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Member Since 11 Feb 2004
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#2219854 This team screams for a trade

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 29 October 2011 - 06:51 PM

What's interesting, is that at no point in that post, or any post in this thread, did I say that criticism wasn't allowed.

Funny, that.

But please, continue asserting opinions I myself have not asserted.

It tickles me.

I never implied you said "criticism isn't allowed." It's the actions of you and the larger clique that try to shut down criticism by flaming anyone who makes posts that you don't like.

Honestly I don't even think you're one of the big offenders, but you did say the team needs better fans, fans that don't overreact at the drop of af****** hat and told people to calm down, then listed all the things that wouldn't help as if they were fact. Not a huge leap to interpret that as you wishing the suggestions and criticism that's going on lately would stop.

There's getting to be more posts here lecturing people about calming down or how they need to be real fans than there is actual talk about the game lately.

#2219850 This team screams for a trade

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 29 October 2011 - 06:38 PM

You know what this team really needs?

Better fans. You know, fans that won't overreact at the drop of af****** hat. We lost three in a row. That sucks. We should be playing better. Our defense needs to be shored up, our goaltending needs to be tighter. Key players need to start producing.

None of those things will happen with a trade. All of those things will happen when players currently on the roster pull their heads out of their butts. We don't need enforcers, goons, instigators, or fighters......we don't need a new goalie, a new coach, or an entirely new top line. What we need is for people to CALM DOWN and stop acting like because we're under-performing in October, we'll be getting swept out of the playoffs come April, if we're lucky enough to even make them. There is more than enough time for the Red Wings to start playing like they did during the first five games, and less like they have during the last three. I'm confident our ship will right itself.

You know what this site needs? People to stop telling us how to be fans.

Perhaps you and Crymson would like to start a Red Wings pep rally site, where it's all rainbows and puppy dogs and never a discouraging word is uttered about the Red Wings. Here you are not a mod, not that criticizing the Wings is actually against forum rules anyway. Speaking for myself, I'm a die hard Red Wings fan, as in fanatic. I've been a fan since the early 80s, when this team flat out sucked. I'm far from a spoiled Wings fan. I love hockey. I love the Wings. I get ticked when they lose. I'd like to discuss it, even if it's critical of the Wings, without someone telling me I'm not a real fan or to calm down.

That's great that you're confident the ship will right itself, that doesn't mean that any dissenting opinions should be flamed by the clique here that doesn't condone any criticism of the wings.

#2219846 This team screams for a trade

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 29 October 2011 - 06:31 PM

"The Wings win five in a row? Why, we expect that of them. Why appreciate it? Now, the Wings lost three in a row? Unacceptable! Blow up the team!"

Who exactly are you quoting? No one here said that.

You're just baiting people and spamming the thread.

You may be sick of all the negativity here, but the thing is, you're the most negative person here by a country mile. Read through your posts sometime. In most of them you mock, condescend, judge, and try to shut down the ideas of anyone you don't agree with.

#2219817 10/28 GDT: Sharks 4 at Red Wings 2

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 29 October 2011 - 05:28 PM

And therein lies the rub.

The problem that I have is that it isn't hockey talk. Its a ***** fest. I am upset about the Wings not doing well. At the same time though, I point out where they were deficient and how they can improve next game. The "hockey talk" that you mention is not hockey talk. It takes more effort to actually dissect a game and look at the keys in a game. It takes less effort to yell, "Fire Babcock" or "Homer is worthless". Guess which route many of the LGW forum members take? In the end, when they do take that route, it makes those members look like a bunch of whining entitled brats.

Otherwise, I agree with your assessment on the three losses. Its too early to tell. At the same time, the score was not indicative of how the game was played. Wings dominated in faceoffs and time of possession. Shots were about even. The Wings breakout was ok and their passing was average. In essence, they got beat by one goal.

I agree that there's a relatively small percentage of people venting from a loss with things like the "Wings f-ing suck!" But honestly it's much better than it used to be, and there's plenty of hockey talk here that gets bashed and shut down just because it's not popular or it's critical of the Wings.

Even if someone proposes a radical move, like trade Cleary, hell even trade Datsyuk, that's a legitimate hockey opinion and worth discussing, no matter how much the idea of trading those guys may offend Wings fans. Demoting someone, even Zetterberg to the 4th line is hockey talk. They may be outlandish and even foolish ideas, but they're legitimate opinions.

People who are generating topics to discuss are the lifeblood of this site. They're not all going to be brilliant, but I'll take them any day over the members (who are not mods) who've made themselves judges of what is and is not acceptable to say about the Red Wings. The people here who spend most of their time shutting down the ideas of other members and mocking them for their suggestions with posts like "OMG WINGS SUCK TRADE EVERYONE!!!"

If the Wings have only lost three games but someone wants to suggest radical changes, they should be able to do so without being bombarded by all the sarcastic, ******* responses from the Thought Police here.

#2219736 This team screams for a trade

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 29 October 2011 - 12:37 PM

LOL. Typical. We're eight games into the season, and now Cleary sucks? Never mind that he was one of the team's best players last season. Never mind that he's a consistent all-around player. He hasn't been playing well over the last three weeks? HE SUCKS! TRADE HIM!

He never said Cleary sucks. He said Cleary hasn't looked good in a while, but I guess it's easier to mock him when you put words in his mouth.

And all the qualities you listed about Cleary are what would make him valuable trade material. Due to his fearless style of play, he is injury prone and at 32 years old probably doesn't have a lot of years left in him. I wouldn't want to get rid of him, but it's not outrageous to at least discuss trading him.

In the past people would make ridiculous trade suggestions, trying to dump the Wings garbage in return for other team's quality players. Now he gets s*** for suggesting trading someone who might actually have value to another team?

#2219348 Assistant Captain - Tomas Kopecky

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 28 October 2011 - 07:04 PM

38 goals, 68 assists, and 98 points and counting in the NHL.

2 Stanley Cup championships.

What have you done lately?

Hmm, I guess when you put it that way, I don't have anything that can compare to that. So it's probably a good thing I'm not making $3+ million a year in the NHL.

And you left off a couple stats. 98 points in 347 NHL games and a career -22. Plus minus is a somewhat weak stat, but last year on the Hawks he was a -13 with the next closest player being Nick Leddy at -3, the net closest forward was Brower at -2. The top forward being Toews at +28. When your +/- is that far down the s***ter on your team, it probably does indicate something.

For the record I don't hate Kopecky. I'm just baffled by the fortunate opportunities he keeps getting based on his career to date. Maybe he'll live up to that contract. Who knows.

#2219215 Assistant Captain - Tomas Kopecky

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 28 October 2011 - 01:29 PM

I'll never forget his last shift in Detroit. This is what leadership is all about and the reason why he gets the "A" on his jersey.


All you have to do to get an A on your jersey is take a beatdown from Beauchemin? :P

#2219133 Who would you pick to have back on this team?

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 28 October 2011 - 10:27 AM

I'd probably pick the same Stevie season as Eva did, but since that's been mentioned I'll go with Bob Probert of 1987-88 season.

(See his stats below in my sig)

#2218950 This team screams for a trade

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 27 October 2011 - 12:01 PM

Is anyone saying the Wings put a sufficient effort in the Columbus game?

The entire premise of the OP was that drastic steps need to be taken NOW based on the performance of the Red Wings in their last two losses. Nobody is saying Babcock should be okay with the Wings performance. It is his job to worry about the little things and tweak and tweak until he gets things right. Our job is to enjoy the ride and discuss what is going on. Based on what I've seen I don't see why we should be taking drastic steps when we don't have a strong grasp on the current team yet. Why rush and make a move when it could make things worse in the long run?

I don't know where you get that the entire premise of his post was based on the two losses. He clearly refers to the problem going back 2 to 3 years. These two losses just highlighted that problem.

The most radical action he mentions in the post is scratching Bert and Z.

For the record, I agree with you in that I don't think radical action is called for at this point. But how long did it take to actually say that instead of people just saying things about how he's a bad fan or pointing out that we're 5 and 2? People claim he's being reactionary to the losses, but at the same time they're being reactionary to his post (because he committed the sin of criticizing the Wings) without even actually addressing what I think is a legitimate point he raises, even if I don't agree with his proposed solution.

And because the Wings are so successful, I think practically every point made in this forum during the season is with an eye looking to the postseason. Looking to see what has changed or what needs to change that will get them deeper into the playoffs. Of course as fans we're happy that they're not a s*** team. But we want them to beat those flopping fish in San Jose.

We have one of the most capable rosters in the whole league that can deliver in each and every game and all we get is clear lack of effort. I'm getting tired of all these after game quotes "We though we were prepared", "We just got beat, 7-1, so to start like that tonight, to me, is lack of preparation," "It was a disappointing effort. The coaching staff didn't do a good enough job; the players didn't do a good enough job."

We've heard such things so many times during the last two/three years. Where are the consequences? I think the real reason is that everyone on the roster feel too safe. They known that no matter how bad they play they'll never be traded. Starting from 4th line plug Miller to "superstar" Zetterberg. When intensity of the game is rather low we often win on a pure skill, when it gets higher like in the last two games we simply give up. To me this is pure lack of effort. If Bertuzzi or Zetterberg don't like to compete in games like this scratch them and call up Nyquist or Tatar.

PS For those saying that it is only two games (there are always a plenty of such guys) I recommend to watch some other teams. No team in this league gives up games so easily.

#2218812 This team screams for a trade

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 26 October 2011 - 07:33 PM

Nobody is saying "Playing without effort is okay." People are simply saying "Whoa, don't freak out over the roster yet. It's been two games over an 82 game season. Let's see how they do for a bit before hitting the panic button."

It's sad that people can't understand the difference.

At the same time, people seem to think questioning lack of effort means the OP is saying "being 5 and 2 sucks!"

His original post was mostly about lack of effort. Yet most of the responses were essentially "we're 5-2. Shut the F up!" and basically ignoring what I think is a relevant point regardless of their record. Made even more relevant based on Babcock's reaction to last night's game.

It seems like most people reacted to the post title (which was probably poorly chosen) and not the content of his actual post.

#2218806 This team screams for a trade

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 26 October 2011 - 07:11 PM

Lol, -4, am I not kissing the Red Wings ass enough for you guys? I remember when this forum used to be good and someone could have a strong opinion. Now that's living in the past.

Me too. Those were the days before the thought police started patrolling.*

The only players acceptable to rip on are Ericsson and sometimes Hudler. Osgood used to be fair game too but sadly he retired.

I understand that no one wants a forum of mindfly's around here, but there's still constructive talk to be had when the team doesn't play well, even if it's critical. A forum full of "Holland is great! Babcock is great! The Wings are great! I'm sure it'll get better!" doesn't interest me much.

I don't think a trade is necessarily a solution, but Babs was obviously pissed by the players lack of effort last night. We're not imagining it. The first couple seasons Babcock had guys working hard and doing all the little things right. Maybe the novelty of his message is wearing off. I certainly wouldn't want to get rid of a coach as great as Babs and am not suggesting that, but complacency has been a repeating theme with this team the last couple seasons. Franzen just about openly says he gets bored with the regular season.

EDIT: and yes I know the team is 5-2. I'm not saying the Wings are doomed. It's obviously early in the season and on paper they're off to a great start. But doesn't "lack of effort" and phrases like it from the coach and players sound really familiar from last season? More than thinking it's a fatal flaw, it's a worry from me that things haven't changed.

*I'm not referring to the moderators

#2218743 Ian White appreciation thread

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 26 October 2011 - 02:12 PM

What about next year?

Quiet you! Lidstrom will play forever! :ph34r:

#2218692 Ian White appreciation thread

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 26 October 2011 - 11:17 AM

Great signing. When Schneider left, Holland had to scramble and managed to bring in Rafalski, which was a big plus for the team. Now with Raf's surprise retirement, he manages to bring in White.

#2218126 Pronger injured after high-stick

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 25 October 2011 - 08:31 AM

Moore has kept the whole thing going. Several years ago, he was offered a contract and turned it down. He could be playing right now, but he chooses to be a whine ass about the whole thing. He's in it for the money.

False. Burke offered him a minor league contract when he wasn't even medically cleared to play, either just to taunt Moore or for the press and positioning for a lawsuit, so people will only remember "moore turned down a contract." Evidently it worked.

Back on topic regarding Pronger, I hate the guy, but really just when the Wings are playing him. He got absolutely schooled a few nights ago when someone scored and I laughed out loud. He's basically a Chris Chelios. Talented player who has had several instances where he goes way over the line. Or for those who remember, he's like the player Harold Snepsts but with 10 times the talent. But I don't want him to lose an eyeball. The league is better with him in it. It needs villians and Pronger is a good one and a good player.

#2218047 Pronger injured after high-stick

Posted by haroldsnepsts on 24 October 2011 - 09:26 PM

So stepping on someone with your skate isn't an attempt to seriously injure someone?

Has he ended anyone's career? no.

Has Bertuzzi? yes.

I think I've said several times Pronger plays dirty. As for the skate stomp, honestly I think Bobby Ryan's was worse than Pronger's. Ryan clearly stomps down with the blade and Pronger mostly grinds his boot. I think it was dirty and suspendable, but in that moment I don't think he was attempting to seriously injure someone, no. I think he lost his cool. the Homer elbow was much more calculated than the stomp.

Either way that still doesn't mean I enjoy him losing an eye.

I never saw a stick hit him in the eye. The video does not support that that I can tell. His left hand grabs the right side of his head. There is NOTHING thus far to indicate a serious injury and the need to start a prayer vigil. I have also stated I would retract my former comment if the need arose. Please get off my back or I'll cancel your membership to my website! :P

In my earlier post I cited McKenzie's twitter which says he's seeing an eye specialist but there's so much swelling they can't evaluate it. So it's likely either an eye injury or a very close call.

Like I said, I guess I just gave Wings fans more credit than they deserve. Seeing a player take a stick to the face, knowing there's a potential eye injury goes beyond how I feel about that player and his rep.