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Member Since 31 May 2011
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#2625603 Red Wings sign D Mike Green (3-years, $18-million)

Posted by kipwinger on 16 September 2015 - 08:53 AM

Green's most important "defensive" attribute is his ability to gain control of the puck, and lead the breakout, either by skating the puck out of the zone or making an excellent first pass.  People who haven't watched Washington much don't realize how physical Mike Green is.  He is very good as separating opposition players from the puck.  And when he does, it's going the other way in a hurry. 


I think one of the key differences between Blashill and Babcock centers around this exact concept.  Babs did not let any of his defensemen (other than Kronwall on occasion) skate with the puck.  Their job was to gain possession, and look to dump the puck off to a forward.  This does a couple of things.  A) Makes the team easier to defend because you know where the puck is going, B) Makes the defensemen more vulnerable to the forecheck, C) Means that when your d-men turn the puck over, it will probably be in your zone, and D) Curtails the effectiveness of your zone entries. 


Obviously it remains to be seen how Blash will handle D to O transitions.  But I'm optimistic.  Letting your d-men skate with the puck should play into Green's skillset, but also improve Smith and Kindl's games (as they're both weak against the forecheck, but really good skaters). 

#2625549 Red Wings sign D Mike Green (3-years, $18-million)

Posted by kipwinger on 15 September 2015 - 03:19 PM

Saying "he's not defensively responsible" is most frequently just a vague way for most people to justify their own personal dislike for a player.  The difference in defensively ability between guys like Keith, Subban, and Karlsson is miniscule. 


Nobody (whose job security involves winning hockey games) would put those guys on the ice as often as they do, and give them as much money as they do, if they only contribute on offense.  A 50-60 point, offensive, forward doesn't make as much money as P.K. Subban or Erik Karlsson .  They don't play as much either.  Yet their detractors all seem to suggest that a 50-60 point forward is all they are.  It's bogus. 

#2625545 Red Wings sign D Mike Green (3-years, $18-million)

Posted by kipwinger on 15 September 2015 - 02:41 PM

Who was that one offensive defenseman who kept the puck out of his own zone by essentially being another foward on the ice?  You know, the one who was always jumping into the play and carrying the puck deep into the o-zone.  I can't remember his name, but I swear he was pretty good.  I mean, obviously not as good as a stay at home guy...of course.  



#2625466 Red Wings sign D Mike Green (3-years, $18-million)

Posted by kipwinger on 14 September 2015 - 05:50 PM

Stay at home defense is overrated.  I'd rather have guys who can get to loose pucks, get them up the ice, and make plays in the neutral and offensive zones.  It's better to have guys that can do something effective with the puck, than guys who clear the crease, block shots, etc. because for them to do what they're good at, you've got to be hemmed into your own zone. 


I've posted this before.  It's Daryl Sutter on why playing defense is overrated.  It pretty much sums up how I feel about this topic.




Here are a few more good articles on the subject:




#2625425 Red Wings sign D Mike Green (3-years, $18-million)

Posted by kipwinger on 14 September 2015 - 10:21 AM

Did you just favorably compare Darren McCarty to Mario Lemieux, Pavel Datsyuk, Doug Gilmour, and Wendell Clark? 

#2625405 Red Wings sign D Mike Green (3-years, $18-million)

Posted by kipwinger on 14 September 2015 - 08:41 AM

He was a beloved part of a golden age team. He was here 10 years straight (plus parts of 2 in the comeback attempt) Maltby wasn't here much longer with 14 years. He has a Cancer foundation that raises money for research and is active in the community. He seems like a pretty good guy that just let his demons get the better of him.


I haven't read his book and don't know too much of his story, but there's many reasons why people turn to drugs. In hockey we've had a number of stories of enforcers dealing with depression that should guide most people against simplistically damning McCarty as you seem to want to. Maybe he was dealing something like Rick Rypien was. Maybe his brain looks like swiss cheese like Proberts did in the autopsy. I do know that McCarty's father died of cancer in 1995 (at age 49). Possibly that was a trigger to lead him down a dark path. Drugs are often a symptom of something else. Try a little empathy. 


You can pity a substance abuser without any particular need to glorify them, or make excuses for them, in the process. 


There may be a number of factors that contribute to his behavior.  There usually are.  But that doesn't excuse it.  And I'm not going to glorify McCarty when players like Draper, Maltby, Osgood, Kocur, Chelios, etc. contributed just as much on the ice, and represented themselves, the team, and the city twice as well off of it, without all the baggage. 


If Mike Green shouldn't wear 25, then I'd expect 18, 30, 33, 24, and 26 to be taken out of circulation as well.  Which is completely silly.  McCarty is a guy with a few high points, and a lot of "might have beens" in his career.  Nobody can take that from him.  But IMO, that's not worthy of the respect and admiration that gets heaped on him.  Pity maybe, but not respect and admiration.  That's reserved for the guys who continue to earn it. 

#2625344 Red Wings sign D Mike Green (3-years, $18-million)

Posted by kipwinger on 13 September 2015 - 06:39 PM

People love McCarty and hate fedorov. Unreal.

#2625235 Matt Wuest Prospect Tournament Thread

Posted by kipwinger on 11 September 2015 - 03:13 PM

That second line is going to be sick. 


Hopefully Larkin and Nastasiuk will keep Mantha honest with their work ethic and pace. 

#2625229 2015-2016 expectations

Posted by kipwinger on 11 September 2015 - 12:58 PM


Don't forget about 3-on-3 play in OT. Hopefully the Wings can win more of those than they lose. One potential advantage Detroit has over a lot of other teams is that Blashill gained experience with this last year in GRs. Something many coaches in the league can't say.


This is a very good point.  I hadn't thought about it.  There should be a learning curve for a lot of coaches, particularly non-offensive minded coaches, for about a year or so. 

#2625160 2015-2016 expectations

Posted by kipwinger on 10 September 2015 - 03:21 PM

We'll lose the Conference Finals in 6.  To Columbus. 

#2625157 Free agents this off season

Posted by kipwinger on 10 September 2015 - 03:04 PM

Haha, Boston Strong!

#2625137 Wings sign Brad Richards 1 yr, $3 million

Posted by kipwinger on 10 September 2015 - 01:47 PM


Only if Babcock gets him when he's 40.


Brad Richards is Babcock's future 4th line winger.  David Legwand and Stephen Weiss beckon he join them. 

#2625132 Cleary re-signs... 1 year deal

Posted by kipwinger on 10 September 2015 - 01:17 PM


If Mantha turns out to be anything like Johnny Depp in this new Black Mass movie, I think we'll all be happy.


Don't believe the hype.  Johnny Depp can make even the most hardened of mobsters seem feeble, effete, and impotent.  Just like he did with pirates, and cocaine smugglers, and serial killers, and raving lunatics, and Willy Wonka. 

#2625122 Cleary re-signs... 1 year deal

Posted by kipwinger on 10 September 2015 - 12:08 PM

Maybe because Jeff Hoggan is signed to an AHL deal, earned his one-year deal last season and is the captain of the Griffins? I'm not the biggest fan of signing players based (mostly) on their leadership skills, but I understand that those guys have their place. It gets a little out of hand when it seems like overkill, and there's a big logjam within the organization. For example, I'm glad that Evans went to Texas with XO, Marchenko, Jensen, Sproul, Russo, Lashoff and Paetsch taking up spots in GR. At this point, I think there's plenty of veteran leadership in the organization - in Detroit and in Grand Rapids.

It's not necessarily one thing or the other with Cleary - it's a combination of things. It's certainly not that I'm worried about the impact of his contract on the cap or the Wings' roster. It's more that he's taking up another contract, which was handed to him. The reason (seemingly) he's been given his last three contracts is because he's chummy with Ken Holland. Maybe he can play at the AHL level and provide leadership, but so can Hoggan, Grant, Miele and Tangradi (I'm stretching a bit here). I just think the organization is set up well without Cleary, and that he didn't earn the contract.

I will concede, however, that if Grand Rapids didn't have both Grant and Hoggan, I'd probably be less annoyed (not that it matters, I'm just throwing it out there).


I doesn't matter whether it's an AHL contract or and NHL contract.  The intent is clearly to send Dano to the Griffs.  How do I know?  Because it's not coincidence that he signed for the exact amount that can be safely buried in the AHL without incurring an NHL cap penalty.  That wasn't true a year ago.  Or two years ago. 


I think we feel different because I'd love to have Cleary on a line with somebody like Mantha.  First, because Cleary was considered an under performing "floater" when he was first drafted too, and turned it around.  Secondly, because Dan has never been shy about digging in his teammates ass if they don't hop to.  I want him on the team to babysit Mantha alone. 

#2625101 Cleary re-signs... 1 year deal

Posted by kipwinger on 10 September 2015 - 09:29 AM

I doubt many of the people against the signing think Cleary's going to ****** someone's roster spot in Detroit. It's more along the lines of it being asinine to sign a consultant/advisor to a player contract. My beef is more with Holland than Cleary in this situation.


I don't know about that.  Jeff Blashill heaped praise on Hoggan, Paetsch, and Evans for being decent AHL players, but more importantly for being on ice leaders, advisors, and mentors for young players.  I don't hear anybody complaining that 38 year old Jeff Hoggan was just given a new contract despite the fact that he'll almost certainly not play in the NHL, and if he did...he would suck. 


Cleary is in the exact same position, he just makes more money.  Who cares?  His salary doesn't count against the cap, he's likely not going to take up a roster spot (barring HUGE injury woes), and if he does it will only be temporary and will only cost 900K. 


He was signed because he's not ready to stop playing, the organization wants him around, and because (here's the most important part) both his wishes and the organizations' could be satisfied without negatively impacting the big club in any way (nobody loses a roster spot, no money against the cap).