b.shanafan14

I don't want to see Smith come out of the line-up. He has game breaking ability as shown tonight, calmness under pressure, and can throw down when called upon

This. Don't want to see another game this season without him in the line-up. I think he's been THAT good.

OMG FRANZEN DID STUFF

I KNOW, RIGHT!

Funny... Johan leads this team in goals yet his play has diminished and folks have some high expectations when things don't go his way

Franzen benefits off the backs of harder working players. Without someone else to gift wrap them, he is more or less worthless. Effort is lacking and he is becoming more one-dimensional by the day; a far cry from where he started busting ass on the 3rd/4th lines. He hasn't stepped up at all with players out.

...s***... goal and Z goes down...

Well, their biggest beef with Kronwall is that he doesn't fight after hits.  Any time a player is suspended for a hit, people whine about how they're trying to take big hits out of the game.  But having to drop the gloves after a big hit somehow doesn't discourage hitting to them.

Though there are people there who feel he somehow should've not made the hit knowing he was going to hit Voracek so hard.  

I can understand people wishing Kronwall would fight just once or twice after a big hit, but it's mostly nonsense over there.

I understand why folks call for him to "answer" for his hits, clean or otherwise, but it is complete nonsense. More than anything its butt-hurt.

Lets for the sake of simplicity call it Kesler-Clowe Syndrome (KCS): if a smaller guy, who has never fought before and seems in their mind physically inferior to themselves, all of a sudden puts them on tomorrow's highlight reel by folding them like a lawn chair, despite a few inches of height and pounds of weight, the knee-jerk response is butt-hurt and the KCS desire to redeem one's self.

Kronwall will "troll", shrug it off and get twice his moneys worth with the hit and a penalty for your retaliation, which as a Wings fan is one of the best parts of watching Kronwall do his thing (though sometimes the refs jumping in front of him is a bit...well, you know). Its one thing to want to retaliate in the moment, on the ice, and for some, their pride is worth the two minutes (especially since the Wings PP is so flacid). Its another thing to carry your pout into the post-game interviews and say something as moronic as "you can't lay a hit like that without having to fight afterwards", like there is some unwritten rule that if you're hurt or embarrassed in play you get to even it out on my face.

i mean in general, if you say anything like " i think kronwall is gonna crush someone tonight" they will give you a warning, tsn does the same thing. When we played the canucks i wrote  "I think kronwall will catch booth tonight" and they refused to publish it.

Its funny how moderators can be so ridiculously bias and still be allowed to lord over open forums. Even on HockeyStreams, hearing Wings fan and moderator Steve-O is a bit shameful. Every call against the Wings is unjustified, every hit on a Wing dirty, every opposition goal is either an uncalled penalty or would-be disallowed goal. The fates conspire against the Wings in everything and the opposition always has an unfair advantage.

Me, I'm a "blame the Wings first" kinda guy, just ask Crymson, who is of the "***** about the bitching" persuasion

On a side note, why do interviews with Jagr look like they were filmed in the 90s?

His curly perm do? And its in his contract that he is only filmed on beta format.

Honestly, a day after the hit Voracek and the Flyers have gained a bit of respect from me. The guy takes it on the button, has every right to be a bitter Kesler about it, and yet he says over and over that the fault was his own. Jagr chimes in saying that without those hits "its basketball". This takes more guts than a lot of folks might think and I wish him a swift recovery. Pretty brassy, Jakub!  

TSN interviews: http://watch.tsn.ca/...3645#clip633645

Clean, north-south hit with an unfortunate, yet unavoidable point of contact. Kronwall has actually been impressing me in the last few months by consistently keeping his skates on the ice.

This play is one of a few astounding hits we are seeing these days where the player with the puck seems oblivious to a hit he should expect. Players are getting far to complacent seeming to think 100% of the onus is on the player laying the hit. The play gets worse every time I see it: Kronwall stepped up on those same boards, exact spot TWICE in this same game prior to the hit. Voracek looks up and seems to see Kronwall at the blue line. He then proceeds to handle the puck and skate as leisurely as I've seen any player not named Bertuzzi do in a long time. By the time Kronwall is on him he had taken several strides looking straight down and to the side, clueless to the play he had to just seconds earlier have seen as a possibility. Timed perfectly with the moment Kronwall reached him, Voracek finally turns up ice like a goose in flight, head down, neck out. Perfect stand-up, skates down hit, leveled at Voracek's chest but for his head being so stretched out in front of him. Honestly, if he was on the opposite side of the ice, the way he was skating he had just as much chance of running straight into someone coming off the bench. OBLIVIOUS.

I honestly don't know what Kronwall could have done without neglecting to do his job and take the body. Unfortunately, this type of play with absolute complacency on the part of the player with the puck is starting to contribute more than anything to concussions in the league. Blind-side hits are one thing, but choosing not to acknowledge the threat right in front of you should not make you immune to a good clean north-south hit.

It's not like he is getting paid anywhere near what a 40 goal scorer gets paid.  

Not sure if that was sarcasm or not. Franzen's cap hit might be $3.95m but he is getting paid $5.25m, and given the security he was given with such a long-term contract, its fair to argue that he should be playing like closer to $6.0m. He got on the team by playing tough, physical, and responsible while going to the hard areas. He's been doing less and less of that since signing the contract. The production rates are down, but he has also made himself tremendously one-dimensional.

Third year of an ELEVEN year front-loaded contract and he is already playing down to the cap hit. He better stay pretty damn consistent, otherwise I wonder how he'll be playing by the time he is actually making $3.95m (which will be in 5 years, for those wondering). Like GMRwings said, what happens when he plays uninterested and "bored" during the regular season (when everyone else is required to put in the effort) and he gets to playoffs and either doesn't perform, or like last year, gets injured? What are the Wings paying for then?

- Kronners had an outstanding game, and I was very comfortable watching him log huge minutes tonight... this is huge for us knowing we can rely on him when Nick if Nick is hurt for a game
- Smith continues to amaze me more and more... everything he does tells me he deserves to be on this team over Kindl and Ericsson... continue to the great play
- Franzen is so freakin lazy... I was ticked off then, and still am now, that we let Hossa walk to keep lazyboy Franzen
- I thought Fil and Hank tried tonight, but as the game progressed they seemed to look tired
- Helm, Miller, Abs were fantastic

Lastly, I just want to say kudos to the 2 referees tonight, Dan O Halloran and Don Manhaviston (however you say it) who did a wonderful job officiating this game. They let both teams get away with a lot, and called what needed to be called and, more than anything, were CONSISTENT with their calls. Hope to have more officials like this.

Hopefully Nick is back tuesday, go wings!

Pretty much all of this. Good to see there wasn't a powerplay every 3 minutes. These games lately have had too little 5-on-5 play and its frustrating and boring to watch (especially given the Wings' special teams woes). Also, Hank and Filppula were the only forwards going outside of the third line. I get exhausted for them seeing how they have to drag Hudler and/or Franzen around all the time. And a tremendous game by Smith.

As I said, its a pretty good indicator when you are short-handed on defense and have an emergency goaltender switch and neither of those are the problem against a poor defensive team. Most of the forward unit are dogging and watching the play, save for a few in Zetterberg, Filppula, Helm, Abdelkader, and Miller.

Gems from the Blackhawks' homers:

*Filppula is mugged by Keith and Seabrook* "Slash by Filppula! Team toughness! Keith is not going to take that and they go after Filppula! They'll like that penalty; standing up for one another!"

*Hawks goes to hit Kronwall and gets laid out* "It looks like Kronwall might have gotten his stick up.... No... but he looks to have been on his toes when he hit him... either way, the Hawks player is giving up 25 or 30 lbs" (Either that guy is 165lbs or they think Kronwall is a fairy tale monster after what he did to Havlat)

*Kronwall with a clean hit, Bickel takes a stupid retaliating penalty* "Team toughness! The Hawks will gladly take that penalty! Great to see them standing up for one another! Good penalty to take if you're a Hawk"

And pretty much any time the Hawks jumped someone with 2+ guys, like they did to Holmstrom (shocking, with no call) you hear "team toughness" followed by "those are good penalties" followed by a justification such as "I think Holmstrom broke a stick trying to get the puck off the net which is why the Hawks took exception" which would on the replay be proven false.

And the play-by-play guy wants to badly to be Harry Caray, right down to the half-slurring and the goofy changes in voice inflection like he is reading a Dr. Seuss book to his niece.

Watching Franzen lose physical battles along the boards to guys like Kane and Keith is pretty frustrating.  They're great players, but with his size, he should be tougher to handle.  Just looks like jelly out there.

This. Same goes for Cleary. Both used to be tenacious, now they give it one wack and watch.

The worst part about this game? MacDonald getting thrown in after the Howard injury wasn't an issue. The defense played pretty damn good considering they were down a man or two for 90% of the game. The problem was the forward unit that was the same that lit up Minnesota just two days ago.

Too many passengers.

Watching our powerplay is one of the most frustrating things there is. That, and watching half the team float and cough up pucks. Too much ice time for Bertuzzi, Franzen, Cleary, and god bless him, Holmstrom. Can't help injuries, but you can play smarter and harder, for starters.

Bad play by Stuart and blown opportunities were the difference today. Watching it with the 'Hawks awful homers is the icing on the cake...

haroldsnepsts  

While I am a longtime fan of our beloved team, I know that they are hardly models of wholesome family values. All of these players have chosen career over family...right or wrong. I am in no way judging as my own career is very dear to me.

Lidstrom, as well as any pro in any  sport will play as long as their bodies allow them and they are earning the big bucks. I doubt any capable  pro in any league would ever stop playing and earn a commoner's wage for the sake of "family." Its all about that green. And all of the trophy wives sitting in the stands know that.

Brian Rafalski. $6 Million dollars.

"This was probably the most challenging season of my career, both physically, mentally and spiritually, but it was also the most rewarding and most blessed...The decision was made between myself and my wife approximately two months ago. We went through a long process of weighing different factors in our lives. At the end of the day it came down to priorities, with the top three priorities being serving God, serving my family and serving others."

So we all have our opinions about the "loser point" and what it does for overall parity (closing the gap between the best teams and worst teams) and changing the standings among the playoff teams. I personally think that its pretty terrible, less so because of overall parity and more so for what it does to playoff seeding. Also, I'll include the standings without the automatic Top 3 seeding of the division leaders. As both a forum for debate and discussion, as well as plain old interest, I figured I'd open and try to update every few days, the standings as they sit with and without the loser point:

[As of 3/4/2012]

Western Conference 1-10 Standings:
1) VANCOUVER    66GP 90PTS
2) DETROIT      65GP 89PTS
3) PHOENIX      65GP 75PTS
4) ST LOUIS     66GP 89PTS
5) NASHVILLE    65GP 83PTS
6) CHICAGO      66GP 77PTS
7) SAN JOSE     64GP 73PTS
8) DALLAS       65GP 73PTS
---------------------------
9) LOS ANGELES  65GP 72PTS
10) COLORADO     66GP 70PTS

WITHOUT 3rd PT or Automatic seeding of Division leaders:
1) DETROIT      65GP 43W
2) VANCOUVER    66GP 41W
3) ST LOUIS     66GP 41W
4) NASHVILLE    65GP 38W
5) CHICAGO      66GP 35W
6) DALLAS       65GP 34W
7) SAN JOSE     64GP 33W
8) PHOENIX      65GP 33W
---------------------------
9) COLORADO     66GP 33W
10) LOS ANGELES  65GP 30W

Using the old tie system, no division leader seeding:
1) ST LOUIS     66GP 84PTS
2) VANCOUVER    66GP 82PTS
3) DETROIT      65GP 81PTS
4) NASHVILLE    65GP 77PTS
5) CHICAGO      66GP 69PTS
6) DALLAS       65GP 68PTS
7) PHOENIX      65GP 67PTS
8) SAN JOSE     64GP 63PTS
---------------------------
9) LOS ANGELES  65GP 63PTS
10) CALGARY      65GP 61PTS


WESTERN CONFERENCE MATCHUPS:

As they are:
1) VANCOUVER  VS. 8) DALLAS
2) DETROIT    VS. 7) SAN JOSE
3) PHOENIX    VS. 6) CHICAGO
4) ST LOUIS   VS. 5) NASHVILLE

Alternative 1 (no loser point or division leader):
1) DETROIT    VS. 8) PHOENIX
2) VANCOUVER  VS. 7) SAN JOSE
3) ST LOUIS   VS. 6) DALLAS
4) NASHVILLE  VS. 5) CHICAGO


Alternative 2 (2 pts for REG/OT Win, 1 pt for tie, no shootout):
1) ST LOUIS   VS. 8) SAN JOSE
2) VANCOUVER  VS. 7) PHOENIX
3) DETROIT   VS. 6) DALLAS
4) NASHVILLE  VS. 5) CHICAGO

Some folks would prefer the old system of ties after OT, whereby one point is awarded to each team. I personally prefer to raise the stakes by leaving the format the same, adding longer overtimes with perhaps a 4on4 then 3on3 format before shootouts, while making wins in any case 2PTS and losses in any case 0PTS. This will eliminate teams who "wait out" the third period and overtime when outmatched, content to get a point and try their luck at a shootout, while increasing the desperation on the better team that night to close out the game before reaching a shootout where anything can happen. Either way, I think automatic seeding of division winners should be eliminated.