Kronwall is our default #1 Dman. Just a few years ago when he was 28/29 he was our 3/4. Nick, rafalski, were clearly better and Staurt was equal or better. This is not to say that Kronwall is bad, because that isn't it at all. But when on the same team with guys that are 40 and 36, he was secondary.
Now if you want a list, go to the thread I started about Mark fayne. I posted 24 names there and yes I missed a few. Now you may have a different list, but ask yourself the same question. How many of those guys I listed in a 1 for 1 trade would we be able to pick up for Kronwall? Very few. No, it is not all because of talent. Age and contracts do come into play.
because of our ages and time, many don't fully understand just how good guys like Howe, Abel, delvecchio, Lindsey etc..... were. As much as I love The Captain, he isn't even our best all time C. Howe is regarded by just about everyone as the greatest of all time. Even Gretzky considers him so. hell the Soviet Union was always rumored to have patterned their entire hockey program on him.
This is not meant to cast Nick in a bad light or anything. He is either the best or second best Dman of all time. In some ways he gets overlooked. he was so quite and steady. Never hurt, never angry, never dirty play, just went about his business every day and did his job-which was to shut down the other teams top forward line.
I have spent the last 3 days out of town on business. Only had time to check his forum a coupe of times while gone. Made a post or 2. I raced home today hoping that Holland would have rolled the dice and made a hockey move. Now we knw a few things.
1. Holland said: " No rentals". He lied. Legwand is a rental.
2. Holland: "would like to make a hockey move". This is a bad hockey move.
3. Holland gets screwed in every trade he makes the last few years. A 3rd round pick by itself is enough for Legwand.
If they agree to an extension when we pick them up, that is fine. But to give up anything for either and have them walk this summer, no. How much sense would it make to say.... trade tatar for vanek, and then have him leave in July? That would be dumb. I would rather trade for others-like kesler, then sign Vanek this summer as a UFA. Yes we have the cap space to do both.
We also have to look past this year. No rentals is and should be our motto. But good players that are here for 2+ more years, grab them if we can. We have more prospects than roster spots and a ton of cap room the next few years. True, not all prospects will work out. That being the case, how can you count on them? Or maybe better asked, which ones do you count on?
As a few others have mentioned, it takes time for prospects to turn into regulars or stars. Very rarely do guys come into the NHL and put up 80 points. The far more common route is a guy come up, plays 60ish games and has 30ish point. Next year more games and more points. 3rd year the same. That was the route with most of our stars now. It took them 3-5 years to hit their potential. So, are we a really good team in 3 or 4 years by standing pat? Maybe. First not all of our prospects will work out. Second Datsyuk is then gone. Third, will Z's back hold up? Fourth, will Franzen still be around or will concussions have ended his career by then?
Four years from now, Kronwall may also be done. same with Howard. E will be in his mid 30's. Most if not all of those guys will playing fewer games and putting up fewer points as they travel through their mid and late 30's. In other words, we will be treading water.
Not sure we can move Weiss even if we wanted too/someone else wanted him. he does have some NMC/NTC protection. Not sure if it is full limited etc..... I would be happy to have Kesler. But it has to be a reasonable trade. 3 for 1 is fine, but not tatar, nyquist, and jurco. Not for Kesler. ovie maybe.....
BB, welcome to the fun! Mantha will be in GR when his season ends. It has nothing to do with his talent. It is all about agreements between the NHL and CHL. Now when will he be ready to play in Detroit? None of us know. he could earn a spot in training camp next fall. Most likely he will be in GR to start the season. After that to many variables to know. Injuries could play a factor. production by other young players that will be in Detroit. But if mantha comes in and say scores 20 goals in his first 30 games, he could force his way up. he needs to develop his strength for the NHL. Currently he is listed as 6-5/205 by his Junior team. That is very thin. he does need to gain another 20 pounds of muscle-same with Jurco. 10-15 pounds for him would be awesome. So time will tell.
The Blues just made the move that teams that want to and can win the SC make. There is the big difference between us and them. They are there, ready to win it all. We have work to do to get back to that level.