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Member Since 17 Jul 2010
Offline Last Active Yesterday, 10:36 PM

#2527354 UFA day looking up

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 30 June 2014 - 07:29 PM

Obviously father does taxes the body, but do you guys actually think that Zetterberg and Datsyuk are going to play less games than last year? That just seems to fall in the "negative for the sake of being negative" category. 


Zetterberg got surgery for his back, said he felt like a new man. Datsyuk is a little less certain, but - come on - they missed half the year. They will be healthier than that.

#2527315 UFA day looking up

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 30 June 2014 - 05:13 PM

if Kenny doesn't pick up a fwd then i think we can pencil in Mantha and id love to see the kid get a fair crack at it.

Without signing anyone he'd have to beat out Jurco. Also, Alfie will probably sign and we'll have this. I think it's pretty certain Mantha will start in GR.






#2526891 BUF to buy out Christian Ehrhoff

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 29 June 2014 - 12:16 PM

I don't get why so many seem to think this would be a better signing than Niskanen. Erhoff turns 32 in about a week. he isn't physical at all, average defensively, and hasn't been great offensively either. yes some of that is because of playing with Buff, but overall just average. he is at the age where he is just leaving what should have been the prime years of his career.


Erhoff 32, 6-2/195 LHed, on a good team good for 35-40 points per season, going to make 5+ million and I am sure he is going to be looking for at least 4 years, maybe 5.


Niskanen 27 6-0/210 RHed, on a good team good for 40+ points, strong in his own end, and going to be looking for 6 million on a max term-7 years.


Now if we don't get Niskanen then going after erhoff makes some sense. he is an upgrade over quincy. But at this point he is clearly a second option.

1st of all - you clearly ignore Erhoff's 2 years in Vancouver where he scored 44 and 50 points. He got 38 this year on a very bad Sabres team. 


2nd - are we really considering 32 too old? Niskanen also turns older this year (who would have thought?) so they're only 4 years apart. We don't even know how long we would sign them for. Erhoff clearly has the more proven track record.


Niskanen's Right handedness is attractive. If we signed Erhoff we'd be counting on Marchenko or Sproul to be our RH Dman.


This is getting exciting! Wonder if any other unexpected buyouts happen.

#2526746 Next Seasons Needs/Team Future

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 28 June 2014 - 11:31 PM

Actually Holland has not been sitting on his hands the past two years. Everyone wants any two of nyquist, Tatar and mantha and that's it. And jarnkrok did in fact tell Holland he won't play another season in the ahl, he wanted guaranteed nhl time, which is why he was traded.
Pulkinnen will also be traded or let to walk, he won't be making the team.

These are some very juicy tidbits of knowledge that you're throwing around. But you said you can't name your source? Did Pulkinnen say he wouldn't play in the AHL for another year as well? I feel he could have a chance to make the team in 2015. Do you mean let walk in this year because he is an RFA?

#2526722 Next Seasons Needs/Team Future

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 28 June 2014 - 08:37 PM

N14, we should be after both. We have the room and if we landed both we would have 3 good to great pairs. Think of this blueline:






that is very good. 10 million per seasons gets you both easily. maybe 9 does it. Then you send Kindl down the river somewhere.

No, we don't have room for 2 D. We've got Oulette, Sproul, Marchenko, Backman, Jensen knocking on the door. We've got to let one take a spot this year. They are also a lot cheaper.

#2526668 NHL Draft 2014: Rounds 2-7 **MOD WARNING POST 51**

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 28 June 2014 - 02:14 PM

I understand your logic here but the fact is we have two superstar players in Z and Dats that are not far from being gone and it is a travesty that we don't at least attempt to put together a team that can compete for the cup for them.

Dats is signed for 3 more years. He could be here longer than that. Z is here 7 more years. I feel it's safe to say that they will still be elite in 2-3 years and that's when our prospect development will really come into fruition (if not this year):


Mantha will be on the team. Tatar, Nyquist, Sheahan will be in "prime years. We'll have Mrazek at least pushing Jimmy. Smith will have worked out his game (I believe he's already close to that). With at least 2 of Oulette, Sproul, Marchenko, Backman I really feel that will make a great back end. Jurco, possibly Pulkkinen, Andreas Athanasiauoaioisoioa also in the mix.


I feel like we're really on the ascent now and these guys will be pushing us up to being contenders. I feel these prospects really do fill the holes in the team that we saw this year (weak D, top 6 wingers). The thing for me that stands in the way of being contenders by that time is that 2C spot. Weiss is still a question mark and I feel that a lot rests on him being a solid piece of this team. Hopefully we see him back to the player that others say he is.

#2526480 Dylan Larkin - Highest draft pick since 1991

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 28 June 2014 - 12:25 AM



Guys, it's ok.  I'm pretty sure we just drafted Harry Potter.

Too bad we don't play quidditch.

#2525952 Wings to have face to face with Matt Niskanen

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 26 June 2014 - 07:27 PM

Like who?  Everyone acts like because we lost out on Parise and Suter, which was solely due to geography, that we somehow aren't a "destination" team.  Name all these top free agents that Holland pursued that the Wings didn't get.


Weiss and Alfredsson were the top two UFA's last year and the Wings signed them both.  Then before that every other team in the league was salivating over Danny DeKeyser.  Who got him?  Oh, yeah, that team no one wants to go to.  

Same with Brunner - Lost of teams interested, he chose us.

#2525787 Callahan re-signs with Lightning for 6 years 34.8m

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 25 June 2014 - 10:35 PM


Who cares if his body breaks down?  If his body wears down, they'll put him on LTIR (no cap hit) if he wants to fight through the injury and play another season or he'll retire if he can't (without a recapture penalty because it's post lock out).  He could literally play for three more years, retire, and the Lightening would owe him nothing more than the three years salary and have a lower cap hit than the actual salary on top of it.  


I don't see the problem with it. 

That's not actually what would happen if his body wears down - that's if he has one really serious injury. Injuries could just lower his ability to be effective and then they're stuck with a player who plays like last year's Cleary on their roster for the rest of his large contract.


Not really the best deal and it does have some risk, but Tampa pretty much were forced to resign him after St. Louis left. No other UFA would fill that hole. Good for them that they were able to talk him down at least a little from the demands that he made with NY. 

#2525693 Alfie informs Wings he wants to return

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 25 June 2014 - 12:04 PM

No what I said is you have to get top talent. Of the last 20 teams that won the SC, 70% of them had 4 or more top 10 picks on their roster when they won the cup. That is the proven path to winning. You can do that 3 ways: draft, trade, or UFA. Very few make it to ufa anymore so that leaves 2 options: draft and/or trade. Hoilland doesn't seem to have the guts or desire (whatever it is) to make trades. That leaves one option: the draft. To get top 10 picks and the premium talent you have to not make the playoffs. Or have bad seasons.

We are done with a 20 year run or so. But we were really bad for a long time. It was when we started to draft well, with a purpose, and develop the young talent that we started to win. yes we have some luck along the way and did things others were not doing like scout/draft eastern euros/russians. But the team from 95 through 02 was loaded with guys that were top 10 picks for various teams. Yzerman doesn't come if we don't lose. same with lapointe and Premieau. Prems of course becomes Shanny another top 10 pick. Not to mention picks up like Murphy and Ward.

Now of course there are exceptions to every rule. Our 08 team was one of them. But that is also why that teams core players have only won one cup.

It is just incredibly flawed that you think the only path to winning is to tank and get a top 10 pick.


First of all, even if we take your 4 top 10 requirement, you said yourself we can get them by trading and we've amassed a lot of tradable prospects.


Second of all, you're equating top 10 picks with top talent, which is false. Dats and Zetterberg are certainly better than most top 10 picks. Mantha probably should have been top 10. There's a lot of top talent elsewhere in the draft. We've got some of the best scouts, so we use that. People say that the time of draft steals are over, but look at where we got Marchenko for instance. Another thing is that we focused on development. A top 10 pick left to his own can flop, a lower pick with the right guidance and support can be just as good.


Third, how do you actually want to implement this tanking operation, because our roster as is will make the playoffs unless we turn into a MASH unit again? Are we going to sell off our older players, like Dats, Z, Kronwall, etc? In that case, we'd end up like Edmonton with top picks and no one to show them the way. We'd also lose a huge amount of respect as an organization and UFAs would take notice. Babcock would leave, Kenny would get fired and we'd have a lesser GM come in and totally change the very plan that you were working on. Do we sell off our budding young talent like Nyquist, Tatar, Mantha, Dekeyser, etc? Players that could become as any top 10 pick we might get. Do we just have a team meeting and say "now you must suck"? 


Anyway, I see you're posts as understandably frustrated, but I really feel that the team is rebuilding and doing it in a way that will make us competitive for a long time. We're not doing trades because we're building up our prospects and keeping our draft picks. We have about a full roster worth of NHL worthy prospects (I include young players already on the team). We'll get even more at this next draft. We'll let them fight it out for their places in our future and then we can start trading some of them for other pieces.  


So, Alfredsson...

#2525607 SC winners and the draft.

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 24 June 2014 - 10:55 PM

Another problem with the original argument is that all drafts are not equal in talent depth and top 10 is really an arbitrary line to draw.

This year we have the 15th pick. All the talking head say that the talent level drops after the first few players and no one agrees on the order for players after these first few players. So the 7th choice and the 15th choice are really ranked pretty equally. Would it really help us to have the 10th pick this year? Would that mean we could then win the cup? 

#2525602 Alfie informs Wings he wants to return

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 24 June 2014 - 10:28 PM

mar, I fully understand the rebuilding process, I just wish we would do it or go for the cup. I don't mind if we have 2-3 losing seasons, get highly rated top draft choices and then begin the next 15 year run. Its the half a$$ patch and pug approach that bothers me. We are not getting better and we are not getting the young high end talent we need to get better.

When it comes to bad for long periods of time, I remember the 70's all to well. The RW's had no real plan. Very similar to what we are doing today.

It sounds like you think the only way to rebuild is to tank. There is many examples around the league to show that strategy doesn't always work.

This team is rebuilding and we're doing it while making the playoffs and keeping a competitive team. We are getting better as our young players are getting better. I don't know how you could have watched Nyquist, Tatar, Dekeyser, Jurco, Sheahan, etc. and not thought of them as "the young high end talent we need to get better."

#2525360 Alfie informs Wings he wants to return

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 23 June 2014 - 06:47 PM


I'm no Holland basher, but all I'm saying is these contracts to older players have a lot of risk.  You don't know exactly when a guys game is going to fall off a cliff, see Cleary, Sammy and Bert as examples of contracts/wasted roster spots.

I understand what you're saying. I don't think Cleary Sammy Bert fell of a cliff, though. We've seen their decreased effectiveness over the seasons leading up to last. And think it's rare to truly go from hero to zero.


Alfie still put up 18g and 49pts in 68 games. That PPG might slide a bit, but the situation is quite different than Cleary, Sammy and Bert. We get him without giving up our young prospects. I just hope he is better at controlling the puck on the PP. There was so may times during the year he would bungle a hard pass. 

#2525338 Alfie informs Wings he wants to return

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 23 June 2014 - 05:44 PM

Meh, he was a good signing last season, but the older he gets, the riskier it gets to bring him back.  He's going to be turning 42 years old in December...how many forwards are still effective at that age?  I wouldn't go more than $3 million and even that has plenty of risk....the problem with building a team with all these old players as Holland likes to do, is that old players are more injury prone.  

If gets injured then Mantha or Pulkkinen play. That's doesn't sound like too big a risk to me. Holland's not building a team with "all these old players." We'll actually be a pretty young team next year.

#2524608 Next Seasons Needs/Team Future

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 19 June 2014 - 02:37 PM


Well, seeing as Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen and Kronwall are all a year older and on the unhappy side of 30 expecting them to carry the team is becoming less and less feasible. Couple that with Nyquist likely not exploding this year, Sheahan returning to form and Tatar putting up similar numbers as he did last season and finally the the defense being mediocre they could easily be worse than last year.

So you're expecting Dats, Zetterberg, Sheahan to only play half the season again. Ericsson and Franzen will miss 30 games again. Nyquist won't play in 25 games again. Weiss will only play 26 games again.


Cause all those things will have to happen again for us to be worse than the past year