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Member Since 20 Jan 2004
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#2684346 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by kipwinger on 02 August 2016 - 03:41 PM

So, you want a guy who is in his second year to center the top line?


The same guy that had a rough time in the tail end of his first season?


You know, the guy who was in the Calder discussion until he fell off the map due to the longer grind of an NHL schedule?


That guy?


Yep.  Who else do we have?  I expect he'll be better in his second year than his first.  But if it makes you feel better you could switch the top two lines considering it doesn't make a difference which order I list them in but only how much ice time they get.  It's worth noting that Datsyuk was on our "2nd line" last year and still had top line minutes.  You're getting WAY too caught up with designations.








#2684304 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by kliq on 01 August 2016 - 11:17 AM

If Holland ranks dead last in trades over the last x amount of years, that tell me their are two main reasons.


1) Holland refuses to make a bad deal (think the Seguin trade). He likely turns down alot of trades, which on one hand pisses off a lot of fans, but on the other who wishes in retrospect that he pulled the trigger on the supposed Larkin/Myers deal.


2) Holland is not creative. To make trades sometimes you need to be able to get creative, maybe Holland and his team are just not good at that.


Most likely answer, a combination of the 2 things above. When you have a GM who refuses to risk losing on deals AND is not creative, you rank dead last in trades.

#2683584 Fans rank front offices....Wings 21st

Posted by ToastyWing on 21 July 2016 - 02:02 PM

Kind of interesting that both of Hollands 'disciples' - Yzerman and Nill are ranked (well) ahead of him -  #1 and #6 respectively.   


In fact of the top 10 'ranked' GMs, Only 2 (Nashville and SJ) have been with their team for longer than 6 years. 


You often hear about Coaches having a 10 year limit on being effective, as their message can often get stale over time and players tend to tune them out.   I think that is also possible with GM's (to a lesser degree), their philosophy can become stale, and often times they rely on 'whats worked before' and don't change with the times.


Its very easy to get tunnel vision as a GM, and this seems to have been the case with Holland...he was a master at finding the right fit of superstars who could actually play together as a team (its not as easy as it looks - see the Yankees), and he had a knack for surrounding himself with a staff full of people extremely good at their jobs (scouting in particular), additionally, he was/is extremely good at retaining his players.  Very rarely do you see a player leave the Red Wings (that the wings actually wanted to keep)  - he is loyal .  This used to be a positive attribute as it showed other players that once you're a Red Wing, they will take care of you, and there was no salary cap so who cares if its a slight over payment - hes 'our guy' now, and the Wings treat their guys better than any other organization. 


The salary cap has honestly messed up Holland something fierce. yes he won the cup in 08 but that team was almost completely built prior to the salary cap era.  He has tried to adjust - but seems to have overcompensated in some aspects.  He used to deal young players and draft picks without a second thought, he now hoards them like they are all the holy grail, and is petrified of trading away a potential 'stud' for an established vet.  


One area he hasn't changed at all in is loyalty to his players.  He still signs guys to very generous contracts (this off season being a prime example), and makes sure they get playing time/a roster spot, even thought there are more talented/cheaper players in the AHL chomping at the bit to player at this level.  This is awesome when you have a team full of studs, as you will most likely keep them around, but when your team is full of average NHLers, you need to be cut throat and fearless when it comes to choosing who to keep and who to let walk away.  


I am not saying that Holland cant be successful again, but history is def. against him suddenly changing his ways and making the necessary roster moves that this team needs.  I think a change of scenery would be better for everyone involved...

#2683252 Darren Helm re-signed: 5 years, $3.85m AAV

Posted by lwing on 15 July 2016 - 09:53 AM

You know when you are at a job interview, they always ask, "Where do you see yourself in five years?" I guess Holland takes care of answering that question for everyone on the team.

#2683169 Glendening signs 4-year, $1.8m AAV extension

Posted by krsmith17 on 14 July 2016 - 12:22 PM

The thing that bothers me the most about this signing is that for whatever reason it needed to be done this offseason... Why the urgency to lock up a 4th line plug to a 4 year contract when he still has a year remaining on his contract? Why not see what happens in another full season and worry about re-signing him next off-season if you really feel the need to? Glendening wasn't going anywhere, so why the rush? Were you really afraid that his value was going to skyrocket above $1.8M? Not likely...


I like Glendening, he works his a** off every shift of every game, and I don't doubt he's a great guy to have in the locker room, especially to help the kids get in shape. But none of that makes up for the on ice product, and the on-ice product is bad... He's good at face-offs? Great, but what good is gaining possession if you're just going to lose it right away? He's good at blocking shots? He damn well better be, because he never has the puck...

#2682362 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by VM1138 on 06 July 2016 - 06:59 AM

These charts aren't ridiculous. Of course they aren't the be-all, end-all, and shouldn't be the only thing used to evaluate players, but they are a very important tool. Just like you shouldn't just use point totals as an indicator of a players worth, or the eye-test, you shouldn't just use these HERO charts or any other single variation of data.

All of these advanced analytics are very new to a lot of people, and if you don't understand them, they can be pretty intimidating at first. I don't think it's a big deal if you don't understand them, but it is a problem if you flat out refuse to understand them. And I know for a fact there are some on here that will do whatever they can to avoid this "nonsense". Unfortunately for them, this nonsense is growing more and more, and soon enough you'll have to adapt with it. To me, it's really no different than when shots on goal started being tracked, or hits, or blocked shots. It's just a new way of tracking stats...

By the way, this isn't meant directly against you, nyquististhefuture, just at anyone that may not like these charts and advanced stats...

It's not that we don't understand them or are intimidated by them. It's that the numbers don't hold up unless they are properly contextualized. Any statistician would tell you the same thing but these analytic fans don't realize that. Plus they love to talk down to the rest of us, which added together makes us long time hockey fans disregard most things stats fans say.

I think we have to have a combination. If the stats seem way off the mark (like Smith being better than Lidstrom) we can't just blindly accept them. There's room for intuition, observation and stats, taken altogether.

#2682040 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by Internet.Unknown on 03 July 2016 - 09:03 AM

So is Frk.

Dude is so out of options, he can't even buy a vowel.

#2680724 Official 2016 Detroit Red Wings Offseason Thread

Posted by DickieDunn on 30 June 2016 - 07:17 PM

Ask your this, Nielsen 5 @ 5.5 or Helm 5 @ 4.5?

I'm signing Nielsen all day. I'd still love to have all 3 isles. Then if we can trade for a D. I'd be excited moving forward.

Dog turd sandwich or cat poop panini

#2676464 WCF: St. Louis Blues vs. San Jose Sharks

Posted by NerveDamage on 24 May 2016 - 12:18 PM


#2674938 Calder finalists

Posted by amato on 03 May 2016 - 04:38 AM

It's gunna be McDavid. The NHL would LOVE that storyline.

If Panarin wins, does Kane accept it on his behalf? :P

#2674342 Official - Little Caesars Arena

Posted by frankgrimes on 28 April 2016 - 08:02 PM

Welcome to the 21St century, everyone. Advertising is the way of life. The building will be amazing regardless of what it's called.

Well there a lot of things wrong in the 21 century, which were much better in the old days ... advertisement is for sure on that list.

A building without a soul is not amazing no matter how luxurious it may be. Best example is the Pens arena modern and comfortable beyond believe but Pens fans are missing the atmosphere of the igloo.

Why does every team need a new arena ? Why not improve the old one? I'm sure the Joe would have looked absolutely gorgeous with a huge renovation but no no, a bankrupt city decides to throw 200 down the toilete.

And the next plastic dome is already in the works...The new oilers arena good times

#2672914 ECQF Game 5 Post-GDT: at Tampa Bay 1, Red Wings 0 (TB Wins, 4-1)

Posted by Yzerman19 on 22 April 2016 - 08:01 AM

Well the Wings really deserved it!!! To be fait you can't at this level fail on 3 breakaways and not getting burn somehow.

Adding to that an anemic powerplay, especially 5-3 none is actualy moving making it too easy for the Tampa bay's defense...


What i sincerely hope this off season is... Firing the PP coach... Firing the Defense coach....


To me blashill is still a big question mark.... i haven't seen a lot of stunning coaching decisions from him.... He should be at some point by his action able to turn a game around.


Anyway have a nice summer guys :D

#2668035 2016 Round 1 Photoshop War: Tampa Bay Lightning

Posted by GoalieManPat on 13 April 2016 - 08:01 PM


#2668411 ECQF Game 1 Post-GDT: at Tampa Bay 3, Red Wings 2

Posted by plopster on 13 April 2016 - 10:47 PM

Was at the game. First off, the ice was pretty crappy. Guys losing their edge all over the place. Second, if stamkos were in there, this would have been bad. The puck handling was really poor and the passes were not crisp exiting the zone (Rafalski anyone?). Third, the first goal was def on howie, second was on helm facing away from the puck handler, third was just all skill, credit where it's due. The non goal was a combo of poor D and poor goaltending. Jimmy can't stop those kind of shots on net. He's just guessing most of the time. Fourth, Z and pavel are just way slow. There's no getting past that. Can't tell you how many times it hurt watching Pav just lose the puck trying to make something happen. I was sitting on the end where the wings played offense twice facing the benches. Fifth, the wings had some really high quality chances, the puck just bounced out of reach or couldn't get a decent second chance on juicy rebounds. Sixth, Kyle Quincey impressed me jumping through the zone with the puck. I think some times the better play is just skate with the puck when the defense is giving you room. Tampa did that plenty at the blue line. The dmen could have just kept carrying it on their stick when they expect you to pass. Kyle caught them by surprise a few times. Seventh, the power play didn't score, but they came really close. Eighth, I swear on everything that's holy giving Ericsson that contract was way worse than keeping franzen over Hossa. That guy is like a non hitting non fighting non puck handling smaller Darren hatcher. He's just a big slow body. I would rather have Oulett or Sproul in there. Ninth, was glad to see the guys stick up for Larkin when Coburn tried to rough him up. I wanted Justin to break his face for that chicken s***. Tenth, if they watch the tape and shake up the lines and figure out how to deal with that s*** ice, there's no reason they can't go back to the Joe tied. So tired of watching them lose in Tampa, 4 straight in the regular season, yet they dominate them in the D. I even changed jerseys tonight. Ugh!!!!!!!

#2668357 ECQF Game 1 Post-GDT: at Tampa Bay 3, Red Wings 2

Posted by barabbas16 on 13 April 2016 - 09:13 PM

Just finished - had to watch on DVR.  The good news is that, if game 2 is just like game 1, Detroit can win if they can just learn one lesson from game 1.


The bad news is that lesson is "don't be complete morons and blow your assignments in the defensive zone."  Which begs the obvious question of... why said lesson wasn't learned long ago by all involved.