This is Holland's fault. You can leave someone in the AHL all you want to develop but the game is different in the NHL and you have to expect he will need some time to find his game at this level regardless of his age.
Jesus lol Tatar isn't some blue chip prospect that was a guaranteed good NHLer. The fact that he can come up as a rookie and be part of a great 3rd line and contribute is all you can ask of him and not something he would have been able to do without his time in GR. Same goes for Nyquist. He stepped in and looks like a mature NHLer. Had they not stayed in GR for so long there would be a lot more growing pains. I think Holland and everyone's philosophy works great with developing late picks and getting the most out of them
Nowhere did I say the datsyuk elbow should be turned to the law. Maybe your english comprehension sucks but I said that it got me thinking. The fact that they're millionaires just makes it a joke that the league will fine them a measly 10 grand. Fine them 100 grand for these dirty plays and see how they respond. To a guy who makes 4 mil a year, 10 grand is pocket change.
This about sums up my reaction going from your initial post to this one.
Insulting others due to an error caused by your lack of adequate communication is disrespectful. Maybe you should consider how you word your discussions instead of criticizing others.
Posted by kipwinger
on 27 November 2013 - 03:39 PM
Quincey makes 3.775 mil, and with his ice time his points should be much higher, and his +/- should not be nearly as bad as it is
Well just to play devil's advocate, given how bad our offense is and how hard it is for us to score, one could argue that Quincey (along with everyone else on the team) has an artificially inflated +/-. Also, he's being utilized as a defensive defenseman and doesn't see PP time at all. Therefore, he's not expected to score much. In 2009-2010 Brad Stuart got lots of ice time, scored 20 pts. (with a much better offensive team), and was -12. Yet nobody would ever have said he was our worst defender...let alone our worst player (as some are mentioning). Why?
Mostly because people hate Quincey and liked Stuart based on his style of play. And a little bit because sometimes people fail to realize that unlike most other positions in most other sports, defensive defensemen don't have too many individual indicators of success. Their team can make them look REALLY good (2009 Stuart) or REALLY bad (2013 Quincey).
As a preemptive warning, let's keep the conversation well away from any political discussion.
This will likely go down the same road as the NFL. The central issues are really accepting risks to play versus understand exactly what those risks are. And if the NHL did anything to actively hide those risks.
And on a side note, man Rick Vaive is a name I haven't heard in a long time. Brings back memories of the Leafs Wings rivalry in the 80s.
Haha, that blog post is awesome. It's easy for armchair fans like me to look at scoring numbers and wonder why Brunner wasn't resigned (well, initially, anyway), but if you're a coach like Babcock that understands the game on a higher level and has seen mistakes like this over and over again in games and practices...it's no small wonder skilled guys like Brunner and Tatar end up in the doghouse for reasons that seem unwarranted.
I really think the whole NHL is just smarter about this kind of thing now. It's really no different than basketball - it's a 5-on-5 game where each player has both offensive and defensive responsibilities. But in the NBA, casual fans seem to understand that a guy that puts up 20 PPG but plays crap defense is a garbage player. Meanwhile, the Marian Gaborik's and poor man's versions of him with offensive skill seem to skate along, and invariably get big money from dumb teams, even though they cost their team as much as they help. To be fair, defensive in hockey is much more amorphous than the largely man-to-man NBA.
Posted by kipwinger
on 21 November 2013 - 03:42 PM
I hope you are right, but I get the feeling that Holland and Babcock think more of him than we do.
I actually don't think he's nearly as bad as some make him out to be. That said, he does get paid more than he's worth and I see no reason to re-sign him, any more than I see a reason for him to want to stay on this team. Quincey's through here.
Should be the top 4. Those guys can eat up the majority of the minutes and let Kindl and Quincey get easy minutes. I know Ericsson just got back from injury but since his return him and Kronwall don't seem to look as good as Kronwall with DD
Hopefully we wont trade away our middle of the pack draft pick this year for an extra second round pick like we do every year.
Why? Its been one of his most successful tactics. It got us Ferraro, Tatar and Nestrasil in 2009. Jurco, Oullet and Sproul in 2011 in what may turn out to be our best draft since 1989. And this summer, we still got Mantha after trading down, plus Nastasiuk and Nephtuzzi.
Just because Kenny re-signed Cleary and can't bring Nyquist up because he screwed the roster up so bad, doesn't mean that everything he does is wrong.