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gcom007

Member Since 18 Dec 2003
Offline Last Active Today, 07:47 PM
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#2533099 Which Players Agency would you choose and why ?

Posted by Spongewingredpants on Today, 05:28 AM

on a related note:

 

Who is your favorite hockey puck manufacturer

 

  • 23px-Flag_of_Canada.svg.png In Glas Co.
  • 23px-Flag_of_Canada.svg.png Sher-Wood
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_Czech_Republic.svg.png Gufex[9]
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_Czech_Republic.svg.png Rubena[9]
  • 23px-Flag_of_Slovakia.svg.png Vegum Dolné Vestenice[10]
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_United_States.svg.png Converse
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_United_States.svg.png HockeyShot
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_United_States.svg.png Spalding
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_People%27s_Republic_of_ Xiamen Yin Hua Silicone Rubber Products Co., Ltd.
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_People%27s_Republic_of_ Xiamen Deng Hong Silica Gel Product Co., Ltd.
  • 23px-Flag_of_the_People%27s_Republic_of_ Xiamen Ijetech Industry & Trade Co. Ltd



#2531929 Holland Wiki page edited

Posted by Zetts on 13 July 2014 - 10:57 AM

Yea, but no one says what they'd do as GM. I bet if the average Red Wing fan became GM, he/she would make horrible trades and sign over priced UFA's. We'd be like the Leafs and our team would be build around guys like Kessel, Phaneuf, Lupul, Clarkson, van Reimsdyk and Bozak for the next 4 years plus. No thanks, I'll take Kenny, who's building the team with the draft, isn't signing any over priced UFA's, and actually knows how the cap works.

 

I understand signing Quincey and Cleary isn't "sexy", but they're only 1 and 2 year deals. That Niskanen deal is insane! Smith and Dekeyser are going to be better then him. Unless a team has drafted the player, I don't think any UFA should be signed for over 4 years. Do an online search and see how many horrible long term UFA signings there's been since 2005-06. The Wings don't have any bad ones over 3 years. The only potential bad one could be Weiss, but he's got a few years to still make the deal a good one.

Yes and Dan Cleary can play better hockey than anyone on this board too.  Like Cleary, Ken Holland is a professional (in theory), who is paid a LOT of money to do his job

 

Pretty much anyone in a professional field is better at their job than someone who isn't part of that field.  But that certainly doesn't mean that an outsider can't objectively see when someone is sucking at their job.

 

Edit: To add to that, if the new standard for managing the Wings is, "well, he's better than fans on a message board," we're in a s**t-tonne of trouble.




#2531224 Wings re-sign Cleary $1.5 mill + $1mill in game bonuses

Posted by Supface on 10 July 2014 - 05:10 PM

Obligatory:

 




#2529393 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by b.shanafan14 on 02 July 2014 - 10:47 AM

I'll say this: Holland did as well as he could with his offers to other FA that chose to go elsewhere - besides maybe Gilbert which could have been a cheap improvement and still left room for the top-2 or -4 defenseman we were seeking. Despite his compounded failure to "nut-up" in previous off-seasons, I honestly believe he did all within his power to get the players we needed this off-season (given the current sad state of the team, which is his doing). If they don't want to come here, you can't force them and shouldn't grossly overpay them.

 

However, there is absolutely ZERO excuse for the Quincey signing. That is disappointment turning into full-blown, unavoidable, mature, objective, and justified RAGE. Holland did what he always does when he misses out on his target: slaps some tape and shoe-polish on trash and tries to pass it off as a "bargain" or a "consolation prize". We aren't getting the sirloin because they ran out of prime rib; we've been fed a steady diet of cold spam. For that, Holland should be replaced.




#2529255 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by rick zombo on 02 July 2014 - 12:06 AM

But you have to admit, those years were unique for the Wings, and the team that had the most success was primarily a team built before the cap. When they got back to playing, they had the benefit of a salary rollback and they were able to buyout some deals that weren't close to reasonable with a cap and keep the core of the team together. Not only that, you had the unexpected rise of Franzen, who had his most success when he was making very little money. Zetterberg wasn't making star money until 2009 I believe despite being a bonafide superstar; wasn't his deal before his current contract for less than $3 million? I want to say $2.2 or $2.8. Either one was well below the value he brought to the team at the time.

But I'm not really trying to take anything away from him so much as not given him too much credit for actually building a cap team, because I don't think he had to start building a legitimate cap team until 2009. You have to admit, he was lucky to have Franzen breakout while making next to no money, and getting away with paying Z less than $3 million throughout that period was of tremendous benefit. With that kind of luck and those RFA deals, there are likely a lot of GMs who could've done less than Holland had to and still had a tremendous amount of success.

I mean, seriously, despite the salary cap and despite having a ton of talent up front, those lingering RFA deals allowed him to sign Hossa to a big 1 year deal in the summer of 2008. That's no small or ordinary thing, especially with no cap hit trickery from a longer deal to lessen the blow. For the team to be as loaded with talent as they were in the cap era and still be able to pull that off seems utterly laughable now, but again, we were lucky to have those lingering RFA deals and Franzen became a beast seemingly out of nowhere for a couple years.

When tougher decisions started having to be made in 2009, that is when the reality of the salary cap started weighing down on how this team would be built, and it's been all downhill since. Every summer since the summer of 2009, he's been caught flat footed and unprepared. Even he has flat out admitted that at times, earlier on though more than in recent years.

So sure, he had great success early on in the cap era, but how much that success had to do with him having to build a team in the cap era and how much it had to do with pure luck, rollbacks and outlandishly amazing value on some RFA deals is debatable. Again, I'm not trying to take anything away from his success at that time, but I also don't think that era represents Holland's ability to build a true cap era team, and I don't think it serves as justification to continue to give him more chances after five years of him failing to address needs and countless flat out bad signings.

 

This is a good post. 

 

But Holland’s done a respectable job of managing the cap. 

 

Sometimes I think people forget how the NHL works now.

 

You absolutely have to built your team through the draft. I don’t have to tell anyone where Detroit has had the luxury of picking from since 91 do I? Holland’s at an automatic disadvantage. It’s a miracle that Datsyuk and Z were as good as they were or we would have been picking Doughty 2nd overall in 2008, not LA.

 

Victim of his own success. 

 

I can only truly disapprove of Holland’s cap management for one reason. Hossa vs Franzen. Kenny could have kept Hossa and gotten a king’s ransom for Mule after those two back-to-back playoff runs. Who knows? That coveted #1 D man could be our right now via the Franzen trade that never happened. The Bowman’s would have traded his ass. 




#2529197 2014 Offseason League Signings and Trades

Posted by VM1138 on 01 July 2014 - 09:44 PM

"My first priority was to be on a good team."  -Ehrhoff.

 

Holy crap.  Just humiliating.

 

That article also takes a dig at the Wings not being able to buy their team.  That pisses me off.  That wasn't even really the case in the pre-cap era. We spent a lot, but we got the right players. 

 

I'm thinking it's Babcock.  Almost every player suffers individually under his reign, and that lowers their future value.  Case in point: no one really wants any of our players except for Nyquist, Jurco or maybe Tatar.  So coming to Detroit could actually be bad for their careers.  He just doesn't seem to utilize some players where they would be strongest (Smith, Cleary, Quincey, Kindl, etc.)




#2529194 Quincey re-signed by DET. 2 yr s $4.25 mill AAV

Posted by VM1138 on 01 July 2014 - 09:41 PM

I think it wasnt being stagnant, it was because NO ONE wanted to sign here. Holland probably got scared and did something to do something because he's lost.

 

He gave up. I can see the "lack of drive" argument.  He could've waited all summer to find a deal somewhere else.  Maybe Europe?  Instead, he signed our worst defensemen who actually cost us at least 16 games last season, gave him a raise, and closed up a roster spot.  So basically...we're done on defense.  A kid needs to get a chance.  Maybe we add someone like Vrbata, but we're basically done up front, too.

 

So on day one of free agency...Holland has already given up.  Sure, we discarded some chaff, but not enough, and we didn't actually get any better.  We can only hope we're good enough to get a higher seed in the playoffs and maybe get a more favorable matchup until we run into a team like the Bruins who are built to beat our team.




#2528453 2014 Offseason League Signings and Trades

Posted by Internet.Unknown on 01 July 2014 - 03:02 PM

As far as I'm concerned Holland has done the best job he could unless he trades away a young player for garbage. Free agebts don't want to come here? Fine build a winner from within then. Draft well. Develop even better. All things he has oversaught durring his tenure.

 

Hard to "build from within" when the team is committed to making the playoffs every year. If the Wings were to really go with a youth movement, I would support it. But the team is just treading water.




#2528243 2014 Offseason League Signings and Trades

Posted by GMRwings1983 on 01 July 2014 - 01:53 PM

Dallas is making moves, trying to improve, and players aren't refusing to sign there.

 

Tampa Bay is making moves, trying to improve, and players aren't refusing to sign there.

 

Am I sensing a theme?

 

People who know history know that Holland didn't build those late 90's Cup teams. He spent to maintain them (02) after they had been built by Bowman and his predecessors. Furthermore, Holland was lucky in 08 and 09. (See Joe Dumars for reference). Having the best defenseman in a generation (along with prime Dats and Z) can do that to an organization. He didn't build the Wings championships and he sure as hell can't build them now.

 

People shouldn't be complaining about getting fleeced in the Legwand deal. The team got fleeced in losing Yzerman and Nill.

 

As I said before, Holland is like a trust fund baby that ends up blowing all the money he was given.  He's withered this team down into mediocrity.  

 

Unfortunately, our owner is senile and is eating peanuts at Tiger games.  




#2528122 2014 Offseason League Signings and Trades

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 01 July 2014 - 01:21 PM

Whelp, thems the breaks.  Nothing to be angry about guys.  It's fate.  There was literally nothing else that could have been done to improve this team over the last 5 years, other than what's already been done. Nothing.  He went to the wall and it just wasn't in the cards. 

 

Ken Holland is only one man.  He can't produce miracles. 

 

I disagree (unless you're being sarcastic?)

 

Replace Ken Holland's name with Dan Cleary and tell me if that line of reasoning still works.  

 

Cleary works harder than almost anyone on the ice, but that doesn't matter.  He simply doesn't produce the results necessary to remain competitive at the NHL level. 

 

Holland has an incredibly difficult job.  So do the other 29 GM's in the league.  It's not always going to work out, but the results are still what matter.  Not how hard he tried.  

 

There were absolutely things that could've been done in the last 5 years.  Just because Holland didn't make them doesn't mean they didn't exist. 




#2523251 GM moves

Posted by GMRwings1983 on 08 June 2014 - 11:51 AM

Holland is like someone who inherits a big savings account, and then lets it dwindle down over the years without supplementing his income.  

 

Account will be almost empty when Datsyuk and Zetterberg retire.  




#2517278 ECQF - Game 5 - Red Wings at Bruins - 3:00 PM EST

Posted by lomekian on 26 April 2014 - 05:43 PM

We drafted the wrong brother.  

To be fair, Smith has been vastly improved in the last 3 months. Lets see if that's permanent first, shall we?




#2516385 ECQF - Game 5 - Red Wings at Bruins - 3:00 PM EST

Posted by Tr!PoD#19 on 26 April 2014 - 02:36 PM

You know which Wing has really impressed me in this series?
 
................


Smith.


#2515253 ECQF - Game 4 - Bruins 3 at Red Wings 2 (F/OT)

Posted by Firehawk on 24 April 2014 - 08:44 PM

If the refs would call obvious penalties they are looking right at, they wouldn't get such a bad rap. Instead they call crap they think they see and don't call obvious dives. Its comical. Then u get people defending the refs. Priceless


#2507655 bashing skid the kid

Posted by NYC Wings Fanatic on 09 April 2014 - 12:56 PM

Aside from the so-called "past" diving and whining, the thing that always sticks with me is the instance a few years ago in the playoffs of his repeatedly chopping hard at the back of Z's legs with his stick on the way to their respective benches long after the particular play was whistled dead, and he thought that no one was looking (except he forgot - the broadcast cameras). I have seen him do this repeatedly over the years, and if he has stopped this lately, then fine and good, but can anyone honestly say that Datsyuk, Zetterberg, or Lidstrom would ever have done this?