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wings4thecup06

Member Since 16 Apr 2006
Offline Last Active Yesterday, 04:13 PM
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#2535223 Alfie wants to play

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 30 August 2014 - 07:50 AM

LOL Cleary is absolutely an NHL calibre player. If he comes to camp healthy, he should without a doubt be capable of producing as a third line support guy. The big question is whether or not he is finally healthy... I don't like this signing any more than any other Wings fan, but I do have a ton of respect for Dan Cleary and for the Wings management (Ken Holland) for honoring their handshake deal from last year. I find it very difficult to believe that some Wings "fans" are actually hoping Cleary fails.f****** ridiculous... I hope he proves all the haters wrong and plays 50+ games and puts up 20+ points.

 

I have a ton of respect for Cleary. But I'm completely divided on this issue. Part of me wants Danny to have a real strong season, but then the other half of me wants several prospects - Jurco and Mantha mainly, to play better than him in preseason so they force managements hand into playing them full time in the NHL this season. More so for Jurco than Mantha, but you get the point. I don't want Cleary to fail or suck though. But part of me feels its time to move on and properly make the young guns transition. Jurco is a big part of that IMO, and if we can get nearly a full season of Tatar-Sheahan-Jurco, we'll be a stronger team. 




#2535110 Lines Thread

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 28 August 2014 - 04:45 PM

I have no problem with Z, Dats and Gus. Like Nawein said, Z and Gus had great chemistry before the Olympics. 

 

Placing Jurco on the top line right now isn't what's needed. He needs to grow his offensive game at the NHL level and learn how to score and be physical consistently, so that when he gets his top line minutes chance, he can do the job. Learning the power forwards role against top line opponents when you're a rookie isn't easy. If Abby had better hands, he'd be perfect. 

 

Can we bring back Shanny? 




#2535049 Las Vegas rumored to get an expansion team

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 27 August 2014 - 04:16 PM

But that's just it I think they will make money. If the owner spends to the cap and doesn't townny lunch they'll have a good team eventually and the bandwagon fans will come( see LA).

Casinos and/or hotels could include tickets in a tourist type package.

I'd go watch hockey in Vegas. Maybe have slot machines in the concourse or just connect it to a hotel and casino. It could be a state of the art stadium.

 

Do we really want to be exposing our young fans to that kind of stuff at such a young age? 

This should be about hockey, not blowing away money. Which is precisely the reason the NHL should avoid LV like the plague. 




#2535048 Changes to the draft lottery system

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 27 August 2014 - 04:10 PM

i propose giving the 1st. pick to the team that just missed out on the playoffs. (#17) then counting down from there. 18-19-20-etc...to 30 then picking back up at #16 to champs.

this would totally stop the tanking issues and promote the end of year games to actually mean something for winning.

this 17th place team would just miss out on revenue of playoffs...but the perk would be #1 overall.

now..the argument would begin that a team that has the opportunity to take the 8th seed or tank the game for the pick could come up...but the statistical opportunity would have to fall in place just right.

 

this would never happen...because the bottom teams would have a fit over getting screwed. but my response is then dont suck!

rewards for failure just bugs me. its like a field goal. "you tried...and came...kinda close..heres some feel good points" :w00t:

 

Yea this isn't a good idea. Why should you be rewarded for just missing the playoffs? Plus, there actually might be a bigger incentive just to miss the playoffs than make it! Thus, if you're in a battle for the last spot with like 2 other teams, all of them might try and tank to get that 17th place, which wouldn't make for entertaining hockey at all. 




#2535018 Las Vegas rumored to get an expansion team

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 27 August 2014 - 11:16 AM

I'm sorry, but this would be the worst idea. It's an absolute joke. Hasn't the NHL actually learned from the fiascos that are the Panthers, Coyotes and all the sunbelt franchises? What were the stories coming out of Florida last year saying the panthers were losing millions each year? How many years did the league have to prop up the Coyotes finances? 

 

If they should be doing anything, it's moving the Panthers to Quebec City, and the Coyotes to Seattle. 

 

I'd rather see the league fold than have a team in another doomed from the start, non hockey loving City that couldn't give two shoots about the game. 




#2535015 Holland signs 4 year extension with wings **MOD Warning Post 130**

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 27 August 2014 - 11:04 AM

 

Fully agree I really don't understand why the guy is risking an almost flawless legacy instead of moving up and help teach another guy what it means to the GM of the Detroit Red Wings.

 

I reckon the simply and short answer is, there is a new challenge that has arisen. Before, in the late 90's early 2000's, it was tweaking and adding little pieces to get us over the top. Ala Hasek, Robitaille, Hull etc. Lang. Stuart. Etc etc. We didn't need all these fancy first round picks, we could get who we needed. 

 

Now, not only is the cap a massive challenge, but the Wings lost Lidstrom, and competitive balance is raging on as ever. The challenge is now to keep the Wings competitive while building the team up without falling into the basement, so that in 2 or 3 years we can start adding those little pieces to once again put the Wings over the top. 




#2535013 Fedorov and Yzerman vs. Datsyuk and Zetterberg

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 27 August 2014 - 10:47 AM

In all seriousness, this is no contest. Yzerman and Fedorov, hands down, all day long, all week long, all year long...etc...etc...

 

I love Pav and Z, but if Yzerman and Fedorov were able to play in this no obstruction era, I cannot imagine the points they would have put up. I believe Pav and Z would've done fine in 90's, but not as good as they do now and I believe nowhere near what Yzerman and Feds would do today...

 

I really do wonder how much better their numbers really would have been tbh. Not because of the quality of their line mates, but simply because the average standard of goalies across the board has increased dramatically in the last 10-15 years or so. For example, in 88-89, Yzerman's best offensive output, GAA league leader was Roy with a pedestrian 2.44. And outside of Pete Peters 2.31 in 82, that was the highest of the decade. In the 23 years from 1990-91 to last year, only 8 times has the league leader in GAA been above 2.00, 3 of which were above 2.30. Again in 1990-91 Belfour led the league in GAA with a 2.47 and SV% of .910. Today? The top 3 GAA leaders were all under 2.00, while SV% was led by Harding at .933 and Rask at .930. 

 

Now obviously, GAA isn't everything, but its just a snapshot. The butterfly style has by and large transformed the goalie and offence has decreased, even in the no obstruction era. Goalies are just so much better across the board today than they were 20-25 years ago. 

 

I agree though that if I had to choose, right now I'd pick Stevie and Feds over Pavel and Hank. 

 

 

Read the Holland re-signs thread, there's some question there.


 

At their age and with their injury histories, I don't see those kinds of numbers again.

 

Hank has averaged just over a point per game in the last 2 seasons, albeit with a bad back, which is now fixed. If he's feeling as good as he says he is, I don't see why an 80 point season is out of reach if he stays healthy the entire year. 




#2534949 Holland signs 4 year extension with wings **MOD Warning Post 130**

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 26 August 2014 - 03:38 PM

Saying "Sign UFA's" is easy, but the reality of the situation is that in 2014 the players available in UFA are typically average/above average players who are paid like they are borderline elite, I don't believe these types of players are necessarily the answer in the post cap era, in this era I believe the answer is grooming your own home grown talent and supplementing it with UFA's when the right player for the right price is available, otherwise these types of moves can be absolutely crippling to a team. We are coming off a year where Matt Niskanen & Paul Stastny headlined a class, nothing against them as players but we aren't talking Suter/Parise here. The reason why you cant answer the question is because that magic player was not there. The closest person is probably Suter, but signing anyone to a 14 deal right before a CBA was about to be negotiated would have been extremely risky and I am glad we didn't land him.

 

We took a gamble on Weiss, and while he does have years to come around, I think this shows you how just signing a UFA doesn't fix everything.

 

I find it ironic that you use LA and Chicago in your points of comparison, but you are frustrated that we are not winning now. Chicago and LA did not become elite team overnight, they were very bad, for a very long time. LA didn't make the playoffs for 7 years, until there most recent winning way started (i'm talking 7 years to get back in to playoffs, not going deep or winning cups), Chicago (with the one exception of '02) didn't make the playoffs for 11 years.

 

We are in a re-build, people need to accept it. The difference between us and others of the past is that we just aren't horsesh*t doing it. We could go all in and trade Kronwall, Zetterberg, Datsyuk etc. but what they are doing is hoping that our kids can become great, while the vets are still elite or close to it, plus using these vets to give guidance to the kids that are coming up.  Its almost as if sustaining our winning ways to a degree is hurting us, because its resulting in people failing to see the re-build. I'm sorry, but I dont want to be Edmonton, or what Chicago and LA were and be very bad for a very long time. Having a quick turn-around where we dont need to just unload everyone, and are still making the playoffs in an era of parity where anything can happen, is a nice way of doing it!

 

Lastly, as far as comparing Holland to Yzerman and Nill, this is fair buts lets wait a couple of years. Other then a final 4 a few years ago, Yzerman hasn't done anything yet. Since that final 4 TB didnt make the playoffs, and then were swept first round. I admit they appear to be going in the right direction, but its results that matter.

Nill....same thing. I love the moves he is making, but at the end of the day all Dallas has accomplished is an 8th seed where they were bounced first round.

Please don't take this as me putting either of these guys down, the moves appear to be good ones, but lets wait and see.

 

Great post, and I couldn't agree more. I remember watching the Wings beat down the Hawks in 04 and it was just plain embarrassing. Chicago were just truly awful, and I don't think I would want to see the Wings become that bad, I really wouldn't. I wouldn't stop watching, but it would be soul destroying. I don't care if it would result in a 1st overall pick, I'd much rather be in the position the Wings are now, competing while rebuilding on the fly, than be the laughing stock of the league. 




#2534716 Lines Thread

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 21 August 2014 - 06:31 PM

I miss having someone like this in the lineup...

 

 

 

Here's hoping Glendening and/or Callahan can develop into an impact hitter.

 

Couldn't agree more. I really miss that too. Shame that Fischer got injured too nearly died and had to retire, we could have used that toughness on the back end. Glad to see that he's doing good though. 


The contract that Cleary signed includes a bonus if he plays ten games with the Wings. Because this whole contract renewal thing has to do with honoring Holland's word that the Wings will take care of Cleary this year, a lot of us suspect that Cleary will get 10 games with the Wings (unless he's absolutely terrible or injured). In those 10 games the organization can determine whether Cleary will be an asset to the team for the remainder of the season, and Cleary gets the money he left on the table last year. My prediction is he plays 10 games and that's the last we see of him.

 

And yea, I wouldn't be surprised if he gets 10 games, but if he's truly being outplayed in training camp by the likes of Jurco and Pulkkinen, I can't believe the Wings would play him? 




#2534673 Holland signs 4 year extension with wings **MOD Warning Post 130**

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 21 August 2014 - 03:07 AM

And who is responsible for that decision? Right the GM anyway he now has 4 years to right a sinking ship. It's a really tough task and after we lose Babs it will be even harder Personally I would have preferred a rebuild in such an awesome draft year but seems like the streak is more important : (

 

But we are rebuilding Frank. It's just happening slowly and with less drastic effects, as the Wings are filtering in the young guys into the lineup to compliment and eventually succeed, the vets. 

 

I would still prefer to make the playoffs every year than go the traditional rebuild route where you don't even sniff a winning record for half a decade. But that's me. 




#2534650 Lines Thread

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 20 August 2014 - 06:27 PM

You're right someone was good 10, 15 or 20 years ago so they must still be good now!

Howe can prolly still play let's sign him up.

 

Plus, things shouldn't just be gifted to anyone in life, they should be earned. Just like with the young kids here. Why would they be pasted straight into the lineup every night if they hadn't already proven they could play at that level, or even tried to earn it? It sends the wrong message to everyone in the organisation. Whereas sending the message of 'if you want to play here, you've got to earn it', promotes (IMO) hard work and competition. 

 

Now, granted, it might have seemed like over the last few years the Wings haven't exactly been as lenient with the kids as they perhaps should, but as we saw last year, opportunities arose, and the kids grabbed the bull by the horns and 'earned' their spots. Hopefully, the likes of Jurco and co outplay Cleary and start the year with the big boys. 




#2534577 Ice Bucket ALS Challenge: Bettman edition

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 19 August 2014 - 05:52 PM

Here's Cheli and Al!:

 




#2534567 Candiens, P.K. Subban agree to 8 year contract

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 19 August 2014 - 04:29 PM

@theScore: Kovalev is unsure why P.K. Subban is worth $72M: 'He plays like he did on streets as a child.' http://t.co/GoV5aINrNn http://t.co/AFKZPl1Rq8

SHOTS FIRED

 

I have to say, I agree with Alexei. 




#2534394 Holland signs 4 year extension with wings **MOD Warning Post 130**

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 16 August 2014 - 04:26 PM

How did the wings get Stevie y? It wasn't with the 278 overall pick. People are so DMAN short sighted YES THE WINGS TANKED TO GET GOOD. Stop the god damn arrogance and accept it.

Then they continue to draft AND trade AND sign free agents and were able to maintain it. Now they don't trade or sign free agents but still draft so we will see if they can.

It'll be tough for the playoff record the wings are in to happen again but that doesn't matter. What does matter is four cups in the span of 23 years now which can be matched. And I wouldn't surprised to see the kings do that either.

 

Essentially you've just taken what I said completely out of context. Obviously, I'm highly aware that we drafted Stevie with the 4th overall pick in 1983. And obviously, I realise that's what happens when you have bad seasons - you get to draft highly. 

 

What I was trying to point was the fact that the Kings young guys that Harold mentioned, were heralded for the fact that they were drafted really high. Contrast that with the Wings, who rarely pick high, and most of the time in the last decade or two have traded them away.But more so, the guys that are core players now were not thought of as hot shot, blue chip prospects.  They had to plough their trade and earn it, and they improved to the point of stardom. 

 

I hardly think that I was being short sighted or arrogant. 




#2534386 Holland signs 4 year extension with wings **MOD Warning Post 130**

Posted by wings4thecup06 on 16 August 2014 - 01:15 PM

 

That 2009 roster had Kopi, Brown, Doughty, J. Johnson, Wayne Simmonds, and Jonathan Quick.  They were a talented, but crazy young team.  Brown was the oldest of that group at 23.  Doughty was 18.  Johnson was 21. Quick was 22.  I don't know a ton about the Wings prospects but I'm pretty sure they don't compare to that group. 

 

Harold, I was essentially responding to that by pointing out the reason those prospects on the Kings were so highly regarded. They were really high picks. As opposed to most guys drafted by the wings - they're lower picks, go much further under the radar and generally take a lot longer to reach any sort of high ceiling that they might have. 

 

Yes KH has made a couple of bad moves, but not everything he has done has been bad. If I'm arguing this, I'd say this team is still competitive. Making the playoffs still means you're competitive. It means you've got a chance. While this team hasn't been the dominant juggernaut that I think most here would like to see (myself included), doesn't mean they haven't been competitive. And realistically, what if he'd actually signed Suter? This team would have been strengthened no end I feel. But he swung and miss in free agency, and it happens. It just means that it's taking a little longer for the plan to come to fruition in terms of the young guys coming through the system, which we're finally seeing the benefit of. Obviously, I think we'd all like to see the Wings get back to world beaters sooner rather than later, but if it also takes time, and if that means it's done the right way that ensures long term success again, then i'll be willing to wait.