T.Low

is Mike Modano this year's Dallas Drake?

You mean because of the whole "Dallas" thing?  Hmm, something to think about.

Hmmm...we're pregnant with a girl;  can a girl be named Lilja? Lilja May Lowell?

My wife is seriously contemplating "Stevie".  She adores Yzerman. (But who doesn't)



Edit:  WHat happenned to the negs?  You could just neg me if you didn't like it instead of hijacking an entire thread with replies.  Sorry.

(At the prospects tournament)  “I looked out and thought, ‘My god, that red and white is a beautiful jersey,’ ” Yzerman said.



http://sports.yahoo....=nc-yzerman0913

http://redwings.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=537445



Probably reading too much into this, but it doesn't sound as if Modano and Salei will be getting along very well.  Salei basically says "We'll just have to ignore each other and work as best we can."

Sometimes, some things are better left unsaid.  

Contrary to popular belief, not everything needs to be brought out into the open and discussed.  They're two old school warriors.  It'll be fine.

I want big Bert to start using his size but I'm not sure if that will ever happen. Also, I'd like to see him use two hands on the stick more often. He tries to make pretty plays/goals but he should just be concerned about getting goals at all. I never understood why so many Wings fans hate him. I'm excited to see him and Mule and Flip play together. Mule and Bert could make some magical things happen if they play like they did in game 4 against San Jose.

I agree and there is indeed something to be excited about each and every line.

This really could be a peak year for Bert, Filp, and Franzen.

Seems there is so much focus on so many different guys this year that Cleary is almost forgotten about and he's as poised as any to have great year, too.

This is going to be one fun year.

no, no, no, no no... it was towards T. Low as well, I was agreeing with you!

oops.    Sorry guys.  Now that you say that, I totally see how it can be taken that way. But trust me, thats not the way I meant it at all. Apologies to the OP.

Meant it to be like we're all jonesin for some hockey just like the OP said and have run out of things to post about.  You know, like, "we've posted a thead on every single topic in the hockey world, I want to help get him out of his depression...but I can't think of anything we haven't already discussed...s***!" type of thing.

Sorry to be such a dumbass.   Sometimes my sense of humor does not transcend the internet. But more often, I'm just not that funny anyway.

Let's start a thread about...


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                                                                   hmm.

Of course there are going to be people who don't like Modano.  The guy had a reputation for being a whiner back in his prime years (earning the nickname "Madonna" for it), and was the proverbial "I score goals and am pretty" type of player.

Let's be honest folks.  He's here because he can still produce some points and maybe give the younger forwards some offensive pointers, not because he's going to be the blue collar guy who hits everything in sight, fights, and is a penalty killing machine.  I guarantee there are going to be times when we'll be unhappy with his play, just like Bert last season.  We'll ride it out, and I think that in hindsight next offseason, most of us will have a favorable opinion of what he brought to the Wings, especially for $1.25 million.

With the addition of Modano and the return of Huds we've got a serious third line, now we hope everyone stays healthy.  I'm chomping at the bit to see what this team can do.

Thank you.

The line is built more like the 4rth line of '02 with Larionov, Robitaille, and Holmer, although grittier becuase of Cleary.

If Modano did sacrifice his body every night, his season would last about 12 games, if that.  Dude's not built that way (not even when he was younger), and thats not why he's here.  He's in charge of getting that 3rd line to light the lamp, and have some defensive responsibility while he's out there.  His name is Modano, not Modandelkador.

am i the only one who thinks we should have gotten a damn good d-man for a few years than sign modano for one? i think kenny is experimenting with something...

Expound on this...like who at what $ for how long?  Enquiring minds want to know. I'm fine with Holland's moves, but your's may be better...what's your idea?

hey guys I have been watching some datsyuk shootout goals and with Modano and Hurdler joining the team I thought to myself what will the shootout lineup be.

Hurdler's favorite move is to leap over the goalie.

I don't know what is more ridiculous; the goal celebration or the "soccer" arguement.

Is anyone aware of the status on resigning helmers?

You mean the star of "Advanced Puck Ragging: How to Outhustle Your Opponents and Kill Penalties"?





I hope we sign him to a 17yr deal.  

Forgive me if I'm being unclear. I'll try.

I don't want to argue semantics, :

It's not semantics.  Business entity and industry are two very different things, especially in this circumstance.


which does not appear to impact the earning power of member franchises, nor restrict in any way outside of league competition the freedom of those franchises to 'reap their fruits'.

Players are assets.  They are the capital goods of the sports franchise. The stars are infact the rarest of entities, they are competitive monopolies:  FOr example there are many forwards in the league, but there is only one Pavel Datsyuk and people will pay to see Pavel Datsyuk.  He puts people in the stands.  That equates to revenue.  How can you say that the salary cap does not interfere with revenue.  How can you say that the league telling the business owners how much they can spend on their capital goods, how much of their revenue than can reinvest into their business, does not interfere with a owner's right to reap the fruits of his labor.


And while I admit the cap can have an adverse effect on the quality of the on ice product and thus potentially be impactful from a business perspective,

No, you can't say that the salary cap has an adverse effect on the product, but no impact on earning power.  
There is direct relationship between product and earning power. The saying is "build a better mouse trap", not build a subpar mouse trap.




that effect is outweighed by the positive benefits gained from membership in the NHL.

Yeah, thats the company line when it comes to franchises alright.  Actually, that is pure rhetoric and sales pitch, with absolutely no data to back it up what so ever WHEN IT COMES TO A 30 TEAM NHL.  And furthermore, conventional wisdom says the leauge is too big and would be better off if it downsized.

You seem to be laboring under the pretense that all rules are socialist. But without those rules, we wouldn't have a game. There would be no product for the NHL and its members to promote and sell. We obviously need some rules. The primary purpose being to regulate fair competition. But the existance of another rule designed to increase the number of viable competitors is not unfair at all. Everyone has the same limit, it is a fair rule of competition.

I've adressed exactly zero rules pertaining to the actual game play.  I've not said or implied anything that would logically lead anyone to a conclusion that i think all rules are socialist.  A game without rules is not a gmae at all.  I've simply adressed the fact that it's a socialist principle for a central bureaucratic agency (Gary Bettman and the NHL) to undermine the rights of individuals (Mike Illitch) to allocate their own wealth and place this power into the hands of bureaucrats.


The draft is a better example of a socialist rule, since it is not a fair practice. But personally, I dislike the idea of luck being such a factor in draft position, though it would be more fair. I enjoy the parity and level of competition in the league, and thus I think the draft as it is is good for the league.

I too enjoy competition, and the parity in the league makes for some exciting hockey.  That doesn't change the fact that it's a socialist system and Illitch is getting f***ed.  It pisses me off that Illitch has to carry the mail for Carolina, Atlanta, and Pheonix, as well as his own Detroit Red Wings.  

I agree with you on this:  It's not fair that a team has to pick last because they finihsed first.

Aside from that...  I think you need to lay off the Republican Kool-Aid

Nice to see you agree with the first part, but the Republicans have been very bit as Keynesian and darn near as socialist as the Democrats for a while now.

Now your saying two different things. You want to consider the NHL a business entity, whose primary focus is to make money, but consider the franchises to be game entities whose primary focus building the most competetive team. You can't have it both ways.

No idea where this came from. I said the NHL is an industry, not a business entity. As for the rest of that sentance, what the hell were you reading?

If we consider just the sporting apect, then an arbitrary limitation on the resources that can be devoted to player salaries is no different than any of the other arbitrary rules governing competition.

Now you are duplicitous.  By definiton, you can't talk about just the sporting aspect if you are going to talk about resources devoted to players salaries.

If you consider just the business aspect, then you could to an extent consider it socialist. But if the primary motivation for the operation of a franchise is to make money as a business, there is strong evidence suggesting that the salary cap in those best interests. No hockey team could make any money without opponents to play against nor a championship to play for, so membership in a league is vital to the success of any franchise. Furthermore, whatever is in the best interests of the league to which the franchise belongs is also in the best interests of the franchise. Evidence suggests that parity is a benefit to the league, and that the salary cap promotes parity. Ergo, the salary cap appears to be beneficial to the franchises in the NHL, from a business perspective. Current revenue trends support that conclusion.



While 'being in your best interests' does not mean that it isn't socialist, you can't totally separate the game aspect from the business either. So the cap must be considered in the complete terms. An arbitrary rule governing competition in a sporting league, which does not appear to impact the earning power of member franchises, nor restrict in any way outside of league competition the freedom of those franchises to 'reap their fruits'. It's similar in many ways to any other franchise-based business. There's a million different burger joints out there, but if you want to own a McDonald's (and all the associated benefits that come with the franchise) you have to abide by their rules. There's a lot of hockey leagues out there, but if you want to be in the NHL, you have to abide by their rules.

In regards to the legality of the contract, it is true that the contract as written is most likely within the rules as stated. But we are only assuming there is no unwritten agreement and only assuming that both parties entered the deal in good faith that all the terms would be fulfilled as written. If either of those assumptions is false, then one or both of the parties is guilty of violating the terms of the CBA.

Furthermore, the section of the CBA I quoted earlier seems a clear attempt to preserve the integrity of the CBA against exactly these types of violations of the 'spirit'. We are basically a judgement call from an abritrator away from NJ and/or Kovy being guilty of circumvention even without proof of any violations, as the CBA at least had the forsight to try and protect itself from these types of loopholes.
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