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Wing Across The Pond

Member Since 05 Jul 2007
Offline Last Active Dec 14 2015 01:14 PM

#2418528 Red Wings Lineups for Other Sports

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 08 June 2013 - 06:51 AM


Right on.    :thumbup:


Unfortunately, we don't have much of a striker.   :tounge:   Chelsea fans will understand.  




I don't know much about formations but if I'm looking at that right, Helm/Flip are defensive mids, Dats line are attacking mids, right? And I'm guessing the striker position doesn't do as much work as everyone else except trying to score goals?



Soccer  (4-2-3-1 formation)





White - Ericsson - Dekeyser - Kronwall


                 Helm - Filppula


      Brunner - Datsyuk - Zetterberg




It still amazes me how much North Americans are getting into football/soccer. It's nice to see from a British perspective :) Now if only you could do the same with rugby! 


I like that team as well, although would like E in the defensive midfield slot for his occasional long ball peaches. 

#2331476 Jordin Tootoo & Polar Bears

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 13 October 2012 - 03:21 AM

Heck no, I love meat. I'm actually thinking about getting a burger for lunch.

This obviously goes deeper than polar bears. If Henrik Zetterberg killed an endangered seal with a harpoon in Sweden, I'd be more willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, because I didn't start with the assumption that Zetterberg is a POS.

It was just tough for me to accept that we needed to pay a premium for a 29-year old hack would was a healthy scratch for a team that cleaned our clocks in April, yet can barely get to the cap floor in salaries. I think part of their success was DUE to the fact that guys like Tootoo weren't running guys in the corner for no reason.


So you basically admit that this topic is irrelevant? Insomuch as it's based entirely on your prejudice against a man that you simply don't like? You'd give Z the benefit of the doubt for much the same offense because he's not, as you put it, a POS... a man fiercely proud of his heritage which is slowly dying out, who is employed to play a role and has the added baggage of the hassle that comes with it, namely people saying he's a POS when they don't know him. I say let him play and then criticise dude.

Please oh please can the lockout end so that we can get back to hockey so that I don't have to hear about Jordin Tootoo's bear hunting desires?

Yeah, we really need to get playing again... getting way too political on here these days :confused:

#2327971 Patrick Eaves Skating again

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 07 September 2012 - 12:53 PM

This sucks. Was a horrible incident though and I guess taking a puck to the head is always going to take longer to recover from that a hit to the head. I think saving graces are that we're pretty flush on offense at the moment and a lockout could give him more time to recover but boy I want to see Eaves skating again soon.

#2327808 Monster All Padded Up...

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 05 September 2012 - 04:59 PM

Since there isn't much going on (still), thought I'd put up this picture that was just shared by the Detroit Red Wings Facebook...

Monster sure looks good in the red and white, and I have to say those pads look sweet. Simple, crisp white. Like an Ice Monster :) Excited for the new season when I see things like this.

Posted Image

#2323074 Who is your favorite player from a team besides the Wings?

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 30 July 2012 - 04:55 PM

He deserves a Cup, I don't think he will stay in Calgary if they don't make the playoffs

He wont stay. They don't want him and he doesn't want to stay... APPARENTLY. Rumour has it they want to rebuild and he doesn't/doesn't think he'll fit. I'd love him here.

Iggy is my favourite along with Vinny. Best days are behind them both but still love them. Vinny mainly for sticking with a sunbelt team (even though they are pretty good) and for all the work he's done in the community (children's hospital and all). Both just seem like guys I'd have a drink and a laugh with.

#2320349 Flyers sign Weber to offer sheet: 14y/$110m ($56m 1st 4yrs)

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 19 July 2012 - 12:21 PM

Who are the phylers?

The only shot the Wings always had of landing a #1 defenceman was by trading. Nashville has to spend 24 million just to get to the cap floor. They will match the offer and then thank Philly for helping them lock up Weber for life.

This is the most interest point made here you know... because say he had no intention of really resigning in NSH, this guarantees he will. HA! So Philly basically did the negotiating for them, found a contract he'd take, then just crossed out the name and wrote their own "Shea Weber signs with Philadelphia Flyer NAshWillE PredIITors"

#2319577 Mike Modano pondering comeback?

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 17 July 2012 - 03:45 PM

Just to make it clear, I wasn't necessarily saying "come here" just wanted thoughts on his comeback in general. He is 42 after all. Don't think he'd fit here anymore, plus don't think he'd come back. Also makes that 1 day contract he signed to retire a Star all the more ridiculous in hindsight

#2318859 How bad are we if our roster is now finalized?

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 13 July 2012 - 06:58 AM

Is it just me, or do teams that go deep into the playoffs not do so because of good defense, but because of good defense and a strong defensive forwards? I mean Lidstrom and Scott Niedermayer are the only two D men to win the Conn Smythe in the last 10 years and that was for their offense. Whereas a lot of the forwards who have won it have been defensively minded in their series (think Z, Toews, Richards - again thinking last 10 years). I mean more Goaltenders have won it that defensemen. I understand good D is still vital (that goal for NSH this year still haunts my thoughts... just watching all 3 players follow the puck... oh goodness) but if we get a good solid defensive structure and the players get some confidence in them going into the playoffs, does anything still think we could steal a round or two by having players like Z, or Dats, or Helm, or Flip, Abby, etc playing strong on D as well?

That and Jimmy keeping this season's early numbers rolling all year. Just looking for some positivity as I think we still have the best group of 2-way forwards in this league

#2318456 How bad are we if our roster is now finalized?

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 12 July 2012 - 05:43 AM

This sounds like the same cop-out you've been using since Suter was signed. You've constantly said that Holland should have made some move or another to secure a good replacement for Lidstrom, but you've just as constantly refused to give any examples of what you feel he should have done. Please give some, as your behavior is strongly indicating that you don't actually have any at all.

For one I don't think Holland expected the retirement this season. Yes he should have been planning a replacement but maybe giving Smith time this year was part of that. I think Lids' ankle injury forced his hand a bit and then Holland was feeling the strain and thought he needed to sign someone for this season. I would go out and say that most of us here probably couldn't give a definitive name to replace him because we'd all make snap decisions on what this team needs NOW without giving it all the though a GM necessarily would to assess the best possible solution. For example I wouldn't be able to give you a good name to replace Lidstrom, because I haven't seen our D in action yet and found the areas where they greatly need improving... if at all any of this makes sense? :confused:

We're sitting pretty. In order to address needs most teams will have to create other ones to do so.
When spending big bucks it's gotta be the right guy at the right price.
I think we overpayed a little for Tootoo and Gustavsson and I don't understand the Samuelsson signing but the biggest coup is that we didn't sign Parise and/or Suter to those ridiculous contracts, not throwing a crazy offer at Semin and not overpaying for the other defensemen that were available, I think by season's end Smith will be better than most if not all them for a lot less, an opportunity he never would have had had we signed one of them

Cheapness has nothing to do with it it's not his money and Illitch wants him to spend it. They're goal is winning the Cup and overpaying for players just because we have the cap space would make it harder to achieve that goal.

No, he'll spend when it makes sense, not chase and over pay for above average players, or mid range guys, just because we have money or cap space, thus hand cuffing our team...

There were only two prizes this year, THAT'S IT

They chose to play in Minnesota together, and for a ridiculous amount at that, and it didn't mater what anyone else offered them, because their minds were already made up...

No one else in this FA class is worth the money, and more importantly, the term they've been getting... Other teams can continue to f' themselves with horrible contracts (Ville Leino says hello), I'll just sit back and be grateful the horrendous arm-chair GM's on LGW don't run this team, and we have someone like Holland to know the difference...

So to summarize, Kenny's too cheap to get the players he really needs. No one's saying blow the whole f***in' wad every year, that's just your tired response to any Holland criticism whatsoever. I'm tired of seeing retreads and reclamation projects, and then a bunch of excuses on why he didn't do better in acquiring guys. The "everybody's too expensive" excuse is starting to wear thin, especially when he's holding 16 miliion dollars.


Lumped these 4 quotes together because they all make good points. We didn't overpay this FA but still have a lot of cash left over. I agree, the contracts that were given to Suter and Parise were pretty horrible considering their length and price and I'm glad we didn't get stuck in that mess. Yet I also agree with esteef that we need to get someone big. I would say, however, that for the money that's on the table for players these days more ARE actually too expensive. Suter and Parise are good but they're not elite, best players in the league. Therefore I'm glad we didn't sign them to those levels of contract. I would offer it to Weber next year though, a long term, high money deal, as he is a Top 5 premier defenceman in this league and will continue to be for years to come. THAT, I think, is the difference with keeping the money and bringing in players to fill the gaps, and dolling out a large contract. They have to be worth the money when they're pushing 40 like Lids has been. I know it's incomparable with other defencemen in this era but he was worth the money after all those years. Much like Brodeur is worth the $5m or whatever it was that he got, because he's still a game changer even into his twilight. Suter and Parise wont be IMO, Weber could well be.

#2318131 How bad are we if our roster is now finalized?

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 11 July 2012 - 09:37 AM

Overpaying? At $7.5 Million each? They were getting $110 Million dollar offers elsewhere. I call that a pretty damn good deal especially when they are far and away the top 2 guys in the free agent market.

When they're both 40 and you're still stuck with a cap hit of $7.5m it wont look like such a good deal. And you shoot yourself in the foot with the "far and away the top 2 guys in the free agent market". Means nothing in the context of the league. They could well be only top 50 in the league yet are earning top 5 numbers because they were all that was on offer. They're not Crosby, Stamkos, Malkin, Datsyuk, Kane, Toews, Sedins, etc. They're good, but not league leaders. Imagine a FA pool that has no big stars in it, starts with borderline 2nd line players, most likely 3rd liners, do you pay them $5m because they're the best on offer? Nah. Holland may have offered them more than they were worth as well but anyway you slice it, it's still overpayment

#2318073 Six teams on Nash's trade "list", none Canadian

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 11 July 2012 - 06:41 AM

I can see us trying hard for Nash, but I can't see us giving up Flip, not because he's worth so much to us (which I think he is) but simply because I can't see Holland dumping him in Columbus after all he's given us over the years. If they do use him in a trade it'll be for Ryan so that Flip gets to play with Selanne and we can at least thank him for his service. For some reason I don't see a GM who history has shown respects his players so much, just dump a good promising player who has given his all for a team from the draft onto a bland team where he wont shine or have anything going for him. If Flip goes it'll be to Anaheim

#2316295 The Ever-Increasing Cap, Ridiculous Contracts, and Hitting

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 06 July 2012 - 10:58 AM

Are people here really complaining about player salaries and contract lengths? This is too funny. No Wings fans had issues when the Wings were able to outspend small markets and pick up a Hull and Robitaille in the offseason but when another team is able to sign players the Wings covet the system is broken?

Players are worth what owners will pay them. Period. Grow up.

If the Wings don't want to overpay for a Parise and Suter then they will have cap flexibility moving forward to make a play at a Weber next year or to make a trade for a guy and have the cap room to make it work.

People aren't really complaining about us not securing players like we did pre-cap. Your example isn't applicable since there were no restrictions back when they signed the players you mentioned. What we're discussing here is that increasing caps are forcing teams to overpay, and some don't have the money to do that. If anything, what you argued about the Wings pre-cap proves us right. We spent big because we could, other teams may not have because they couldn't. With an increasing cap teams are feeling like they can spend money that they don't have. Then you wonder why teams like Phoenix are struggling and needing league help financially. Nothing to do with people complaining that we didn't land a certain player.

#2315636 The Ever-Increasing Cap, Ridiculous Contracts, and Hitting

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 05 July 2012 - 11:15 AM

Problem with that though, the players in a sense force the owners hands in giving out those big contracts. Afterall, if Detroit, Nashville, and Pittsburgh all said Suter... Parise... We're giving you 5 mil a year, for 5 years (which probably would have been an ideal deal for them), you'd still have a GM like Minnesotta, who goes... hmm.. I'll overpay. I need to make a splash to boost our teams awareness through the community, and league, and help revenue streams. You're always going to have that happen. There's no doubt in my mind too, that these players, get these offers, and their agent immediately goes to the next owner/gm in line who's interested and leverage one team/deal against the others, continuing to drive up the salary. Every day that went by since July 1, I guarantee the offers for Parise and Suter were increasing in millions daily.

In that CBA, they've got to set max contract lengths, and make the penalties for trading/cutting a player more severe to a teams current salary cap if they cut, or move a guy. I'm sure it works similar to the NFL where that signing bonus that gets pro-rated over the length becomes a penalty if a player is cut, released, or traded that counts against your cap. It's obvious whats going on with these deals, there's no intent probably for Suter, or Parise to play out those 13 year deals. It's that long simply to spread out the signing bonus over a longer period of time to reduce that annual salary. It's got to change IMO.

Indeed. Of course it is. It's a way of circumventing the cap, or in simpler terms, "breaking the rules", at least those set out to govern contracts. Essentially. But because there isn't yet a specific rule about it, it isn't technically against the rules. I know players will claim that they sign these contracts because they truly want to spend the rest of their career at an organisation/love the team/have always had a soft spot for X place since they were a child, but you can simply say "well after your 5 year contract is done (say that's MAX length), just resign. Nothing against that and if you really feel all those things towards this team you can have the opportunity to take a cut and help the team further". Then when they say no we'll all know that they just want the money and the security of not necessarily having to be the best in the league to secure big money contracts. They can take their foot off the gas slightly, in other words.

#2315236 Jonathan Ericsson. Knock, knock...

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 04 July 2012 - 08:21 PM

Jonathan Ericsson. Knock, knock, it's destiny calling.

A quote is a simple thing. It has no physical form but for the movement of lips or the vibration of air, perhaps even the paper or screen on which it is recorded, yet at it's heart it is entirely simple. It is but words strung together. Different words for different means. Poetic words, strong words, abusive words, kind words. Words that question, words that rally, words that challenge or accept. But simple words none the less. There is a famous quote, one that many of you may have seen numerous time before, even in this very place, that consists of words in equation:

'To whom much is given, much is expected'.

A sort of Yin and Yang if you will. Action and reaction. Yet still a quote of simple powerlessness. For a quote can only acquire strength and meaning through situation. A moment in time where mere words define action in such a way as to have been meant. To have been written in the stars.

Some people in this world believe strongly in things that others may cast aside as legend or myth, believe in structure and purpose against chance and coincidence. Fate. I cannot say I am one of these people, yet I do believe in opportunity to design your own fate. To control a personal destiny if you so choose to take your chances. Jonathan Ericsson? His time is now.

I was talking with a friend earlier today about the less than promising situation facing us this year following the departure of Lidstrom and Stuart, and whilst big things were said about the future of Smith and his potential to be a great of the future I couldn't shake the idea within my head that this could be the single greatest opportunity that Ericsson's life will throw his way. Something inside me seems to be wishing him to be the replacement for Lidstrom that we've all been searching for. Wishing for! Yes, I can't deny he's a whipping boy at times, yet I struggle to think of such a time in recent history. Yes, he's made mistakes on the ice, yet again I struggle to think of others who hadn't also. As a player drafted and trained by this single organisation, moulded into the player that they entirely wanted him to be, cannot simply be put down to chance. There must be a reason for his journey through this team. A young Swede who loves the game and has worked hard in the shadow of possibly the greatest defenceman of all time, a countryman and icon whom he wills to be like one day. A player who has grown to be strong defensively, in his own zone, much like the icon he once used to watch. He isn't near that level yet but there are many years left in the tank and he can only move forward.

Whereas some see a hole on the blue line in the vacated space left by Lidstrom, a void that cannot be filled entirely but partially patched over in the hope that nobody will notice, I cannot help but see an opportunity. Following a solid season from Ericsson, earning ice time in a variety of situations designed to test his skill and nerve and desire, his "metal", I do not look at the coincidence of an ever-improving player and a newly-retired legend. Yin and Yang again. Two sides to the same coin. I instead look towards the opportunity. A chance for a young player to provide the situation for which the quote can draw meaning. A young player to whom much has been given and now has the chance to pay back in full. In retirement, as in much of his career, Nick Lidstrom is incomparable, yet if it had to be done with this Red Wings roster I see no better candidate than Ericsson. He's not flashy. He's stable. He's not devastating. He's smart. His offensive game lacks a little something but nothing that cannot be gained with practice. He could have the skill set and the personality to be another truly great defenceman in the mould of the Red Wings system, not simply a spare part brought in with the hope that it fits. After all, these can be notoriously hit and miss (White as a potential Rafalski replacement springs to mind).

Perhaps nothing of this has sunk in with anyone who happens to read it. Perhaps Ericsson will be nothing more than what I have outlined: a solid, sensible, and smart 2nd pairing D-man. Perhaps my tiredness has got the better of me and has rendered me delirious, yet something inside of me cannot shake this feeling that this year, with a little confidence and a bit of belief, Jonathan Ericsson could start to pay back a little of all that has been invested in him. Oh well, at the very least one can hope.

#2315172 Has the Detroit diamond lost it's shine?

Posted by Wing Across The Pond on 04 July 2012 - 07:07 PM

Hi, I'm Gabriel, and occasionally I like to come on and dish out some logic in the face of illogical statements.

In reality, my post had little to do with the actual Suter and Parise and more with the concept of them. As a free agent, what would attract people to Detroit? The glamour seems to be gone. However, I should have realized that people are too butt-hurt over those two choosing the Wild to be able to think rationally and have an intellectual discussion about such an abstract concept.

$90M for 12 years and $98M for 13 years are ALMOST AN IDENTICAL CAP HIT. $7.5M/yr. vs. $7.538M/yr. Would you still consider it a handcuff if Suter were a Wing for a mere $38,000/yr less?

Never did I say anything about being a second tier franchise. Just because the competition has increased their level through 'parity' does not mean that the Wings have necessarily lowered theirs. However, if there are multiple teams than can be considered legitimate playoff contenders, simply going to Detroit "for a shot at winning" doesn't have the same draw.

Nice personal attack. When you can't, or won't, discuss an issue, feel free to attack another person's fan-ness. My point in the original post was to see what other fans think Detroit can do to possibly change the perception (if there is one) about committing to the Wings. A city in disarray and a team that continually derided as too old and past their prime.

If I were given the choice between two major cities and nearly identical contracts, I'd look at it in a 'numbers' sense as well..
You'll pay 3% more in personal income taxes in Minnesota (Suddenly, your extra $8Mil is $2.94Mil less).
Also, the cost of living is 28% higher in Minneapolis - http://www.bestplace...&city2=52743000

Given factors like that, the dollars make more sense for Detroit.

I realize that Suter/Parise wanted to play together and that is a mitigating factor that you can't place a value on. I just want to discuss the changing dynamics behind the concept.

Firstly, I'm glad you put 'ALMOST' in there, because they're no where near identical cap hits. 12 years would get both players off the books in the 39th year, 13 years would be 40th. That's an extra year at $7.5 when they'll most likely be crappy shells of their former selves. So whilst similar in yearly numbers, not so in practice. For a GM that's a difference maker.

As for the second point, if Detroit hasn't lowered their standards then there is still the lure of a chance at winning. What you've put out is close to an unfalsifyable statement, in that I can counter it with an equally valid yet opposite statement and neither can be proved right or wrong. If 'parity' means that more teams have a chance of winning, yet Detroit hasn't necessarily lowered their chances, then yes there will be more teams with a good chance of success yet Detroit will still be in the same strong position only with company. That doesn't mean their appeal for players lowers. See my point? I love my iMac, but those nice new Windows laptops have really closed the gap in regards to performance and technology. Still, iMacs haven't got any worse so I'll stick with them. Make sense?

1. I agree with you on this - BUT - he was not prepared to lose Lids.
2. Regarding Schultz - he went to the place where the young players have a chance to develope and play in NHL.

Other than that, I agree with you... and the worst part is that Holland will sign Carle for $25M/5 years and that's even worst than overpaying for Suter...

Unfortunately he went to a place where they only have young players looking to develop. By the time they have done, they'll be priced out of that team and will spend their prime years elsewhere. And who is to say that a whole team of young player will even develop as they should without veteran presence at all levels? I understand his decision, but don't necessarily agree. That being said, also don't mind that he didn't end up here as there is no guarantee he'd have faired well or suffered in the NHL. Could have been a risk.

Regardless of these two guys not coming here, if anyone honestly believes this team is as appealing as it was let's say 5 years ago, you are only fooling yourself. In the last two seasons we have lost two ELITE defensemen and our stars are only getting older. I don't think it's as bad as some people are making it out to be, but we certainly aren't the be all-end all like we once were.

I must be fooling myself then because this team is always appealing to me. But that's only because I support them and will during thick and thin. They may not be as successful in years to come but I'll still love watching them and will still cheer every goal and wish them to do well each and every night. That's what I understand as 'appealing'.

I read a couple of articles today that reference the Wings' inability to land Suter or Parise. I'm beginning to think long gone are the days of the hometown discount and the 'head to Detroit and you've got a shot at a championship' mentality. With the parity that currently exists, any team has a shot at winning.

Yes, there's a tradition of success. Yes, there's 4 Cups in the last 15 years. However, there's just as many first/second round exits and early playoff exits. Other than consistently making the playoffs - what sets Detroit apart as a choice for someone's career? Nothing tangible.

Sure, there are the intangibles - the history, Original Six, 11 Cups, Gordie Howe, etc.. but those have very little to do a person's day-to-day working life or home life.

I was just pondering all this.. what say you?



The first point here, you use in reference to the Wings failing to land two players who decided to sign for a team close to their homes. Everyone has a different 'hometown'. Much like we managed to convincce Mike Modano, only the best American-born player in NHL history, to put off retirement for a year and sign for a hometown discount in the state where he was born and raised. Unfortunately due to unforeseen circumstances it didn't pan out as it could have but proves the point that everyone has different homes.

The second point is a bit of an odd one, because being one of the winningest teams in NHL history, there are far more teams that have more 'first/second round exits' than the Wings. In fact there are far more teams that don't even make the playoffs year on year... Calgary would wish for a first round exit after these recent years.

Even if the Red Wings had matched Minnesota's offers to both, it probably wouldn't have mattered.

“You read today where they’re happy to be going as a pair and they’re both going home,'' Holland said. “Those are some of the things we couldn’t compete against because we’re not (their) home.''

Reference for the above point about 'hometown discount'.

Dominator2005, youre the only one who realizes that Holland lost a race. If hes willing to offer 180 mil to 2 guys, why not go the extra mile and offer 8 mil a season to land em both. In 7 years, cap will be 80-90 million and the extra mil a season will be so meaningless. We lost 2 great players and our gm stinks. Those are the facts.

Non-bold: Maybe Holland didn't lose a race here. He simply got to a point that was financially viable and make the decision not to go over the top and risk future money. Hence not offering an extra $8m. Deciding to not throw more money and risk losing a contract is a stronger, more ballsy decision than doing it. People might criticise him for doing it but it makes this team stronger going forward than if we had them for that long. If it was 7/8 years then maybe not as much, but 13 is a long time and I think he made a good choice. Also the cap doesn't simply rise a la inflation. It can very well go down. We'd be boned if it did (as MIN will be if it does).
Bold: Those aren't facts at all. They are opinions. Why they are not facts? I think 1 is a great player and 1 is a good defenceman who can give solid play but is in no way elite. Also I think Holland is a damn good GM. See, not facts. Opinions.

It doesnt matter why. Facts are: 1) we dont have either Lidstrom, Shultz, parise or suter, and 2) we have bertuzzi, sammuelson, gustavson, and tootoo. That is crappy general management by definition.

1) Those ARE facts (see above point). As are those at 2) yet everything else is once again opinion. Not sure how it's crappy management either considering Lidstrom made his own decision (Holland didn't tell him to retire), Schultz is unproven, and Parise and Suter either wanted too much money or wanted to play closer to home. If anything I'm thinking that limiting yourself with money and thinking about the sustained future of the organisation rather than the next 10 years is a good thing. If you're going on age here as well, Gustavsson and Tootoo are both 27, same as Parise and Suter (I only say as people seem to think that Tootoo is old for some reason?!) Yes they're not as accomplished as P & S but one's a goaltender and one's a physical forward. Bert and Sammy also have the experience over all 3 of Parise, Suter and Schultz which can count for everything down the line.

People are acting like we lost Dats, Z, Flip, Helm, etc in all this and that we're falling apart. I think we'll be ok, maybe not as dominating as we've been in the past, but come on, we're not the Thrashers here.