It seems like people are trying to make their case for fighting vs. no fighting by using this incident in microcosm. Truth is, Neil (meathead that he is) shouldn't be suspended for a pretty harmless scrum at the end of the play. Likewise, Franzen didn't "use his stick as a weapon" or "poke a bear" and therefore doesn't really need to defend himself.
If we're being honest it probably went something like this. Franzen was having an awesome game and making Ottawa look REALLY bad at home. Neil, being a fan favorite, veteran, and renowned pest didn't like being shown up at home. As such, he decided he was going to give Franzen a little extra attention in the third period. Franzen, not enjoying being buzzed, clipped, and generally roughed up took a couple of whacks at Neil (as almost ALL skill players do when being harassed, see: Kessel, Phil), and Neil did as he's always been known to do and escalated it into a scrum. At which point the refs took control and tossed them both, partially to make sure nothing more serious happened and largely because the game was out of reach and it wouldn't matter.
No harm, no foul. Opponents of fighting (like me) can call Neil a meathead, and proponents can call Franzen soft, yellow, a coward. But the truth is, this incident is really a poor way of making a case for either.
I'm sure you could put him on the Wing, but he adds such a big advantage at center I would rather try Weiss on the Wing.
Seems like a Catch-22 to me. The advantage you'd gain by having Kesler at his natural position would likely be offset by the disadvantage you'd have by playing Weiss at a position he's never played in his 10 year career. Pick your poison I guess.
Legitimate question, but weren't all of Kesler's most productive years on the wing? I swear I read (prior to him being mentioned in trade rumors) that Vancouver wanted to bring in a second line center to pay with Kesler on the wing. If this is true (I'm only about 75% sure), why couldn't we just put him on Weiss' wing with Alfie or whomever?
All this stuff about Erhoff's contract is silly. If you traded for him today. Five years from now you could move him at the deadline to a contender with ZERO issues. He's like Sergei Gonchar. He'll bounce around for the rest of his career quarterbacking the PP and moving the puck and eventually someone will get caught holding him when he's 38 and they'll deal with a 4 million cap hit (by that time the cap will be like 90 million anyway) for a year or two and he'll be gone and everyone will be happy with what they got except the last team holding the contract...which won't be us.
This is just another one of those things everyone repeats just for the sake of repeating. The only people concerned with his contract are Buffalo, who need to get enough in return on the trade to make the risk of his cap recapture worthwhile. Nobody else cares.
Come on there is no need to be an Ass you guys disagree, just leave it at that.
We don't disagree. He's argued the following points tonight and I agree with all of them.
1) Tyler Myers is really good but looks bad because Buffalo sucks
2) Christian Erhoff doesn't get the same consideration even though he's on the same sucky Buffalo team
3) PK Subban and Tyler Myers are seemingly identical cases for comparison
4) Just like when Rob Brown played with Mario Lemieux, Christian Erhoff's numbers were once inflated by being on a good team. But if Tyler Myers goes to a better team and scores more, it will definitely NOT be the result of being on a better team (a la Brown and Erhoff).
Myers and Subban both got 8 goals so i guess people are gonna start over looking his glaring defensive lapses as well now ? .... So how many buffalo games have you caught this year? Just curious since you seem to be an expert on Myers the nhl's turnover machine
He kept bringing up myers being a turnover machine .... And I brought up how Subban turns the puck over a lot and asked if he wouldn't take him as well and this is somehow become myers vs Subban lmao
My roommate's from Buffalo and we have the NHL package. I see a lot of their games. He's not very good. He's as bad defensively as Subban and scores half as often. You cannot possible still be trying to argue that Myers is in any way comparable to Subban can you? I mean, you've got to see how that doesn't carry water. That it's just argument for argument's sake. That one of those guys is a dynamic offensive threat who's bad a defense while the other is just bad at defense. Right?
I tell you what, if you REALLY think Myers is the same as Subban, that they're both poor defensively but that their offense makes them worth their money then I'll concede. You win. I honestly can't argue with you if you REALLY believe what you're trying to convince me of right now.
Bottom feeder team will take ehroff to reach the floor but not myers? Sure. ..... Myers just turned 24 ehroff is 31 ....myers upside is miles ahead of ehroff .... The way you talk about ehroff you'd think he was the next lidstrom .... He's a reliable 3-4 dman at best
That's a far stretch
Nobody is saying Erhoff is Lidstrom. Enough hyperbole. All he's saying is that a proven Erhoff at 4 million is a better option than an unproven Myers at 5.5 million. You're welcome to disagree, but don't put words in his mouth. His argument is pretty easy to follow, even if you don't believe it.
Also, it's not too far fetched to think Erhoff could score 50 pts. considering he's already done it once in his career.
My point is Subban was benched from team canada because he's a defensive liability , he just got benched last game in mtl for a costly turnover ....your saying myers constantly plays bad(the way your speaking you make it sound like you seen every sabres game)
And the only reason Subban made team canada is so people wouldn't complain about the Norris winner not being there ....Babcock wanted no part of him
When Myers scores as often as Subban people might be willing to overlook his glaring defensive lapses too. He doesn't, so they don't.
I don't care if we trade Quincey for a bag of Doritos. Mmmmm nacho cheese....
But I digress, you make Myers sound like the second coming of Lebda. He's a good not great player but he's certainly not as horrible as you make him seem. Yeah, he's been bad lately, but so was Cleary before Holland signed him. I think he would do great in the Wings environment. Erhoff and Edler would be preferable but would cost an arm and a leg, and if I'm overpaying I'd rather get a scorer.
I'm not saying Myers is horrible. I'm saying he's not very good. He's Smith...except he makes 6 million bucks. So signing him would be HORRIBLE. He turns the puck over a lot and blows coverage, just like a lot of young d-men. But he doesn't get paid like a young defeseman who's still learning, he gets paid like a stud (he's not). He's not an upgrade over either Quincey or Dekeyser, so why trade for him (unless you want 6 million bucks on your third pair). I don't.
Not sure what your point is since Chara and Pronger are offensive D-man that play good defense. Myers is also an offensive d-man he's just not as good defensively. Bad contract but still only 24.
Chara and Pronger are offensive defensemen? You realize that when people talk about offensive minded defensemen they're not talking about guys who score on the PP right? They're talking about guys who look to generate 5-on-5 offense from the back end, like Mike Green, Keith Yandle, Dan Boyle, Brian Campbell.
Pronger and Chara are not offensive minded d-man. Not in this world or any other. If you think so, I don't know what to tell you.
and Myers won the Calder .... Subban won the Norris but it was a shortened season so as nice as that was for him doesn't mean as much to me as someone who wins during a full seAson
And Subban was benched for team canada for a reason
Wow I feel like you're accidentally trying to make my points for me. PK Subban was benched on a stacked Team Canada. Tyler Myers didn't even get a try out for a less stacked Team USA. Why do you keep trying to compare Subban to Myers? Subban is clearly 2,000,000 times better than Myers. They're not even close to comparable.