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gcom007

Member Since 18 Dec 2003
Offline Last Active Today, 05:43 PM
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#2536288 Regner: Next year could be Babcock's last

Posted by Euro_Twins on 16 September 2014 - 11:24 AM

 
I also think he should be the highest paid coach, my point was he shouldn't be paid DOUBLE what the highest paid coach is getting.
 


Well when he signed his current contract he WAS the highest paid coach, so I think he will be again. Probably will end up around 3m/season

 
When and where did he get the 2nd Cup?
 
I'm sorry, but I'd respectfully disagree. Babs is a great coach, but several people have said it, these guys are paid to perform and rewarded for it. At a certain level, though, two guys can't get credit for the same job. Is Holland putting the right players on the roster or is Babs extracting more from less? My point is - if Holland is putting the 'right' guys on the roster, Babs isn't getting enough out of them and, conversely, if Babs is getting the Wings into the playoffs with a sub-par squad, then Holland isn't doing his job. If everyone in management is doing their jobs, how are we a 'borderline' playoff team? Holland already got an extension and credit for his job...
 
If Babcock feels he 'deserves' to become the highest paid coach in the NHL, I hope Holland does let him walk. I'm not trying to take anything away from Babcock, but he did take over the defending President's Trophy winner in 05-06, a team which had made the playoffs 14 consecutive times, and three years later he won his only Stanley Cup. I'm not trying to say he's not successful or that he doesn't get a ton out of his players. But a good coach in a great organization has to be that much better to stand out.
 
Compare Babcock's Wings to Bowman's Wings - 9 playoff seasons each - 1 Cup (Babs) to 3 Cups (Bowman) - 2 President's Trophies (Babs) to 3 for Bowman - Bowman has an Adams' while Babs does not - Babs has an edge in regular season win pct. but in the playoffs - Babs 0.542 to Bowman 0.642.
 
Again, not saying Babs isn't a solid coach, but the Wings won't fold as an organization without him.


Take bowmans teams in those 9 years and compare it to babs teams. Babs best team wasn't nearly as good as bowmans


#2534248 Holland signs 4 year extension with wings **MOD Warning Post 130**

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 14 August 2014 - 12:20 PM

 

Its not like the guy scheduled a two week vacation to the moon and skipped free agency the last few years.  There's plenty of info that suggests he kicked a ton of tires, made several intriguing offers, and in most cases those players chose not to come here for various reasons.  He's not soley to blame for our recent downturn.  You don't lose people like Lidstrom, Rafalski, and Osgood and replace them all right away...in some cases you may never be able to replace talent like that.

 

Holland's job is extremely difficult but all that matters are the actual results, not how many tires he kicked. 

 

Dan Cleary tries as hard or harder than anyone on the team but I don't see people giving him a free pass because of all the plays he tried to make but failed.

 

And Holland should have been working on a transition plan for Lidstrom's retirement for years.  Him participating in the ridiculous Suter sweepstakes was a pretty good indication that he didn't have one.  The reality is you don't replace Nick Lidstrom.  You have to reevaluate and restructure the entire team.  Holland keeps making moves like it's 2008.




#2534220 Holland signs 4 year extension with wings **MOD Warning Post 130**

Posted by number9 on 14 August 2014 - 09:42 AM

Best signing yet. Hollands offseason acquisition is himself. His deadline acquisition will be Babs.


#2534044 Alfie wants to play

Posted by number9 on 11 August 2014 - 09:22 PM

The scary part is Holland knows Alfredsson can't play 82 games, but seems more then willing to sign him. I wish we would move on, but we won't. #11 and #71 in the starting line-up, baby!

 

Your entitled to you opinion, but don't care pair 11 to the former 11, they're not in the same category. Signing Alfie helps this team (No i don't want to tank)




#2533966 Greatest Wings game ever

Posted by Jedi on 10 August 2014 - 10:06 AM

Pretty sure that was a Blues team with Gretzky as well.


Gretzky turned the puck over to Yzerman, who then scored the game/series winner.

Another vote for March 27th of 97 here. The game that really solidified this team I to a group of guys who believed they could win the cup that year.


#2533687 Candiens, P.K. Subban agree to 8 year contract

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 04 August 2014 - 01:37 PM

Here's Subban with his NBA attitude, putting himself above his teammates, putting himself above the league, and generally making it all about himself. 

 

 

 

 

(I was being sarcastic)

 

 

In interviews and what I saw on CH24 he comes across as one of the more well spoken and humble players in the league.  




#2533496 Red Army Documentary

Posted by number9 on 01 August 2014 - 11:00 PM

This looks awesome. At the end of the day when you ask what is the coolest thing about the Red Wings I'll say the Russian 5. I loved them. That was the beginning of the Red Wings being the most progressive hockey team, going where other teams wouldn't think to, to build a dynasty. And it really was the beginning of our dynasty. They were mesmerizing to watch. It was like "Hey you know that crazy good Soviet team that has played in 5 man units since birth that dominates the world, they're ours now". Can't wait for this.

 

One of the things I loved was all the stories of what those Russians had to do to defect from the USSR. Backroom deals, players jumping out of moving trucks, faking serious ailments, dodging the KGB, If anyone remembers any of those please share.




#2533454 Paul McCartney and the Red Wings

Posted by GMRwings1983 on 01 August 2014 - 12:25 PM

"I'm not half the man I used to be" should be one of Kenny Holland's favorite lines.  




#2533305 Samuelsson signs new contract....... with Djurgarden.

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 29 July 2014 - 02:51 PM

As fun as it is to bash on Sammy, I'll never forget him for starting and finishing this play:

 

 

Also the two opening goals in Game 1 of the 2008 Finals against the Pens.

 

And the hundreds of logo shots.

 

Agreed.

 

All shin pad assassin jokes aside, Sammy was a bargain during his first stay here in Detroit.   He had good size, was irritating to play against, and put up good numbers for his salary. 

 

It's just unfortunate that Holland keeps repeating the mistake of bringing back former players, but I hold no ill will for Sammy. 




#2533099 Which Players Agency would you choose and why ?

Posted by Spongewingredpants on 28 July 2014 - 05:28 AM

on a related note:

 

Who is your favorite hockey puck manufacturer

 

  • 23px-Flag_of_Canada.svg.png In Glas Co.
  • 23px-Flag_of_Canada.svg.png Sher-Wood
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_Czech_Republic.svg.png Gufex[9]
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_Czech_Republic.svg.png Rubena[9]
  • 23px-Flag_of_Slovakia.svg.png Vegum Dolné Vestenice[10]
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_United_States.svg.png Converse
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_United_States.svg.png HockeyShot
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_United_States.svg.png Spalding
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_People%27s_Republic_of_ Xiamen Yin Hua Silicone Rubber Products Co., Ltd.
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_People%27s_Republic_of_ Xiamen Deng Hong Silica Gel Product Co., Ltd.
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_People%27s_Republic_of_ Xiamen Ijetech Industry & Trade Co. Ltd



#2531929 Holland Wiki page edited

Posted by Zetts on 13 July 2014 - 10:57 AM

Yea, but no one says what they'd do as GM. I bet if the average Red Wing fan became GM, he/she would make horrible trades and sign over priced UFA's. We'd be like the Leafs and our team would be build around guys like Kessel, Phaneuf, Lupul, Clarkson, van Reimsdyk and Bozak for the next 4 years plus. No thanks, I'll take Kenny, who's building the team with the draft, isn't signing any over priced UFA's, and actually knows how the cap works.

 

I understand signing Quincey and Cleary isn't "sexy", but they're only 1 and 2 year deals. That Niskanen deal is insane! Smith and Dekeyser are going to be better then him. Unless a team has drafted the player, I don't think any UFA should be signed for over 4 years. Do an online search and see how many horrible long term UFA signings there's been since 2005-06. The Wings don't have any bad ones over 3 years. The only potential bad one could be Weiss, but he's got a few years to still make the deal a good one.

Yes and Dan Cleary can play better hockey than anyone on this board too.  Like Cleary, Ken Holland is a professional (in theory), who is paid a LOT of money to do his job

 

Pretty much anyone in a professional field is better at their job than someone who isn't part of that field.  But that certainly doesn't mean that an outsider can't objectively see when someone is sucking at their job.

 

Edit: To add to that, if the new standard for managing the Wings is, "well, he's better than fans on a message board," we're in a s**t-tonne of trouble.




#2531224 Wings re-sign Cleary $1.5 mill + $1mill in game bonuses

Posted by Supface on 10 July 2014 - 05:10 PM

Obligatory:

 




#2529393 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by b.shanafan14 on 02 July 2014 - 10:47 AM

I'll say this: Holland did as well as he could with his offers to other FA that chose to go elsewhere - besides maybe Gilbert which could have been a cheap improvement and still left room for the top-2 or -4 defenseman we were seeking. Despite his compounded failure to "nut-up" in previous off-seasons, I honestly believe he did all within his power to get the players we needed this off-season (given the current sad state of the team, which is his doing). If they don't want to come here, you can't force them and shouldn't grossly overpay them.

 

However, there is absolutely ZERO excuse for the Quincey signing. That is disappointment turning into full-blown, unavoidable, mature, objective, and justified RAGE. Holland did what he always does when he misses out on his target: slaps some tape and shoe-polish on trash and tries to pass it off as a "bargain" or a "consolation prize". We aren't getting the sirloin because they ran out of prime rib; we've been fed a steady diet of cold spam. For that, Holland should be replaced.




#2529255 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by rick zombo on 02 July 2014 - 12:06 AM

But you have to admit, those years were unique for the Wings, and the team that had the most success was primarily a team built before the cap. When they got back to playing, they had the benefit of a salary rollback and they were able to buyout some deals that weren't close to reasonable with a cap and keep the core of the team together. Not only that, you had the unexpected rise of Franzen, who had his most success when he was making very little money. Zetterberg wasn't making star money until 2009 I believe despite being a bonafide superstar; wasn't his deal before his current contract for less than $3 million? I want to say $2.2 or $2.8. Either one was well below the value he brought to the team at the time.

But I'm not really trying to take anything away from him so much as not given him too much credit for actually building a cap team, because I don't think he had to start building a legitimate cap team until 2009. You have to admit, he was lucky to have Franzen breakout while making next to no money, and getting away with paying Z less than $3 million throughout that period was of tremendous benefit. With that kind of luck and those RFA deals, there are likely a lot of GMs who could've done less than Holland had to and still had a tremendous amount of success.

I mean, seriously, despite the salary cap and despite having a ton of talent up front, those lingering RFA deals allowed him to sign Hossa to a big 1 year deal in the summer of 2008. That's no small or ordinary thing, especially with no cap hit trickery from a longer deal to lessen the blow. For the team to be as loaded with talent as they were in the cap era and still be able to pull that off seems utterly laughable now, but again, we were lucky to have those lingering RFA deals and Franzen became a beast seemingly out of nowhere for a couple years.

When tougher decisions started having to be made in 2009, that is when the reality of the salary cap started weighing down on how this team would be built, and it's been all downhill since. Every summer since the summer of 2009, he's been caught flat footed and unprepared. Even he has flat out admitted that at times, earlier on though more than in recent years.

So sure, he had great success early on in the cap era, but how much that success had to do with him having to build a team in the cap era and how much it had to do with pure luck, rollbacks and outlandishly amazing value on some RFA deals is debatable. Again, I'm not trying to take anything away from his success at that time, but I also don't think that era represents Holland's ability to build a true cap era team, and I don't think it serves as justification to continue to give him more chances after five years of him failing to address needs and countless flat out bad signings.

 

This is a good post. 

 

But Holland’s done a respectable job of managing the cap. 

 

Sometimes I think people forget how the NHL works now.

 

You absolutely have to built your team through the draft. I don’t have to tell anyone where Detroit has had the luxury of picking from since 91 do I? Holland’s at an automatic disadvantage. It’s a miracle that Datsyuk and Z were as good as they were or we would have been picking Doughty 2nd overall in 2008, not LA.

 

Victim of his own success. 

 

I can only truly disapprove of Holland’s cap management for one reason. Hossa vs Franzen. Kenny could have kept Hossa and gotten a king’s ransom for Mule after those two back-to-back playoff runs. Who knows? That coveted #1 D man could be our right now via the Franzen trade that never happened. The Bowman’s would have traded his ass. 




#2529197 2014 Offseason League Signings and Trades

Posted by VM1138 on 01 July 2014 - 09:44 PM

"My first priority was to be on a good team."  -Ehrhoff.

 

Holy crap.  Just humiliating.

 

That article also takes a dig at the Wings not being able to buy their team.  That pisses me off.  That wasn't even really the case in the pre-cap era. We spent a lot, but we got the right players. 

 

I'm thinking it's Babcock.  Almost every player suffers individually under his reign, and that lowers their future value.  Case in point: no one really wants any of our players except for Nyquist, Jurco or maybe Tatar.  So coming to Detroit could actually be bad for their careers.  He just doesn't seem to utilize some players where they would be strongest (Smith, Cleary, Quincey, Kindl, etc.)