I guess that's a good point too, I suppose it would really depend on what we ship out... I don't know enough about kesler to say anything about his character but I seen some comments on his divaness, we certainly don't need any cancer in the locker room
No offense to you, but I grow really weary of the questions about [insert player who isn't a Red Wing]'s character. Some people here were s***ting all over Tatar when he kinda sorta maybe threatened to bolt to the KHL because Cleary took his spot at the last minute. Now he's Untouchable, a Phenomenal Team Guy, etc. Fedorov wasn't exactly the greatest Team Guy in history, and was most definitely a Diva. Kronwall's widely regarded as one of the dirtiest, most gutless players in the league. (Actually, there's some history between Kronwall and Kesler.) Bertuzzi almost murdered a guy in cold blood.
We could use a really good center. Kesler is a really good center who we might have a shot at getting. He might be the difference between the playoffs and early tee times. I don't really care if he's a prick. Maybe he becomes a better Team Guy as a Red Wing. (Wouldn't be the first time that's happened with a player.)
Well you basically make my point the odds of us winning in the playoffs with Hank coming off back surgery and dats knee, who knows what'll be of it, hopefully it can heal with rest. Are slim... I don't think and not saying we should throw the season, I'm saying trading away some our prospects for a 2nd line center/wing (i.e kesler) would be a waste for the future, they wouldnt be able to carry our team to the playoffs with all the lack of chemistry and so little time (I think like 20 games)
I don't see what ya see in kesler
I'm not big on Kesler. But we're talking about maybe a first-round pick, a prospect, and a 3C for a very good 2C who could hold his own as a 1C or be one of our better RWers. Given our situation, I think that makes a lot of sense. The argument could be made that even with a fully healthy lineup we should be thinking about adding a top-six centerman sometime soon. Datsyuk and Zetterberg are getting old and breaking down. It's sad but it's true. Weiss is a huge question mark, short-term and long-term. Helm, Sheahan, Andersson, Glendening are bottom-sixers. Franzen doesn't like playing center. Jarnkrok is the only Griffin who projects as a top-six center in the NHL, and he's still got a long way to go.
Tonight we're gonna be without Datsyuk, Zetterberg, and Weiss. Against a team that's hot on our heels. At some point, this all-our-key-forwards-are-injured s*** is going to cost us a postseason berth, if it hasn't already. If we can move Helm, Sproul/Ouellet, and a 1st for Kesler, that's worth serious consideration.
I'm sorry, but the state of our team is ticking me off, as is the notion that if we just keep waiting for the absolute perfect trade to come along - say, Cleary for Chara - we'll be doing the best we can do. Or if we just keep waiting for the perfect UFA - say, Vanek at $5M over three years. Because it goes without saying that we'd be the only ones in on that, right? Welcome to Motown, Thomas!
We need to add a high-end piece! If it can be done without losing one of our untouchables, it should be done! And even some of our untouchables shouldn't be wholly untouchable.
Ehrhoff, Kesler, Byfuglien, someone good. Do it. Just do it.
(I kinda feel like Dunbar in Catch-22 when he finally snaps. THERE'S NO ONE IN THERE!)
I've said it before and I'll say it again: we should be in on Byfuglien. We need more right-handed players - he's right-handed. We need a top-four offensive defenseman who can be lethal on the PP - that's him. We need a top-six power forward who can park his ass in front of the net - also him. We need to get bigger, tougher, more physical - him. We need a guy who isn't a rental - him again. We need at least one of the Jets' 9,000 players who could potentially do wonders for us - him.
There are some concerns about him, but that's the whole reason why he'd be traded - and possibly for a reasonable price - in the first place. We're not getting Duncan Keith or Alex Ovechkin. And, again, standing pat is not a recipe for significant improvement and winning one more Cup with Datsyuk and Zetterberg. It's praying that some rookies can be the difference between a second-round exit and the Stanley Cup, all while our core gets older every day.
Kesler's price is about what I'd expected. That's Helm/Sheahan, Sproul/Ouellet, and a 1st. If any one of Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Weiss were healthy, I'd say it's absolutely, positively not happening. But, fact is, we could really use a top-six center. (And if we get healthy down the middle, Kesler's able and willing to play RW.)
Actually, I think Lidstrom will be making his comeback. The jersey retirement week hoopla is secretly a buildup to it. He'll explain how he faked his death and spent the past two years dismantling Moriarty's network, and it'll be like he never left.
I'd like to add: our first-round pick should be in play. Or, if not in play, then at least "possibly available." If what I'm hearing is true and Kenny's categorically refusing to even consider moving our 1st...that's immensely stupid.
We're not the Sabres. We're not rebuilding. We're retooling (there's a difference), and we're doing so with a relatively deep prospect pool which has already given us Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, and Jurco. And DeKeyser would've gone in the first round had he been drafted, so he's basically a free first-round pick.
There will always be players of their caliber available at the trade deadline, and I wouldn't be opposed to trading prospects to get them if I thought it would make us legitimate contenders for the cup, but this year I don't think there is any moves available that put us in that category given our injury situation
No offense, Flashy, because you're a good dude who makes kickass GDTs - but I'm an immature, impatient, impetuous Wings fan and I grow weary of "Let's wait until next season, because..." There will always be high-quality players available at the deadline, true - but there will also always be reasons, excuses, rationalizations as to why we shouldn't do anything.
We have to improve significantly if we want to win one more Cup with Datsyuk and Zetterberg. I'm high on our young guns and Griffins, but Ouellet, Sproul, Pulkkinen, Jarnkrok - they're all at least one more season away. And even then, they'll only be rookies. (Brendan Smith is a reminder that being a very good defenseman in the NHL is very, very, very hard.) Meanwhile, our core will be that much older and probably less effective.
Free agency sucks. We know the script: most of the top guys will re-sign, and the ones who don't will be looking to Get Paid and therefore won't be coming to Motown, because we're generally averse to bidding wars these days. We can't realistically expect a Daniel Alfredsson to fall into our collective lap every summer. (Collective Lap. Add that to the band name list.) Even Weiss was sort of a stroke of luck, as he was very keen on becoming a Wing. And, given Weiss's monumental struggles, I fear Kenny's never going to take a chance on a high-end free agent again.
The only other option? Trade.
I feel like maybe the stars are aligning for us here on the trade front. The cap room we'd need? Suddenly we have it. The attractive young roster players we'd need? Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan, Jurco. Potentially high (and therefore quite valuable) first-round pick? Yep. And, of course, a wealth of promising prospects. (In Mantha - who may be having his first and last this-kid-is-just-plain-better-than-everyone-else season - we have, for the first time in a long time, a prospect that any and every GM in the league would probably love to have.)
I'm not saying we should sell the farm, our future.
I'm not saying we should be in on high-priced rentals like Vanek.
I'm not saying we're a contender who just needs one big trade to put us over the top.
I'm not saying we absolutely must make a big trade.
I'm saying...Why not now? Why not do something this season?
I feel we're in a position to make a significant move. I don't know that such a move is there to be made, but I've always believed that the possibilities are never limited to the rumors. Nearly any player can be had for the right price; a smart, creative, wily GM might make things happen. Easy for me to say, of course. But it's also easy to do nothing.
This team is in bad need of finishers, the defense while not spectacular hasn't been as bad as many people think it is.
We have a solid top six and an electric third line, even with some key forwards injured. We don't have a legitimate top four, even with a fully healthy D corps. Given that defense wins championships (see: Team Canada), we should be looking to bolster our blue line. Take care of the defense and the offense should take care of itself. (Indeed, the main reason why our offense has been sagging is that our blue line isn't driving and directing the attack like it used to, when we had an actual top four with not one but three all-star offensive defensemen playing monster minutes.)
My concern is who we'd be we giving up . Not a fan of Kesler
I have to think Edler-Kesler (Edsler?) would cost a king's ransom. The Canucks are one point out of the playoffs (last I checked), and Gillis has to be thinking about his legacy...and the possibility of redemption.
That's largely why I'd prefer Ehrhoff-Stewart (Ehrwart? Stewhoff?) - they'd almost certainly come cheaper, even though it'd be intradivision. Maybe a 1st, two prospects, and a top-six forward?
So. We're rumored to be interested in Edler and Kesler, possibly as a package deal. As far as I know, we haven't been linked to Ehrhoff or Stewart - but, as I've blabbered on about in the deadline thread, I think there may be the potential for a package deal, as Ehrhoff's estimated trade value appears to be a 1st, a prospect, and a young roster defenseman with upside, or any two of those.
My question is, Which would you prefer - the two Canucks or the two Sabres? I guess for the sake of discussion we should factor in actual real-world considerations, e.g. cost.