I think Bogo could be better in a different system and a different team, but I think the price to take a chance on that guy is going to be too high.
Same thing for Meyers. I'm sure that Buffalo has realized that they're never going to get Mantha + Nyquist for Meyers, but it doesn't mean that they're not still asking that type of price.
Mike Green, who started off the year as a big question mark, has stayed healthy and kept himself relevant on a team that "upgraded" their defense with the Orpik and Niskanen signings. He's not going to come cheap, won't get traded until the deadline and only if Washington is on the outside looking in or needing an offensive piece to help them.
If you're looking to dump someone off for some draft picks, 4th line role players, or middling prospects -- you're all good, but...
Hockey trades for legit players or those that are poised to break-out or have the potential to do so are hard to make.
Let's not kid ourselves.
Yandle... *droool* If I were that guy I'd be clamoring to get out. Maybe not out of ARI where it's beautiful and sunny all of the time, but as a hockey player, I'd welcome a trade out of the desert. No offense to that team, their awesome coach, etc. but they're going nowhere near the playoffs this year.
Also, Wiz ain't coming to Detroit. Ever. Well... at least, not while Ken Holland is GM. (Maybe when he's 37 and can play defense. )
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So maybe even holland valued him and Ferraro less by waiving them before nestrasil?
He went unclaimed at the beginning of the season when rosters were being trimmed, teams were figuring out what they had, etc. Now other teams know what they have, what they need and that Mitch Callahan is a realgud player -- with 7 goals 8 assists at the AHL level for a guy that's slated to have limited offensive upside at the pro-level, but is already a good grinder/agitator.
Do wish Nestrasil had maybe cleared, of course. ...but the guy has 1 goal and 1 assist in 5GP with Carolina, averaging aprox. 3-4 minutes more ice time per game than he did here in DET, where he had an assist and no goals over 13GP. Not to knock his talent level, but even a blind dog finds a bone occasionally.
...but I really don't want to delve into what Holland thinks or how he values players, but in my estimation he's obviously doing something right.
You obviously don't follow the wings, day to day in Detroit means 2 months
Yes, I do follow the Wings. I follow almost every Twitter account I can that has anything to do on the Wings. I'm just going on what is reported. Ken Holland confirmed he is day to day so other than that it's just speculation.
You definitely don't follow the wings.
If you do, what kind of binoculars do you use?
oh sarcasm, you silly fool... how you evade us so... i can't even spy you with my binoculars.
I think that once a player clears he can be recalled and sent down without having to clear again if he is up for less than 10 games or 30 days.
So that'd be great for recalling XO, but if you want to bring up Callahan... it's a different story.
It's that initial offering that I think we'd lose him.
Unless of course we're all overvaluing our prospects as any fanboy/grrl tends to do.
...but of course most of us undervalued Nestrasil and he got claimed. So, there's that to chew on.
Andersson is utterly useless. Get rid of him. Trade or waive him, I really don't care, just get him off the roster. Like I mentioned a couple weeks ago and was also being discussed in another thread by Jesusberg and number9, Andersson is our Emmerton of a couple years ago. Useless, but just filling a roster spot. Andersson will either be on a bottom feeder team or back in Sweden in a year or two, he has no place in this lineup...
I agree to an extent, he's solid on the pk, and not a bad fourth liner, so not useless.
But I would be fine if we waived him.
Cally is exactly the type of 4th liner that we need. Can score. Can grind. Tenacious. Hard-working.
Andersson can't score and it'd be nice to see more scoring from our 4th line.
Jurco's been better on the 4th than Andersson.
He shouldn't have to play there, but still made better use of that time than Andersson has.
Every time I say something isn't working on this team, they turn around and make it work. Inconsistency? They win four in a row. Too many centers on the team? Offense starts scoring like gangbusters. Powerplay's a mess? Top ten in the league.
So I guess what I'm saying is...they will absolutely, positively, not win the Stanley Cup in decisive fashion in front of a home crowd while Kid Rock and I are in the front row (surrounded by strippers) getting hammered drunk. Nope, not at all.
Am I invited to this party? You can remind Bobby that he and I went to the same high school and church. (ok, so he was a senior when I was a freshman -- but his sister and I graduated the same year... also, I never really saw him at church, but I know his family went to the same Catholic church as my family did... it counts, no?)
Said it before, saying it again... we still need to make a move so that we can consistently rotate in a prospect on D. XO having to go back down because Smith is back and healthy, and there's no room on the roster, is an issue.
Lash, Kindl, or KFQ need to get moved for this reason alone.
Preferably Kindl. Then, KFQ.
Especially if we make a trade and upgrade a D-man, preferably RH, I'm fine with that too.
That's why Ryan O'Reilly's #1 on my wish list. He'd give us our elite two-way 1C of the future, and in the meantime you could use him as a top-line winger. I'd be willing to pay quite a bit for this guy.
How much are you willing to pay? Lets hear your trade offer?
Last year everybody was ready to trade Tatar "because we have Nyquist so he's redundant" and this year many are ready to trade Jurco "because we've got Mantha". About the time we draft and develop top six wingers folks are ready to trade them. Insane.
To me, Nyquist, Tatar, Jurco, Larkin, Mantha, Quellet, Sproul, and Marchenko are untouchable. Which still gives us Jensen, Backman, Pulkkinen, and one of Nosek or Athanasiou as high end prospects for trade.
Think about it. In five years the wingers on your top two lines can be some combination of Tatar, Nyquist, Mantha, and Jurco and your top four defensemen could be Sproul-Dekeyser, Ouellet-Marchenko (Lefty-Righty, offensive-defensive in each case).
I agree that people are oftentimes too quick to want to trade away these young guys, and I will admit that I was one of the one's that wanted to trade Tatar, but not because he's too much like Nyquist. I wanted to trade him because he would have garnered the highest return out of our assets at the time. I admit that it probably would have been a bad trade in hindsight. However, I'm still not completely against trading Tatar if the return is big enough. I love Tatar and I never wanted to give him away, but the more he plays the more I'm loving the way he plays.
Jurco is definitely an untouchable in my books and it drives me insance hearing all the people saying we should trade him. I agree with your untouchable list for the most part, but I would probably replace Marchenko with Jensen on my list. I have not been impressed much with Marchenko so far this season, and Jenson impressed a lot in preseason and is doing much of the same down in Grand Rapids. He is a great puck mover with a high hockey IQ, loves to use his body and also has a pretty underrated shot from the blueline. I would also add Athanasiou to my untouchable list. I think he's going to be a beast in the NHL one day...
The reasons I picked Marchenko over Jensen or Backman are these: His size, right shot, great passer, defensive d-man. I wanted another defensive d-man to go alongside Dekeyser. I see Jensen and Backman competing more with Sproul, Ouellet, and Smith and despite being really good, I think they lose out. Also, I think you need to give Marchenko another look. He's a lot like Brad Stuart. You don't always notice how good he's playing because he's not flashy. But you'd sure miss him if he was gone. I definitely see him anchoring an offensive d-man the way Stewie did for Kronwall early on.
As for Athanasiou, I agree he's going to be a beast. I only left him off the list because I think you've got to give to get and because we've got Nosek and Larkin. But really, if we can keep two of the three, I don't care which ones. Ideally we'd keep Larkin and Athanasiou and trade Nosek, but he's an unknown quantity and I doubt (right now) he'd get much interest.
I see where you're coming from with Marchenko, but to be fair, there isn't a huge size difference between the two, they both like to hit when they can, their both righties, I think Jensen is the better passer, while Marchenko is slightly better defensively. I think DeKeyser and Jensen would complement each other quite well as well. I agree completely on the center situation.
2 inches and 15 lbs is a pretty big difference in size. However, I do agree that Jensen would slot well with Dekeyser, but that would leave Sproul with Ouellet and I don't like that because I think Sproul will need someone who lays back and plays defense so that he can make plays offensively...which, by the way, is the reason why I think he (and Backman) aren't playing well this season. I HATE that pairing.
I guess it depends on which site you get your bio from, and I'm assuming you're using the Griffins website which may be the most accurate, but several others list them as 6'1" and 6'2". Either way, I don't see that as a huge difference in deciding who is the better option. They both play big and that's what matters. Sproul definitely needs someone defensively responsible to play with, I agree with that, but Ouellet isn't a terrible option there in my opinion. He is a good offensive defenseman but is also very defensively aware as well. I hope Sproul can clean up on the defensive end of the puck as well or he will get eaten alive in the NHL, especially if Babcock is still the coach by then...
I'm not 100% sure but I don't think Backman and Sproul have seen significant time together this year. I've watched the majority of the Griffins games so far this season and from what I could tell the pairings have been Ouellet - Marchenko, Paetsch - Sproul, and Backman - Jensen...
Every time I watch they've been together, and they were a pair during the prospects tourney as well. Though admittedly, I probably haven't seen as many games as you. I watch when I've got a stream and the Wings aren't playing at the same time.
I agree with most of your thoughts above, except that I'll say I'm not overly concerned with Sproul being less than stellar in his own zone, given his offensive upside. None of Doughty, Subban, or Cam Fowler were great in their zone for a few years. Still, their offensive skill set made it worth while to keep them on the big club. They just needed their minutes sheltered a bit until them matured. I know it won't happen because this is Detroit, but I'd have that kid focusing almost entirely on honing his offensive skills and being adequate defensively. I'm not convinced its always best to have guys that do a little of everything pretty well. Sometimes it helps to have a few guys who do one thing extremely well. With his skill set Ryan Sproul should regularly put up 50+ points in the NHL. But probably not if the organization requires him to do it the way Lidstrom did.
I couldn't agree more on Sproul. I would love for him to become a Doughty, Subban, Karlsson lite, but the key part in my above post was "especially if Babcock is still the coach by then"... We know damn well how Babcock treats his offensive minded (gifted) defensemen...
Well every game I've watched those are the pairings I've seen, so who knows... lol
So... you guys are saying we have some options on the back-end?