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#2321062 Holland losing his moxie? Is Detroit slipping as UFA destination?

Posted by RedWingsRox on 22 July 2012 - 10:42 PM

One's gotta think Holland has had a hard time selling the program in recent years.

I mean, yes we're an original six team with a previous winning tradition. However, we're also a team with an old, dilapidated arena, a team who just lost their franchise player, full of aging veterans and unproven youth....a team, playoff wise, has been going the wrong direction for the last 4 years.....

Yeah, doesn't really scream "attractive" does it?

All the above and plus, the city isn't much of an attraction.

#2320978 Holland losing his moxie? Is Detroit slipping as UFA destination?

Posted by RedWingsRox on 22 July 2012 - 01:28 PM

I think even the outside world is starting to question whether we've lost our mystique. I am leaning on yes, there will be some difficult years ahead. I think with this present roster, we'll be fighting just to make 7 or 8th spot.


Detroit Red Wings GM Ken Holland is considered the best at what he does, which is maintaining a consistent contender in the Western Conference with legitimate designs on winning a Stanley Cup each season. Along with Coach Mike Babcock, Detroit's recognized as having the "gold standard" for management.
Yet the Red Wings' offseason has seen better talent depart than has been added the roster.
Nicklas Lidstrom retired. Brad Stuart left for the San Jose Sharks. Jiri Hudler signed a 4-year deal with the Calgary Flames. Meanwhile, the Red Wings inked Maple Leafs backup goalie Jonas Gustavsson, Nashville pot-stirrer Jordin Tootoo and Mikael Samuelsson, for a second tour of duty after playing with Florida last season.
The real frustration for the Red Wings: They have $13 million in cap space, and were unable to land a premium upgrade to the defense. Ryan Suter of the Predators flirted with Detroit, who courted him heavily, only to sign with conference rival Minnesota.
Nashville captain Shea Weber, meanwhile, spoke with Detroit but Holland was never given the option to sign him to an offer sheet, as he did with the Philadelphia Flyers. The Predators didn't engage in trade talks with Detroit, seeking to move Weber to the Eastern Conference.
In some ways, it's inconceivable a team like the Red Wings would be on the outside looking in on these free-agent blockbusters. Which is why Holland is being criticized for Detroit's lack of reloading this summer, as the power shifts in the Western Conference.

Matt from Ultimate Hockey Source on Holland "losing his moxie" as GM:

Despite the Red Wings signings of Jordin Tootoo, Jonas Gustavsson, and Mikael Samuelsson, Holland has once again disappointed fans with the lack of a big move. In years past, it was Holland stealing great players and assembling the perfect teams, but this has failed to happen recently. His last ditch effort of making a move for restricted free agent Shea Weber has even been stomped on by the Flyers. Even if the Wings manage to sign Shane Doan, or perhaps trade for Bobby Ryan, their defensive unit as it is will not be enough to carry them to the Stanley Cup next year.

If Holland can't regain his moxie and make a high impact trade and the Wings fail to make the playoffs, you can bet that people will begin to call for a replacement.

George Malik offers this dose of reality on the Wins perusing Alex Semin and Doan:

I hate to use the line because it even annoys me at this point, but as the Wings continue to aggressively pursue every option to improve their team, they've still got to sell their "program" to players instead of tossing $6 or $7 million at a player simply because someone else is bidding for said player.

It makes me cringe to say that, mind you, but it's the truth.

Because of that spend-thrift ideal, Chuck Pleiness of the Advisor & Source (MI) wondered last week if the Wings had "lost their luster" as a destination for free agents:

"Once you make those types of decisions you're out of the game for a decade," Holland said. "We're not going to have major announcements every year, the league doesn't work like that. I'm confident that at some point in time, and it might be next year, that the history, the tradition, the commitment of our ownership and the passion of the Red Wing fans is going to all add up to us bringing a player of significance here."
… "We're going to try and do some things," Holland said. "We have some cap space so we'll see. But it has to be the right fit whether it's a trade or someone wants to come here. We're working the phones so we'll see.
"At the same time we're in a cap world," Holland continued. "We're moving some younger people in. If we're not moving younger people in we're going backwards. Brendan Smith has to play. Gustav Nyquist has to have an opportunity. Jimmy Howard is 27. We signed Jonas Gustavsson and he's 28. Darren Helm is 25. Those players have to be a part of where we're going."

Seeing where Doan and Semin end up is essential to determining whether Holland's in a rut or simply hasn't landed his big fish yet. He's been hindered by some forced beyond his control: Ryan Suterwanted to play with Zach Parise in Minnesota; Nashville wouldn't let Weber slip to a division rival; and the same could be the case for Rick Nash and the Columbus Blue Jackets.
But perhaps the greatest question: What does he do to fill the holes on the blue line? Keith Yandle, if available, would be a great start.

#2315964 St. James: Wings have inquired about Rick Nash

Posted by RedWingsRox on 05 July 2012 - 05:23 PM

I know it takes a good player to get a good player back but really hoping that Flip is not part of the package, nor Helm, nor Abelkader.

#2314805 Ryan Suter agrees to 13-year, $98-mil deal with Wild

Posted by RedWingsRox on 04 July 2012 - 01:53 PM

Knowing the numbers, I think Holland did the right thing by walking away. Hard when there is so much pressure but I'm actually glad we didn't try to top it with $100m for 13 years or something stupid like that.

Suter should also take a humble pill ... he should know that he is not worth $7.5/yr.

#2314630 Ryan Suter agrees to 13-year, $98-mil deal with Wild

Posted by RedWingsRox on 04 July 2012 - 12:06 PM

1. Can't blame Holland or Ilitch, they did everything they could. Don't know if I would have gone up to $98m for each of them, I already thought $90m over 13 yrs was a lot.
2. Please don't tell me in the end it was about the money, $8mill after taxes is like $4mill ... over 13 years, that shouldn't be a factor for Suter or Parise. So they think that Minny's roster is closer to 'winning' it all than Detroit's?
3. Minny was the dark horse and they won the Lebron/Bosh sweepstakes of NHL. Now everyone will have the hate on Minny like they did on the Heat.
4. Glad they finally made their decision and everyone can move on. I'm disappointed but not devastated. If we suck this year, so be it ... get some draft picks and rebuild the good old fashion way.

#2313527 Opinions if Wings have to settle for 'Plan B': Semin and Carle

Posted by RedWingsRox on 03 July 2012 - 11:21 AM

What you have to hope for is big steps in production from the young guys.
People wanted the Wings to get younger, and they will be next year.

This would be like hoping Franzen was consistent throughout the year ...

#2313521 Opinions if Wings have to settle for 'Plan B': Semin and Carle

Posted by RedWingsRox on 03 July 2012 - 11:14 AM

I'm afraid that this roster is about the same or worst than our line up last year. You've added a little on the offense but haven't shored up the defence. Carle might replace Stuart but you're missing Lidstrom's minutes, skill, and leadership. This roster would get in on 6th spot and be out in 1 round ...

#2313203 Canadiens Re-Sign G Carey Price to Six-Year, $39 Million Contract

Posted by RedWingsRox on 02 July 2012 - 07:25 PM

Sorry, I think this is overpayment for a slightly better than average goalie. Howard > Price.

#2312914 Free Agency LIVE CHAT

Posted by RedWingsRox on 02 July 2012 - 07:35 PM

Free agency day isn't what it used to be ... like last year and this year, the big fish always take a couple of days to make their decision. In years past, it felt like many big signings were right on July 1st. Now twittersphere superficially generate suspense and interest.

#2312854 Still no decision from Suter. Speculation abounds.

Posted by RedWingsRox on 02 July 2012 - 12:33 PM

Franzen and Hudler for Ryan? Do you think Ducks would take that?

Oh damn, a bit too late for that ... if only we thought of this earlier.

#2311895 St. James: Wings have inquired about Rick Nash

Posted by RedWingsRox on 01 July 2012 - 03:13 PM

Larry Brooks NYP_Brooksie
Told that Red Wing offer for Nash is not competitive...Carolina, Ottawa, Philly not on 61's list. 9:58pm - 1 jul 12

Good ... don't want.

#2311660 Ilitch, Chelios to fly to Suter, Holland to fly to Parise

Posted by RedWingsRox on 01 July 2012 - 03:34 PM

Maybe we should also send Carrie Millbank and Karen Newman with Holland and Alyonka Larionov with Illitch and Chelios.

#2311586 Ilitch, Chelios to fly to Suter, Holland to fly to Parise

Posted by RedWingsRox on 01 July 2012 - 01:34 AM

First time I ever heard us sending out a contingent of people to woo free agents. This must be serious. Why don't we send Gordie Howe?

#2311318 i hope we dont panic if suter and parise signs elsewhere

Posted by RedWingsRox on 30 June 2012 - 12:38 AM

Sorry but your post doesn't help ... I will be terribly upset if we don't get some UFA especially to help with our blue line. We've got some pretty big holes to fill there with Lids and Stu gone. AND I will be pretty upset if we just fill our holes with middle level players like Quincey. We need a stud defencemen or two.

#2311203 Free Agency General Rumor Thread

Posted by RedWingsRox on 29 June 2012 - 04:53 PM

Let's hope this clown from SI is right:


Zach Parise, New Jersey Devils
Best fit: Los Angeles Kings
Where I think he'll sign: Detroit

Ryan Suter, Nashville Predators
Best fit: Carolina Hurricanes
Where I think he'll sign: Detroit