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Member Since 17 Jul 2010
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#2680467 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 30 June 2016 - 12:32 AM


I hope you're right!


"Helm with Hands" is going to be a 2C? How the expectations for the Wings have fallen.

If Darren Helm had hands he would definitely be a 2nd line player. AA absolutely could develop into a 2C - he's only been played half a year - he is going to get better. 

#2680399 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 29 June 2016 - 08:15 PM


Nobody cares about it except ownership and management.

I care. I think it's something to be proud of. It's certainly not something that comes easy. It shouldn't be a goal unto itself and I don't think it is. 


Tanking would be something were I would embarrassed for the team and disappointed in the organization.

#2680219 Hall for Larsson - Oilers and Devils swap players

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 29 June 2016 - 03:51 PM

I feel like Hall should have brought more than Larsson. It is a good pickup for them, though since they've been looking for Dmen.


I'll bet they were fishing for P.K. and maybe Weber and heard they were out of the running. 

#2679782 Datsyuk Announcement to Officially Leave NHL

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 28 June 2016 - 03:31 AM

Yeah, it is 3.8 mill per year. 


He was going to make 5 mill next year here, plus he lost the 2 mill off last years contract. So, he's down 3.2 mill due this decision. Why people want to think the worst of this guy is beyond me. 


So much for wanting to be closer to his daughter. It's about 2000 mi from St Petersburg to Ekaterinburg, where his daughter lives. Might as well fly there from Detroit. I don't begrudge Pavel his desire to play in Russia, but please stop using tearjerking excuses (want to be closer to his family) and just tell the truth: "I can't play in the NHL as well as I used to, so I'm going to an easier league, and will make more money there." 7.6 mil/yr with 13% taxes >> $7.5 mil/yr with 40%+ taxes

I don't know how you know where his daughter lives, but he actually has 2 daughters; one with his current wife and one with the ex-wife according to wikipedia. Maybe the current family lives near St Petersburg. But it doesn't really matter. He'll be travelling with the team all over Russia for the league and I'm sure will be close to Ekaterinburg often. Or he has a 2 hour flight. 


Even though I'm sure you meant the "might as well fly from Detroit" comment as exaggeration, it is completely ridiculous. It would be one of those almost day-long flights and hence Datsyuk probably only saw his daughter in the couple months during the offseason and being in Russia he'll be able to see her much more often even if they don't live in the same town. Or maybe it wasn't just to be with the 1 daughter - he has said "to be with family" certain times. It was just the Albom article that made it sound like it was about the teenaged daughter. Anyway, the specifics are really not our business - I don't see and reason not to respect him and trust the explanation he gave.


Plus his early departure has given us a great opportunity to improve the team. While I would have loved to watch him for another year, this could be better for the franchise. I see no reason for bitterness or cynicism on this.

#2679749 Drew Miller re-signs... 1 year deal $1.025 million

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 27 June 2016 - 08:57 PM

One year Miller played with some guys with talent he scored 14 goals with no PP time. How many did Helm get the last couple years playing with Datsyuk on the PP?

Helm didn't get much PP time this past year. He was 14th on the team in time per game (12th if you exclude Mantha and Pulkkinen since they didn't play many games).




The year before that he was 15th. 

#2679741 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 27 June 2016 - 08:01 PM

Attached File  Subban-Stamkos.jpg   15.29KB   3 downloads

would going for PK Subban on a trade be a positive factor on trying to land Stamkos?

Maybe they've always been hoping to be reunited.

#2679535 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 26 June 2016 - 01:51 AM

Compared to the Suter situation at least there's this interview process now. By the time Suter said we were out of the picture, all the other UFAs were gone and we missed out some other good guys. Hopefully with the interview, he'll say his decision and, if we're not the choice, then we can chase Ladd, Eriksson, Okoposo, etc.


Picking up wingers would be good too, but I think that would pretty much force us to rely on Z and Larkin as the top 2 centers. Larkin hasn't excelled there yet and we don't know how long it would take for him to transition to the spot. Alternately, it seems to wear Z down too much. It would be better to only need 1 of them as centers and have the other as relief. Otherwise, we could have AA or Sheahan as a 2nd line center and I don't think that's ideal. Stamkos is pretty much the only center on the market (Staal, Backes, but both are probably in decline)

#2679462 The Holiday tradition: 2016 Draft thoughts.....

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 25 June 2016 - 12:54 PM

Not sure about the draft this year but I say they same thing every year and I'm usually pleasantly surprised. There is a reason they passed on some of the more obvious picks and went other directions. They know what we are doing. I know people have heard this a million times but the Wings were criticized for taking an unknown small forward out of Russia named Datsyuk over more obvious names left in that round. In Hakan and the rest of the recruiting staff we trust!

Or more recently, people on the board said Bertuzzi was listed much lower than where we picked him at and complained about the choice. He has looked quite good in GR and I don't think many are unhappy that we took him now

#2679322 Detroit trades Datsyuk to Arizona

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 25 June 2016 - 03:05 AM

Well Arizona would have been with Svech or whatever his name is or AA too...both positions than wings are better at than at defense. This trades evaluation will depend on 2 things;

1. Can the Wings convince Stamkos to come here? Yes, the cap space is there but others can offer equal money and th ability to play with Eichel. This reminds me too much of the Suter Parise situation. Although I think Toronto would be the wrong choice for him.

2. Chychrun's development. A physical beast being compared to Scott Stevens falls into the Wings lap and they trade him. Did it ever occur to people that that is a reason, why the Coyotes where so eager to get this guy? The kid the Wings drafted is yet again undersized (wouldn't be a problem if this was a heavy team but it isn't), and known for questionable defensive abilities .. So I just hope Hakan saw something in him..because frankly most experts didn't.

Our guy is 6"1' and 185lbs.



6"1' is the league average, so he's not undersized.

202.4lbs is the league average, so he has 4 years to gain 17.4 to not be undersized.....and he's 18.


As for us being a light team:



10 teams lighter, 8 teams shorter (I think - they're not in order, but I counted lower numbers). Plus we'll add Mantha and lose some smaller players: Datsyuk (tear) Richards (6'0" - so not that small).

So I'd say we'll be middle of the pack for size. But if you mean truculence....

#2679321 Detroit trades Datsyuk to Arizona

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 25 June 2016 - 02:36 AM

I think this is beyond the best case scenario. There's articles reporting that the deals offered to us for Dats' contract were even higher than previously reported.


The offers he was getting was either for players whose teams wanted to unload their contracts or a price that included at least a first-round pick and a prospect. The name Andreas Athanasiou kept coming up."




I doubt that even the best GM could get Stamkos to join us but I'd surely be happy if Holland gets it done.

And no, I don't feel that I do that. I just feel that although this trade is creative and makes sense for both teams it's not the time to praise Kenny for it or even compare him with Bowman. If he gets to sign some good FA's or lands some significant trades and if the difference between the prospect isn't gonna be huge or even in our favour it will still be early enough to praise Holland for it.

Okay, if Chychrun becomes Drew Doughty, then we might look at this differently. He does look like a very good player (and even played Little Ceasars Hockey, haha), but Cholowski looks to have good potential as well. This was not considered a deep draft and we only moved 4 spots down - It's not we dropped out of the elite top picks.




Chychrun fell due to injury problems. He dislocated his shoulder twice and then had to have a surgery for a torn ligament in his back that was allowing the shoulder to pop out. Though I'm not a doctor and don't know the long term consequences of that specific injury, I think a player whose already had back surgery at age 18 is something to be wary of.


That's all just considering the pick swap, though. We also got an extra 2nd and I think it's pretty certain that we'll do something with our new cap space. So, if the 2 prospects together don't match the player Chychrun becomes, we have 7.5 million cap space that has the potential to sign someone equal to or above Chychrun's value. I think the odds are in Holland's favour.


I guess the real question is: Would you have rather not the deal, Poel? Would you rather trade AA and and 1st? Or keep Datsyuk caphit, draft Chychrun, and likely miss out on free agency and maybe the playoffs? 

#2678860 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 24 June 2016 - 03:03 PM

It's been awhile since we heard that Holland offered contracts to Miller and Helm. You'd have to think the offers were well below market or one or both would've signed by now. I have to think that they are going to test the market. Adios, if you ask me...



Helm is going to talk to other teams during the interview period.


He shouldn't be in the top 6 (unless for the sake of balancing attack over 3 solid lines - which we don't have the personnel for), but the "maybe a 3rd liner" stuff is crazy to me. Hope we keep him. Miller, not so much...

#2678665 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 22 June 2016 - 08:16 PM

If we can win with piece of s*** then go for it.
If piece of s*** can keep Plekanec quiet (******* Plekanec was acting tough against us) then go for it.
If piece of s*** can beat Brown's ass then go for it.
If piece of s*** can play on same line as Larkin, can skate, hit (pretty well), fight (pretty well), score some goals (20-25 goals)... then I would gladly have that piece of s*** instead any of Tatar, Nyquist, Jurco, Pulks, Helm playing top six forward.

Lucic address, physicality, size and scoring issues.

Lucic: 18g in 14-15, 20g in 15-16


Tatar: 29g in 14-15, 21g in 15-16

Nyquist: 27in 14-15, 17g in 15-16


Lucic played in the top 6 in Boston and L.A. Tat and Ny's numbers dipped on the 3rd line. 


Under no circumstance do I want Lucic.


Also, he can't skate and wouldn't be able to keep up with Larkin

#2678643 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 22 June 2016 - 05:39 PM

Thought this was relevant to the Tatar discussion.


Some interesting Quotes from Blashill:




“I would like to have a much better feel for what our lines are going to be,” he said.

“And part of that, and part of what we’ve talked about as a group, is constructing a roster where guys are excited about their roles. Guys that are third-line players are excited to be third-line players. Guys who are fourth-line players are excited to be that.“And you have the right guys getting the right minutes in the top six.

“This year, we just had probably too many similar players that I don’t think we ever found the best combinations for.”


Also, some light on Tatar and Helm's comments at the end of the year:

“We had guys on the third line who wanted to be top-two line guys, and we had so many players in that third spot that we didn’t have enough excitement for the roles that everybody was in,” Blashill said. “I think if guys had a beef on ice time, for me, it would be Tatar and Nyquist more than anybody else,” Blashill said.


I'm glad that he's fully aware that the line combos didn't work last year and that he seems like he's going to change the mix. Tatar and Nyquist should absolutely be separated and be used with playmakers (Z, Larkin, AA) to maximize their potential. He gave some interviews this past year and talked about his plan for Ny-Shea-Tat to be one of the best 3rd lines in the league, but it never worked and shouldn't have seen as much time together as they did. Tat-Shea-Jurco was the 'kid line that work, because it had different elements.

#2678557 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 21 June 2016 - 08:14 PM

You would imagine they'd have to give up quite a bit. Like...a lot. Any interest in Hossa? He's been on the block for a while now.

At 37 with 5 years to go on his deal, I'd steer clear. I think he could go to a 'cap floor' team since his contract has started the big nose dive and 17/18 - 20/21 his actual salary will only 1 mill per despite the 5.275 caphit.


Edit: He has a NMC so I doubt he'd want to go to a team just meeting the floor. I even doubt he'd want any trade. 

#2678334 Datsyuk Announcement to Officially Leave NHL

Posted by PavelValerievichDatsyuk on 20 June 2016 - 12:05 PM

The first statement in bold is incorrect - in his official retirement press conference, he was asked if he knew about the age 35+ rule when he signed the 3 year extension and the financial implications it would have on this team: His answer "Yeah I know, they explain me everything - Yes I know". (https://www.nhl.com/...7578/c-44232103) - fast forward to the 7:13 mark.


The second statement in bold is exactly why he shouldn't have his number retired, nor will the organization celebrate him much moving forward.


He was absolutely one of the best two-way players we have had on this team, and he left on the worst terms I can remember. To say that we offered him a hometown discount is generally true, but also a very ironic statement. We seem to forget that in 2001 - he came to a championship caliber team, to learn from the best coach in NHL history at a time when the KHL was incomparable in terms of player salary. In the 14 years he played here, he amassed over $80,000,000 USD - which actually would have made Russia the "hometown discount" had he stayed there his entire career.


The reason I can't side with him here, has more to do with the collateral effects this decision renders - more than him deciding to leave early. He signed a 3 year contract extension exactly 2 years ago, and apparently needed convincing to honour even the 2nd year before doing the exact same thing in Russia. That disregard toward the ownership/franchise that took a chance/invested heavily into him makes it clear that he absolutely doesn't care about the state of this team, or the fact that (1) unloading his contract is going to cost us a valuable asset or (2) if we fail to unload his cap hit, we cant sign an equivalent replacement. 


All in all, from the start of this post-season when he approved the release of an article that confirmed he was heading back home - which was an ill timed distraction - to the news of this weekend, I can't say any of it sits well with me. He failed to do what was so obviously the right thing in this case, and play out the final year. I would understand injury, or perhaps a legitimate family situation - but to simply go home (considering the impact it has on the Red Wings) a year early makes me feel like when he needed us, we gave him every opportunity and more to succeed and make his "family" a lot more money than Russia could have. But the KHL has evolved, and maybe now that he doesn't need us as much as he once did - his decision becomes one out of preference rather than respect.

But I really don't think the cap hit for one year is that bad. Maybe we don't sign any free agents and go with the kids. That could end up being great for the organization long-term with AA, Mantha, maybe Bertuzzi getting more opportunity than usual. We weren't going to win the cup next year anyway. Also, I think him leaving actually gives us more of an opportunity to sign Stamkos than we would have had.


Russia would have been the hometown discount? What does that mean in the context of what I was talking about? I was making the point that he could have made more by signing with other teams in the NHL. Just because he could have made less in Russia doesn't negate that. He stay with us for 14 years which is rare in the NHL and shows loyalty. As for the "KHL has evolved" stuff - If you're trying to insinuate that he's going there for more money, we debunked that in another thread. That league is struggling due to Russia's economic woes and the hard cap for that league is being lowered successively for the next few years. He won't make more there for next year. His salary would have to be over 7.5 mill.


He hired an indepentent lawyer and talked to the player's union to try to find a way to leave without leaving us with the cap hit. Doesn't sound like disregard to me.


He's divorced, his ex-wife took his daughter back to Russia. He's only able to see her the summer months. I consider that a legitimate family situation. We don't really know the specific (rightfully), but I think you can imagine the effect of losing touch with your daughter.