not Crosby, Stamkos, Malkin, Datsyuk, Kane, Toews, Sedins, etc. They're good, but not league leaders. Imagine a FA pool that has no big stars in it, starts with borderline 2nd line players, most likely 3rd liners, do you pay them $5m because they're the best on offer? Nah. Holland may have offered them more than they were worth as well but anyway you slice it, it's still overpayment

I can see us trying hard for Nash, but I can't see us giving up Flip, not because he's worth so much to us (which I think he is) but simply because I can't see Holland dumping him in Columbus after all he's given us over the years. If they do use him in a trade it'll be for Ryan so that Flip gets to play with Selanne and we can at least thank him for his service. For some reason I don't see a GM who history has shown respects his players so much, just dump a good promising player who has given his all for a team from the draft onto a bland team where he wont shine or have anything going for him. If Flip goes it'll be to Anaheim

Are people here really complaining about player salaries and contract lengths? This is too funny. No Wings fans had issues when the Wings were able to outspend small markets and pick up a Hull and Robitaille in the offseason but when another team is able to sign players the Wings covet the system is broken?

Players are worth what owners will pay them. Period. Grow up.

If the Wings don't want to overpay for a Parise and Suter then they will have cap flexibility moving forward to make a play at a Weber next year or to make a trade for a guy and have the cap room to make it work.

People aren't really complaining about us not securing players like we did pre-cap. Your example isn't applicable since there were no restrictions back when they signed the players you mentioned. What we're discussing here is that increasing caps are forcing teams to overpay, and some don't have the money to do that. If anything, what you argued about the Wings pre-cap proves us right. We spent big because we could, other teams may not have because they couldn't. With an increasing cap teams are feeling like they can spend money that they don't have. Then you wonder why teams like Phoenix are struggling and needing league help financially. Nothing to do with people complaining that we didn't land a certain player.

Problem with that though, the players in a sense force the owners hands in giving out those big contracts.  Afterall, if Detroit, Nashville, and Pittsburgh all said Suter... Parise...  We're giving you 5 mil a year, for 5 years (which probably would have been an ideal deal for them), you'd still have a GM like Minnesotta, who goes... hmm.. I'll overpay.  I need to make a splash to boost our teams awareness through the community, and league, and help revenue streams.   You're always going to have that happen.   There's no doubt in my mind too, that these players, get these offers, and their agent immediately goes to the next owner/gm in line who's interested and leverage one team/deal against the others, continuing to drive up the salary.  Every day that went by since July 1, I guarantee the offers for Parise and Suter were increasing in millions daily.

In that CBA, they've got to set max contract lengths, and make the penalties for trading/cutting a player more severe to a teams current salary cap if they cut, or move a guy.  I'm sure it works similar to the NFL where that signing bonus that gets pro-rated over the length becomes a penalty if a player is cut, released, or traded that counts against your cap.  It's obvious whats going on with these deals, there's no intent probably for Suter, or Parise to play out those 13 year deals.  It's that long simply to spread out the signing bonus over a longer period of time to reduce that annual salary.  It's got to change IMO.

Indeed. Of course it is. It's a way of circumventing the cap, or in simpler terms, "breaking the rules", at least those set out to govern contracts. Essentially. But because there isn't yet a specific rule about it, it isn't technically against the rules. I know players will claim that they sign these contracts because they truly want to spend the rest of their career at an organisation/love the team/have always had a soft spot for X place since they were a child, but you can simply say "well after your 5 year contract is done (say that's MAX length), just resign. Nothing against that and if you really feel all those things towards this team you can have the opportunity to take a cut and help the team further". Then when they say no we'll all know that they just want the money and the security of not necessarily having to be the best in the league to secure big money contracts. They can take their foot off the gas slightly, in other words.

Jonathan Ericsson. Knock, knock, it's destiny calling.

A quote is a simple thing. It has no physical form but for the movement of lips or the vibration of air, perhaps even the paper or screen on which it is recorded, yet at it's heart it is entirely simple. It is but words strung together. Different words for different means. Poetic words, strong words, abusive words, kind words. Words that question, words that rally, words that challenge or accept. But simple words none the less. There is a famous quote, one that many of you may have seen numerous time before, even in this very place, that consists of words in equation:

'To whom much is given, much is expected'.

A sort of Yin and Yang if you will. Action and reaction. Yet still a quote of simple powerlessness. For a quote can only acquire strength and meaning through situation. A moment in time where mere words define action in such a way as to have been meant. To have been written in the stars.

Some people in this world believe strongly in things that others may cast aside as legend or myth, believe in structure and purpose against chance and coincidence. Fate. I cannot say I am one of these people, yet I do believe in opportunity to design your own fate. To control a personal destiny if you so choose to take your chances. Jonathan Ericsson? His time is now.

I was talking with a friend earlier today about the less than promising situation facing us this year following the departure of Lidstrom and Stuart, and whilst big things were said about the future of Smith and his potential to be a great of the future I couldn't shake the idea within my head that this could be the single greatest opportunity that Ericsson's life will throw his way. Something inside me seems to be wishing him to be the replacement for Lidstrom that we've all been searching for. Wishing for! Yes, I can't deny he's a whipping boy at times, yet I struggle to think of such a time in recent history. Yes, he's made mistakes on the ice, yet again I struggle to think of others who hadn't also. As a player drafted and trained by this single organisation, moulded into the player that they entirely wanted him to be, cannot simply be put down to chance. There must be a reason for his journey through this team. A young Swede who loves the game and has worked hard in the shadow of possibly the greatest defenceman of all time, a countryman and icon whom he wills to be like one day. A player who has grown to be strong defensively, in his own zone, much like the icon he once used to watch. He isn't near that level yet but there are many years left in the tank and he can only move forward.

Whereas some see a hole on the blue line in the vacated space left by Lidstrom, a void that cannot be filled entirely but partially patched over in the hope that nobody will notice, I cannot help but see an opportunity. Following a solid season from Ericsson, earning ice time in a variety of situations designed to test his skill and nerve and desire, his "metal", I do not look at the coincidence of an ever-improving player and a newly-retired legend. Yin and Yang again. Two sides to the same coin. I instead look towards the opportunity. A chance for a young player to provide the situation for which the quote can draw meaning. A young player to whom much has been given and now has the chance to pay back in full. In retirement, as in much of his career, Nick Lidstrom is incomparable, yet if it had to be done with this Red Wings roster I see no better candidate than Ericsson. He's not flashy. He's stable. He's not devastating. He's smart. His offensive game lacks a little something but nothing that cannot be gained with practice. He could have the skill set and the personality to be another truly great defenceman in the mould of the Red Wings system, not simply a spare part brought in with the hope that it fits. After all, these can be notoriously hit and miss (White as a potential Rafalski replacement springs to mind).

Perhaps nothing of this has sunk in with anyone who happens to read it. Perhaps Ericsson will be nothing more than what I have outlined: a solid, sensible, and smart 2nd pairing D-man. Perhaps my tiredness has got the better of me and has rendered me delirious, yet something inside of me cannot shake this feeling that this year, with a little confidence and a bit of belief, Jonathan Ericsson could start to pay back a little of all that has been invested in him. Oh well, at the very least one can hope.