Regarding the inevitable fighting discussion, I think there's a distinction to be made between preventing all out cheapshots a la Matt Cooke, and being a deterrent to guys running around and agitating all game without having to answer for it. One example that comes to mind is when Bertuzzi fought Shane O'Brien twice in the same game against the Predators a couple seasons ago.
They were running the Wings all game. After that, not so much. Having a guy that plays 6 minutes a night to fight isn't as much of a deterrent anymore, but if you have someone playing fairly regularly who's also willing to drop the gloves, I think that absolutely can be a deterrent. Many times I've seen an agitator throttle back a little bit after the prospect of getting punched in the face becomes a real threat. It shows you won't be pushed around, and no one likes getting punched in the face.
Some thoughts from Wings players and coach after that Predators game, which I think explains the concept well.
I think staged fights are mostly garbage. A side spectacle by enforcers who usually don't have much else to offer. But players sticking up for themselves and keeping from getting run, or the "keeping the flies off" as Babcock puts it, yes please.
That being said, I don't think Tootoo provides a ton of deterrent. He plays such a limited role on the team, I'm guessing because when he's most effective hitting and agitating is also when he's least effective defensively. And while he's a good fighter given his size, I don't think he puts the fear into many people, other than being afraid he'll suckerpunch you.
Your feelings towards tootoo have not changed since he was on nashville example what was bolded. Did he sucker anyone while playing with the wings so far? so you saying tootoo is pretty much worthless I feel you are not giving him a fair shake and really seeing what he brings and how he could help in games like the chicago series where the wings started to get bullied around because no one wanted to stand up. Tootoo played with a ton of heart every shift out there and if you and others didn't see that I'm not sure what else to say. He went non stop every shift hitting everything trying to score..trying to make plays. I compare him to Helm with his heart of the game. Like a lion. Of course he doesn't have helms skill really but I would take 100 players like that over players like miller,eaves or emmerton. There were a ton of times I didn't even know Miller or Emmerton was even on the ice. When Tootoo is out there everyone on the ice and in the stands knows he is there.
Jordin Tootoo playing would have made absolutely no bearing on the Red Wings finishing out the Blackhawks. Physicality was not a factor whatsoever. Chicago had superior skill and depth. This is the same Blackhawks team that finished last in the NHL in hits and somehow found a way to beat the much bigger and more physical Bruins.
I'm all for keeping Tootoo around during the regular season, but let's not pretend he's some game-changing playoff performer that would have gotten the Red Wings past the Blackhawks.
And you would know this how? How can you say he would not have any bearing on the outcome....why change something that worked so well right. Yeah I said he was some superman playoff game changer. Lets not pretend that it wouldn't of had any effect either how about that. Some of you must have forgotten how Shaw and Bickell were left untouched when they were skating around having their way with the wings. I'm sorry to burst your bubble cause you sound pretty sure of yourself but physicality with no answer back from the wings had a lot to do with it...not all of it but had a lot. When the hawks turned it on physically and they saw that they could get away with it thats when the tide turned.
nah we will drop tootoo and then once the season starts we will see 100 threads talking about how weak we are and why didn't holland get a tough guy...its all buttmans fault blah blah blah. Not saying Tootoo is the toughest,best fighter in the league but he's better than anything we have and he plays his role perfect. I understand we have to get under the cap and all that and we pretty much have no other option because of sammy. Yeah Tootoo wasn't played in the playoffs which was a mistake against the blackhawks since they were beating us down and having their way physically but hey..losing 3 in a row without changing anything is ok for some I guess.
Yep, it does. And the NHL has definitely not suspended any star players recently. Except Kris Letang, Alex Ovechkin, Mike Green, Shane Doan, Jeff Skinner, Duncan Keith (twice), James Neal, Nicklas Backstrom, Claude Girouix, Dustin Brown, Alex Edler, Taylor Hall, Joffrey Lupul, and Corey Perry.
All of these guys were suspended in the last two seasons. It is an absolute joke to think that the NHL won't suspend stars, or that they're otherwise immune from punishment. If you do the crime, you do the time more often then not. Do they miss one occasionally? Sure. But there is no "star bias".
But but but....In the illustrious words of Mermaid Man "Buttman is eviiiiiilllllllllll."
I know. People really underestimate Quincey. Theres a reason hes our 2nd highest paid dman.
So hold on here.....Quincey with all of his screw ups in the season. Reading through countless posts of people talking about how he was god awful in the game GDT's more so than anyone else is getting paid just right and you are fine with that but think that tootoo with what he brings is getting too much and needs to be traded? The way I seen Q play there is no way he played to a $3+mil contract. We are talking about the 1 goal and 2 assists 3 pts Quincey right?
It's also not his agent's fault for trying to get his client the best contract. It's Holland's for overpaying for a 4th liner.
Tootoo's TOI may have changed, but his skillset didn't.
So you would stick Tootoo on the 4th line and only pay him 900k. Where would you put Miller,Emmerton and Eaves and how much would you pay each. Because in my eyes and I'm sure many more see Tootoo as bringing really more than any of these players and is getting paid accordingly.
I think it is. Especially for 3 years, his price should've been lower.
He's a hard hitter but often takes himself way out of the play to make those hits. And it's nice to have someone who fights, though it seemed like most of his were meaningless staged scraps that weren't even for retribution.
I'm not a fan of Carcillo either but he just signed a 1 year deal for $825,000 and the most he's ever been paid is $1.08 mill. He's just the first reference point that came to mind, but what does Tootoo bring that warrants a million dollars more?
tootoo has one heck of a wrist shot and he is one of if not the hardest worker on the ice when he is on the ice. He also has the heart of a lion. i would much rather give tootoo that then someone like eaves who is a dime a dozen.