haroldsnepsts

Whoa!  The forum is wearing the away jersey!

Not at all.  One player doesn't make a team. If they Wings had Cooke (ewwww) and he continually was doing dirty stuff, the Wings wouldn't be known as goons, just for having a goon.  Mario didn't call out goons, he called out a team playing with the intent to take a pound of flesh from their opponents during that night.

If I had a problem child, there is no reason I shouldn't be able to call out a family of O'Doyles. It's hypocritical, but it doesn't invalidate my argument. Smokers are right when they say smoking is bad, alcoholics are right when they say alcoholism is wrong.


I do agree, though, his comments were melodramtic. But having Cooke isn't the same thing and it isn't hypocritical since Cooke can pot you 40 points a season if he really tried.  he does the same stuff OV does and same stuff Briere does, and hell, even Mike Richards throws those exact same hits.

Mario was right, and Matt Cooke is completely irrelevant.  Cooke has never tried to Bertuzzi anyone and never began to pummel a guy he just blindsided that was clearly hurt.  All of Cooke's cheapshots, you can find identical hits delivered by highly reputable players, but again, he's never suckerpunched or hit a down opponent who was obviously injured.  

Plus, Cooke can continually pot at least 10 goals a season and put up 30 points. Gillies has 9 goals in his entire 12 year career. Matt Martin, thus far in his early early career is a goon. Cooke is a dirty version of Steve Ott basically.

So no, it really doesn't pertain to what Mario was saying.  Matt Cooke walks the line and crosses it sometimes, but what Mario is arguing is that an entire game shouldn't be all about cheap shots. So either you (not specifically you) cannot see that or your (not specifically you) pure unadulterated hate for everything Penguins and Crosby is getting in your way. I hate Crosby and the Penguins as the next person, but at least I can see it from mario's/an owners point of view.

His comments may have been about this specific type of game, but they were also about player safety and the integrity of the game so, yes, employing Cooke is absolutely relevant. And Cooke is much worse than any of those other current players you listed.  He has a career full of incidents where he deliberately tries to injure players.  We're not talking about a Bertuzzi moment, or a questionable hit or two.  He's done it over and over and over.

It's not just that he plays for the Pens (though now more people are probably exposed to what a dirty player he is).  He was a famous knee on knee artist in Vancouver.


And honestly, I don't hate the Pens, or Mario, or even Crosby (shocking on this forum, I know).  But overall Mario comes off like a drama queen for threatening to leave the league.  And when you re-sign Cooke, it's going to taint the message when you're lecturing the league on how they should protect players.

Heaven forbid an owner stands up for his team. It was clear on the intentions of the Islanders, and Mario called them out on it. He'll get fined, but the whole fallacy of "But they have Matt Cooke and Cindy Crysby blah blah blah" doesn't pertain to Mario's argument or comments, so why even bring them up? Just because the Pens have Cooke, that doesn't mean Mario can't complain when a game turns into a goonfest.

I think Mario was overly dramatic with the James Harrision "I'm out" comment, but it was good to see an owner stick up for his team.

It absolutely pertains to Mario's comments.  Mario releases a sanctimonious statement about protecting players and the integrity of the game, then he walks into his office and signs Cooke's paycheck.  The Pens lead the league in major penalties.  They lead the league in PIMs.  

It's not that his comments were wrong, they were just hypocritical and melodramatic ("I'm taking my puck and going home!").

If he wants to improve player safety and the integrity of the game, start by not giving dirty players like Matt Cooke a job.  Use the Pens franchise as an example of how to improve the integrity and safety of the game, rather than sitting from on high and chastising the NHL for it and threatening to quit (again).

i saw kindl win some nice battles that period. hell be okay. he was pretty good when he first got called up. now hes just being dumb. too bad he cant be sent down once wings are healthy to have some more playing time

It is too bad for his development.  Sitting in the press box is not going to help his progress.

Overall I think he's been ok for a rookie.

Well, his numbers have been up.  For example I've seen a significant increase in giveaways in the defensive zone leading directly to a scoring chance or goals.

Datsyuk still checks harder than Ericsson.

Although I did see Big E drop the gloves in defense of his teammates a couple times this season, so he gets points there.

I guess the big thing for me is I want to see less giveaways and better shooting.  He's been doing that today, but I'd like to see it every night.  When you're on defense there's a much lower tolerance for mistakes.

I'd like him to be more physical too, but otherwise I think he's looked great out there, especially considering he's paired mostly with Rafalski, who isn't exactly a stay at home defenseman who will cover any mistakes.

Big E still sucks (despite his good performance today thus far).

What makes you say that?

He's having a good sophomore season.

c'mon Raf.  Could you telegraph that pass any more?

Another great shift by Ericsson.

Yeah i think on the replay I counted 9 shots to Homer's back.  I just figured it wasn't called because it's homer.  Absolutely ridiculous.

The initial knockdown was Holmstrom's fault for skating ass first into him, but yeah, that was a bit much.  Like they said, he didn't have two hands on the stick so technically it's not a crosscheck.

I just wish the Wings would punish guys in the corner and behind the net like that.

By "lazy floating piece of s***" do you mean offensively skilled players who don't show enough of a work ethic and aren't good defensively?

Why bring Hudler into this thread?  

Yup - it's games like this that remind me when we used to have that wonderful combo of skill mixed with toughness...Ah - the memories.

EDIT - if the Red Wings were transformed overnight into a team built along the lines of the Bruins, or Flyers - poor Mickey would have a heart attack from the excitement.



Games of this nature is what got me into hockey many years ago.

Agreed on all counts.  

I understand that people here love the Wings, and the team for the last several years has mostly lacked the fighting element, so they may be inclined to say "who needs it" or "we don't want it."  But if this team was winning and could beat the snot out of people, I doubt many here would be complaining either.  It'd be an awesome thing to watch the Wings win and intimidate teams physically.

Less ideal than having your goalie of the future get injured, and starting a guy with 0 NHL experience because you have no choice?  I think Emery completely out of shape might have been a better option.

And again, NOONE is upset that Nabby didn't make it to the Wings.  It was almost certain that he'd not make it through waivers.  The problem is that a team with 0 playoff hopes picked up a 35 year old who was looking to help someone for the playoffs, and then sits around going "I don't understand why he doesn't want to play here."

You could just as easily ask, why would Nabokov bother to sign a contract when there was little to no chance of him starting for the Wings.   He mentioned helping a team in the playoffs, but then why sign for Detroit?  There was almost zero chance of him clearing all the teams in waivers, then outplaying Howard enough to convince Babcock to start him.

As I've said before though, Nabby's agent said he'd play anywhere.  Which you'd have to believe at the time since he bothered coming back this season and subjecting himself to waivers.  And so what if the Isles have zero playoff hopes?  Snow still needs to ice an NHL team and try to get fans to come to games.  His only option was a kid that they hope will be a good goaltender for the franchise someday.  I understand why they wouldn't want him to be the one suffering as the starting goaltender for the Isles that early in his development.  

Snow has a goaltender under contract in Nabokov, so I also understand him not picking up Emery.

Don't get me wrong, the Isles management has made a lot of unbelievably stupid moves.  This one, I pretty much understand.  And I also don't get why people think Snow somehow looks like an ass in this situation, but so many people are okay with Nabokov no honoring his NHL contract and refusing to report, which is extremely unprofessional.  He may not be helping a team in the playoffs, but when you jump ship to the KHL then bail on that and subject yourself to waivers, you might not have the pick of the litter when it comes to which NHL team you get to start for.  Even without the postseason Nabby could've used this season with Islanders to re-establish himself as a starting NHL goaltender and signed a big contract next year.

So explain to me then why Garth Snow went from being someone who was never mentioned in any respect, as a goaltender or a GM, to being the most hated man on LGW. For what reason was the "Yzerman puts Mike Smith on waivers" thread a Garth Snow bashfest?

And Nabokov wasn't "looking to help someone for the playoffs" he was looking to be an NHL starter again, preferably on a playoff team. There aren't a lot of teams out there where he could have just stepped in and said "hey, I'm your new starting goalie" and the Isles certainly aren't one of them. Don't make Nabokov out to be some innocent victim here. Nabokov signed a cheap contract with Holland knowing he'd have to pass through waivers to play for the Wings. Snow picked him up. Nabokov refused to play for the Isles.

Live with it. Snow being the GM of a franchise doomed to death before he even got there as a player does NOT make him a bad GM.

Exactly.  This bitching is all about Nabokov not making it to the Wings.  Before this deal, most people probably didn't even know who the GM of the s***ty Isles team was.

i do
im glad matt cookes okay
regardless of his past actions you hate to see someone on the ice like that

Normally I'm with you, but if Cooke had gotten a career-ending injury in that fight, it just means a bunch of other players are safer.

I'll take one youtube clip of Cooke getting hurt and ideally not being able to play hockey again, because it means there's gonna be fewer youtube clips of other players getting hurt.

Amazing how they pick up Nabby because they supposedly were so desperate for a goalie. Yet they don't have any interest in Mike Smith or Ray Emery?? Garth Snow is a complete moron.

And on top of that, it's even more ridiculous considering Poulin and DiPietro were both healthy at the time they stole Nabby away from us. Now they're hurting for goalies MUCH more now, yet they put no claim on either Smith or Emery???  

Nabby at that price is a much better move than either Emery or Smith.  He's a proven goaltender at a bargain price. There's a reason Smith went unclaimed, and anyone claiming Emery would have to put him into the lineup immediately, which is less than ideal with a goalie trying to mount a comeback, let alone someone with the history of Emery.

Nabby doesn't want to join them and suddenly all of their goalies are injured?  Nice try Snow, I certainly hope Nabby holds out now.  Just as a big f*** you for claiming him.

esteef

Their goalies were injured beforehand, which is why they claimed Nabokov.  Dipietro was coming back from injury at the time they grabbed Nabby, but everyone knew it was inevitable he'd get hurt again.

I'm surprised how bent out of shape people are over the Nabokov thing.  Snow claimed him for a lot of the same reasons Holland wanted him.  It was a great deal on a very good goaltender, when the Isles had virtually no healthy goalies.

And if the Islanders had passed, I guess you'd all just be mad at the next team who picked him up, because he still had like 25 more teams to clear.  There was little to no chance Nabokov was ever going to be a Red Wing.

That's a pretty knee-jerk reaction, don't you think?  Ericsson's having an excellent sophmore season.  He's been great on the boards and around the net and hasn't been making nearly as many bad pinches (aside from that one last night).  All you can ask is for young players to get better each year and E's definitely having a much better season this year then last.

Exactly.  He's mostly looked poised and made the simple plays out there.  He's getting bolder pinching in, which overall is a good thing, but there's gonna be some bad decisions as he develops.  All in all I've been extremely happy with his play this season, considering after last it looked like he may not be good enough to play in the NHL.

I mainly just wish he'd be more physical out there.  I watch a fair amount of Kings games and I wish we had a bottom pairing guy like Matt Greene.  He punishes guys along the boards constantly, shoving them into it over and over, but rarely takes a penalty. Ericsson definitely has the size to add that his game.  He's gotten better and pins guys, but doesn't crunch them very much.

EDIT:  and Hudler's goal was a result of E jumping into the play and making a nice pass.  The reality is, nobody is gonna measure up to Lidstrom, but Ericsson can hopefully develop into a solid middle pairing guy.