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Member Since 11 Feb 2004
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#2547968 GDT 11/5/14--Wings @ Rangers

Posted by Echolalia on 07 November 2014 - 09:18 PM

I think many advanced stats can be extremely misleading as well.  They have to be looked at together and with the eyeball test. 
Plus-minus I think is really only useful then you're comparing players on one team.  If one has an extremely high or extremely low +/-, there's something going on there.  But it still doesn't say much beyond that.

It's also important to keep track of how the players are being used. When the coach is only putting you on the ice for offensive zone faceoffs, your +/- may be skewed in your favor. Meanwhile, the guys who are getting all the defensive zone faceoffs have many more opportunities to develop a lower +/-. Likewise, as a 4th liner, your goal isn't necessarily to score goals, so they play more defensive minded. More or less if you can get it to center ice and dump it in, it's a successful shift, so I would expect to see +/- closer to 0 for grinders than for top liners, whom are expected to take more chances and score (also more vulnerable to goals against in many cases). These guys I would expect to see more of a variation.
So I don't know if it's fair to use +/- as a main argument to compare players who are used for different roles.

#2547940 11/7 GDT : Devils 2 at Red Wings 4

Posted by T.Low on 07 November 2014 - 08:59 PM

Kyle Quincey is really missing out here. Kindl, Smith, Cleary and Franzen have goals in the past two games. Revenge of the LGW whipping crew.

Black Sheep Squadron.

#2547905 11/7 GDT : Devils 2 at Red Wings 4

Posted by TheXym on 07 November 2014 - 08:24 PM

The restaurant just started playing Don't Stop Believing after I told my wife the Wings took the lead. Hopefully that's a good omen.

Kindl and Smith?  Holy crap.  
Ok, who else do we want to get going? 
Man that Franzen sucks.  He's lazy.  Turns the puck over constantly.  Can't wait to get off the ice. They should trade him for a bag of pucks.  

Nice. Maybe a kick in the yambag would do it.

#2547595 GDT 11/5/14--Wings @ Rangers

Posted by derblaueClaus on 06 November 2014 - 11:18 AM


I agree.  He's a better player.  But since he's been gone Lashoff has done absolutely nothing to cost us points.  True, he's done absolutely nothing to contribute either.  But that's not really expected out of your 7th defenseman. 


I'm just sick of everybody scapegoating bottom pair defensemen and grinders when things aren't their fault.  By all mean, crucify them if they're screwing up, but lets be objective about it.  Over the last three games Brendan Smith has been our worst defenseman.  Clearly.  Verifiably.  Demonstrably.  Yet nobody wants to say so because for whatever reason Brendan gets a pass and Kindl (and Lashoff) suck. 


When it's their fault, so say.  When it's somebody else's, we should all have the balls to say that too. 


To be fair Kindl screwed up the change that led to the 2:0 of St.Louis. It's not that he has been good all around while Smith is solely responsible for our GA. The stat you provided are nothing more than the good old +/- which is a very questionable stat imho to measure how good or bad a player did.


That said we had problems making a decent first pass the last few games and I give you that : Smith didn't look good the these games but that can be said about all our D-Man and the team as a whole. You can be Nick Lidstrom, but if your team doesn't skate you'll inevitably produce turnovers (ok, maybe not if your Nick Lidstrom but any other player will) . Smith wasn't notably worse than others especially the sheltered Kindl. I also don't say Kindl sucks, he provides more or less what you'd expect from a 3rd pairing D-Man. The sucking is a team effort so to speak, calling out single players right now is the wrong call in this situation.

#2547319 GDT 11/5/14--Wings @ Rangers

Posted by darkmanx on 05 November 2014 - 10:08 PM


#2547308 GDT 11/5/14--Wings @ Rangers

Posted by jimmyemeryhunter on 05 November 2014 - 10:00 PM

I'm starting to think Kindl and Cleary read this forum.  :lol:

They do.
But only to bash on franzen.

#2546878 Stretcher to the wings locker room

Posted by T.Low on 05 November 2014 - 03:37 AM

How'd they get the stretcher out after he gave it a NMC?

#2546901 GDT:11/4 Detroit Red Wings vs. Ottawa Senators 7:30p.m

Posted by kipwinger on 05 November 2014 - 09:52 AM

Wow people are really freaking out.  We played like absolute s*** the last 2 games and almost beat both teams.  Tatar/Jurco just need to adjust, hell it seems as though you can see those 2 slowly emerging from their slumps. Calm down everyone


First of all, nobody is "freaking out".  While it's probably easier to argue with someone after you've painted them as hysterical, for the sake of reasonable discourse maybe cut down on the hyperbole a little bit.


Secondly, I imagine people would be less freaked out if we were steam rolling teams and then just lost a stinker or two here and there.  But that's not really the case.  Only about half our victories are convincing, and many of our loses are brutal to watch.  Be can barely score goals, and our powerplay is a mess.  Then add on top of that, two loses in two games to two very bad teams and I think it's reasonable for people to be concerned.  Is this the end of the line for our team?  Nope.  But last season is starting to look vaguely familiar.

#2546534 Lines Thread

Posted by kipwinger on 04 November 2014 - 11:48 AM

I didn't see a GDT yet and didn't think it was worth a new one, but here's what's going on at the Wings practice:
Mule on the third line? Are they easing him in coming back from injury?


Those were the same lines that ended the last game.  It just looks like they swapped the second and third lines.  Perhaps because the Nyquist-Sheahan-Tatar line had the better offensive push last game.  The Franzen line was still finding it's feet a little in my opinion. 

#2546476 The lesson here? Cheating pays off once in a while

Posted by Z and D for the C on 03 November 2014 - 07:35 PM

Should have given two penalty shots. Two players are free, two penalty shots.

#2546483 The lesson here? Cheating pays off once in a while

Posted by krsmith17 on 03 November 2014 - 08:39 PM

Should have been a 2 on 0 penalty shot...

#2546422 Nolan suspended 2 games for hit on Helm

Posted by Euro_Twins on 03 November 2014 - 02:27 PM

I think the silver lining is now Doughty and Kronwall are bff's.  :lol:

Hey bro I need a hug

Bring it in man, bring it in.

#2545935 10/31 GDT : Los Angeles Kings (2) at Red Wings (5), 7:30 EST

Posted by vladdy16 on 01 November 2014 - 08:46 AM

#2545577 Wings great Gordie Howe resting after 'serious stroke'

Posted by e_prime on 30 October 2014 - 01:10 PM

Nothing but prayers and thoughts to the Gordie and the entire Howe family.  Whatever the outcome.

#2545559 Weiss sent down to GR- conditioning assignment

Posted by RyanBarnes! on 30 October 2014 - 11:44 AM

Samuelsson got more chances and so should Weiss. But it is not looking too good right now.