Thank god! 7.8 mil until 2018 is too much to be committed to long term with Zetterberg and Franzen tied up to infinite contracts.
Why? Franzen will be retired by 2016, and his cap hit is actually pretty reasonable for a good top-six forward.
Although I agree that Nash's contract is ridiculous. Case in point, this year's stats:
Nash: 57 GP, 18-21-39 Hudler: 57 GP, 18-17-35
Now let's compare their ES numbers as Hudler plays the point on the PP and isn't really given any kind of comparable situation to score.
Nash: 57 GP, 14-11-25 Hudler: 57 GP, 17-12-29
Ice time at even strength?
Nash: 880:57, or 15:27 per game. Hudler: 731:26, or 12:49 per game.
Hudler is better defensively than Nash, plays all three forward positions and can play the point on the PP. Nash plays one wing. Yet fans here want to trade high-end prospects AND top picks for Nash's $7.8m lifetime deal, but think bringing Hudler back in the $2.5-$3.5m range would be overpayment? Yes... let's agree to believe that.
Why is Tomas Tatar so high on our list of top prospects? Many people think he is our top forward prospect and I just dont get it at all.
I think Tatar should be behind Gustav Nyquist for sure, and also behind Teemu Pulkkinen, Calle Jarnkrok and Tomas Jurco, and even behind Jan Mursak in my opinion. I just really dont see why everyone thinks this guy is going to be so good. Someone please explain what is so great about this kid.
He deserves to be high on the list but anyone that has him above Nyquist or Jarnkrok just dont have knowledge of prospects.
As for Pulkkinen, definitely not above Tatar. Jurco is close, but Tatar has shown he can play in the NHL and is much closer to a full time job there while Jurco has had one great season in the q. Jurco is definitely moving up the list quickly however.
Tatar has good speed, is very competitive and willing to go into traffic despite his size. He has a pretty good offensive package, but not amazing. He looks like he should be a solid second line winger which is pretty good `50 points
He is behind Gustav. After that there's a log jam of guys who proved they can dominate the junior game, can dominate college kids and can dominate other foreigners. Tatar had proven at 18 he can play with men and play well. That's where his hype has come from. He is fast with a gnarly shot. and built like a mini tank.
Living in Grand Rapids I have seen many Griffins games the past few years. IMO Tatar has never really stood out to me as a star player, especially now seeing Nyquist play. He's not a bad player by any means, just doesn't seem to impact the game in the same ways that Nyquist does so that is why he is below Nyquist as far as prospects go. Considering we have plenty of upcoming propects and everyone seems to be pretty high on Tatar as a prospect around the league, I wouldn't be opposed to looking to trade him in a package for a sniper at wing. Obviously it depends on who would be coming our way in the trade, but I just don't see Tatar being a top line player in his career!
Here is why Tatar is perhaps the best forward prospect in the organization, aside from perhaps Jurco who is in juniors.
Gustav Nyquist is 22, almost 23. Tatar just turned 21. Pulkkinen just turned 20. Jurco just turned 19. Sheahan just turned 20. Jarnkrok is 20.
Mursak and Emmerton were both ranked similarly highly (potential second-liners) and are not much older (both are 23), but they are both on the team now - ahead of Nyquist.
Nyquist is looking great in Grand Rapids, no doubt. But he's two years older than Tatar, who is ALSO looking great. Tatar's production at 21 is similar to Hudler's in Grand Rapids. However, Hudler at 22 was far, far beyond what Nyquist is doing and at 23 he was in the NHL with the Wings and putting up strong offensive numbers even on the fourth line. Since then, Hudler has always been one of the league's top 180 scoring forwards at year's end. Tatar is on that path pretty solidly. Nyquist, not nearly as much.
Jurco might have an edge up as he's a very good junior prospect and has the size advantage, but Tatar has a definite advantage defensively.
No suspension. At most he deserved 2 minutes. He tried to go around Ehrhoff, and couldn't easily do it. He ended up in a situation where he was charging the net hard with the puck and his options were to try and score (and possibly crash into Miller) or to throw himself onto the goal. I bet that would have been amusing.
For those of you offering up Hudler instead of Cleary, here's an interesting fact:
Alexander Semin is 27, and a UFA this offseason. Jiri Hudler is 27, and a UFA this offseason. Dan Cleary is 32 (turns 33 in three weeks) signed through next season at an inexpensive price given his performance over the past few years.
Jakub Kindl is 24, signed for one more year, then becomes an RFA. Jeff Schultz is 26, signed for three more years, and then becomes a UFA.
I like Dan Cleary. I think he's a good player and the kind of guy you want to have around. That said, he's getting old and he's very injury prone.
Semin is an interesting case. I don't think a deal gets done unless a) he's willing to extend with the trading team or b) he's given up on the cheap.
But in either of those scenarios, Washington is dealing out a soon-to-be UFA forward and expects some value back. Hudler himself is a soon-to-be UFA forward, so that doesn't really offer very much unless he somehow clicks with Ovechkin and starts scoring crazy amounts. So you can rule Hudler out of the deal.
On defense, it's interesting. Jeff Schultz is a solid defenseman and would be a great addition. I don't want to part with Kindl, and I'm sure Holland doesn't either. Ericsson offers many of the same things Kindl does, plus more experience and notably, playoff experience on a Cup finalist.
So swapping Ericsson, who is 27, for Kindl shouldn't be an issue. Ericsson is signed for three years so that's not a concern to Washington.
Ultimately, if you don't want to see Cleary in this scenario, you have to put Franzen or Filppula. Dats and Z would bring back Semin on their own, and nobody else but Franzen and Filppula have the trade value and contract situation Washington would be looking for. Filppula is easily the most valuable of the three, and Cleary the most expendable. But Franzen is the best trade piece (if necessary) as he's inconsistent, injury prone, and getting moreso on both fronts every day. Cleary is injury prone, but he's been a pretty consistent guy the past few years.
So let's make it Cleary/Ericsson/1st for Semin/Schultz. The Wings losing a first that could be used to nab a Parise or Suter might hurt, but the potential outcome of having Semin with Dats or Z is very nice.
And finally; the pick would have to be adjusted based on when during the season the trade is happening. If Cleary isn't going to waive his NTC, then it's a deadline deal and the pick shouldn't be necessary to grab Semin from Washington if they're still shopping him. A Cleary/Ericsson/1st package should be enough to bring back Parise or Suter (or Weber?) at the deadline, and Semin falls a bit short of that level. maybe a 3rd or lower, or maybe even no pick.
Solves the Brad Stuart "issue" going forward by getting a better replacement for him than Ericsson, while significantly improving top-six scoring. Semin re-signs at a similar value, or Holland deals his rights plus something for a good player (or their rights, such as Parise/Suter/Weber), and it works out.
Next year? Assuming Lidstrom doesn't return, it could be this...
With Suter at 6.5, Semin at 7, Parise at 7, Helm at 1.5, Abdelkader at 1, and Hudler at 3, and Joey Mac (or similarly priced backup) as well as two minimum wage additions (retention of Janik and Conner?) this roster works but is at the cap.
My bet: This means Mursak is doing well. So the team wants to get Brunnstrom into some games and give him a real chance to prove himself now before it's go time for Mursak. That way, we know if we simply waive Brunnstrom and don't worry about it if he's picked up, or waive someone else (Eaves, Miller) because someone will have to be waived - unless Brunner is still under the 30-day limit when Mursak comes back.
This thread is too much. Hudler playing D at the NHL level, you have to be kidding me?
And the reason he had no chance on the Richards goal is because he's slower than molasses...his lack of speed certainly doesn't help his versatility.
Had Kronwall been skating as hard as Hudler was, Richards never gets that puck. The reason Richards got that puck is because Hudler tried to stop it at the line, as anyone would. Richards was already skating towards him at this point, and Hudler had to turn and start going. Richards already had a significant head start because he was up to full speed much sooner. Had Kronwall started skating hard (and kept skating) once it became apparent the puck was going past the line, that is his puck. Or maybe Cleary doesn't just randomly shovel the puck. Hudler had absolutely ZERO chance to stop Richards' goal. Also, if you watch the replay, Howard basically just stands there while Richards puts it through him; it's like he wasn't expecting Richards to actually shoot. But yes, it's Hudler's fault because he was the guy who tried to get to the puck and Richards beat him to it. Damn that Hudler, trying to prevent a goal and failing.
Except he never actually plays center, nor is on the ice in close games.
I don't dislike Hudler at all, but he's as one-dimensional as Tomas Holmstrom. You're the only person who thinks otherwise.
Ok, and he does play defense. The other day he played more defense than forward. He's captained the Czech national team and starred at center in the KHL, AHL, and internationally.
He doesn't play center because Babcock has never given him a chance there. How about a first line of Zetterberg/Datsyuk/Filppula and a second line of Franzen/Hudler/Cleary? Leaves Abs/Helm/Bert and Miller/Emmy/Homer to finish out the roster. Or you can go with Filppula/Datsyuk/Homer, Franzen/Zetterberg/Cleary, Abs/Hudler/Bertuzzi, and Miller/Helm/Eaves. Hudler at center is not a ridiculous idea; he's an excellent playmaker and if you put him between two big bodies, the "small guy" argument is invalidated. Reference the early 80s and the Messier/Gretzky/Anderson line.
I think the best part so far is Hudler being called "versatile". If completely one-dimensional was meant by that, then yes I'm on board.
Hudler has been pretty solid defensively if you would actually pay attention. He backchecks as hard as anyone, and in the Anaheim game he fought through two players to clear the puck. He's been very good on the PP, keeping the puck in the zone and setting up plays better than just about anyone the Wings have put out there. He had no chance on the Richards goal; look to Kronwall and Cleary for the issues on that play.
As for his versatility... Hudler is probably one of a handful (at most) of players on the team capable of player center, both wings, and defense. I would call that versatile.
You are correct!!!!! Talking about Bruno and Cleary is hilarious because they are different players with different talents. Bruno is trying to get a shot and Clearly has already had his. I would suggest that Cleary is a perhaps a high second or third liner.... NOT an offensive juggernaut that should play on the same line as Pavel Datsyuk. We know that both Bruno and Nyqvist have a ton of potential...and if the other guys arent doing it, give a young guy with alot of potential offense a chance.
BTW, You constanly seem to have to critique every posters opinions that differs from yours....and that is fine...but I dont give two scoops of shat what Cleary did 3.5 years ago in the LAST shift of one game...Bruno paced for 60+ points in 2006...and I dont give a shat about that either. Cleary isnt doing his job and hasnt all season so step aside and give a young guy a chance...That is what I give a SHAT about!!!!!
Cleary scored at a first-line level last season, and scored at a better rate than Franzen.
Brunnstrom was a mediocre AHL player last season. He would have been second or possibly third-line on the Griffins.
We're not even to Thanksgiving yet. Cleary has more than enough time to fix his season. Remember last year, when Hudler scored one goal and six points in his first 30 games? That was through the end of December. Over his final 43, he scored 31 points, and his overall scoring level placed him as a second liner. If you go based just on his first half, he belongs as a fourth liner, spare forward, or maybe i nthe AHL. If you go on the second half, there's no way you can justify keeping him off the top line. Cleary is coming off a rib injury; those suck. He shouldn't be on the top line right now, but largely because his recovery is affecting his play rather than the fact that he's not good anymore. If we get to February and he has 7 goals and 13 assists, then yeah, put him on the third or fourth line. But I don't see that happening.
But this feels more like a "He's not Hudler!" than a "Patty can do it!" kind of thing.
Eaves has a good shot and is a good skater, but he's a mediocre passer. His entire purpose would be to blast shots from the point. Think Jason Williams, but better defensively and without the passing skill.
That's why Eaves isn't on the PP.
Samuelsson was on the PP because he has a good shot, is a decent passer, and could play defensively. He wasn't a one-tool guy in that situation like Eaves would be.
Hudler is fine on the PP. He actually looked better working with Lidstrom than he ever has with Kronwall. He was the team's best player in the failed 5-minute PP against St. Louis and he regularly creates chances.
I think Lidstrom/Hudler and Kronwall/Kindl make for solid PP pairings. I'd rather see Hudler up front but Babcock has his template, and his template doesn't have room for a shifty little guy who's in the league based on skill and hard work, not physical gifts.