VM1138

They say the same thing every year. I doubt Mantha makes the team even if he outscores everyone. The players, Babcock and Holland have all said they need to get more veteran, maybe they make an exception for Mantha, but how will we have room for him as well as getting tougher and more skilled up front?

I understand the logic behind keeping Franzen, but on the other hand, we know he won't improve. I'd like to see statistics regarding the number of games Franzen contributes in to see if there really is a decline, and if so, keeping him will be a bad move a few years down the line. That's the big consideration for me. We have a chance to fix this without it getting worse. We would need to replace him as a top 6 winger, or maybe find a high scoring third liner, sure, but if one is available you need to cut ties with Franzen, I think. Babcock just said that Franzen needs to be better and he expects him to be better. But he's been saying that for how long? Franzen won't change. It's how he is and has been for years. It's foolish to keep relying on him and expecting different results. If they keep him they need to at least realize he needs to be further down the depth chart.

Well, if you won't look beyond the superficial numbers you get a view of the team that isn't really accurate. Sort of like how teams use advanced metrics instead of simple +/- to determine how good a player is doing. True, we could've lost games on a lucky bounce, too. But I'm talking OT. It's far more likely a lucky bounce affects an overtime game than a regulation game. That's what I was getting at. They win a few OT games or shootouts and they're sitting pretty. Next season's team should get a fresh start without all the dead weight and some key additions.

I don't agree with this logic. Lots of people share your view, but having on old vet doesn't kill a team's chances to win anything. I don't care if they sign a 40 year old vet every year, so long as the vet helps and they don't load up with them. People get caught up in minor details like this and forget that winning a Cup is all about a holistic approach. You don't win by having no 40 year olds, or all tough guys, or all big guys, or all skill guys. You need a perfect balance. And like Datsyuk said, nobody knows the magic balance. You just keep trying to find it.

At least Zetterberg gets it. Looking to the future is good and all, but you've got to try to win now, not just sit and hope things work out in 5 years. I hope the organization is tired of losing like Zetterberg says and is ready to make some aggressive (but smart) moves.

First off...how can a team have a record longer than games played? If we arbitrarily change it to include October and November (27 games) it becomes: 13-10-4, where OT losses count as real losses, and the third column is only shootout losses. That's a Wings team where Bertuzzi and Cleary were in the lineup, Tatar had limited minutes, Nyquist hadn't been called up, and Weiss was playing injured and Alfredsson was learning a new system. Oh, and Franzen was having whatever secretive issues plagued him. We were hardly healthy, just not as injured as we would become. I separated the shootouts because those can't really indicate the success or failure of a team. It's more like pure dumb luck on a given night for an individual player. In other words, the Wings got points in 20 games of 27. That's pretty remarkable considering all the dead weight on the team. If we look at a record as showing games where points were earned they were 20-7 in the first two months. Consider that any of those games could've been victories with a lucky bounce here and there. Now we have the kid line and Nyquist. Smith is coming on and hopefully won't pull a Kindl, Zetterberg will be healthier than he's been in years, it's really not as bleak, at least for the regular season. We still have to change as a team to be built for a playoff run, but I'm not worried about the regular season, even if we iced the same team we did this year (God forbid).

If someone wanted Tootoo they would have taken him in a trade. Holland has always been good about letting players get a shot somewhere else. If they're not being used by the Wings, he will take a conditional pick for said player. He did it with Commodore most recently, and with Stuart before that. The sad reality seems to be that no team in the league wants Tootoo. His NHL career is over. And it's not because of us. We were the only ones who wanted him back when we signed him, too.

I really hope FSD knows what they're talking about and aren't just pulling these rumors out of thin air. It'd be nice if the Wings already had an aggressive strategy planned. When's the earliest we could hear roster changes? Anyone think we'll hear something about UFA's not returning before the end of playoffs?

His goals come in an increasingly smaller amount of games. Don't get caught up on 30 goals a year. If you count them by games its probably like 15. He's fine if we use him as a third liner but Babcock won't. So get rid of him. I think we need to re-evaluate the roles of players. All of our frustrations come from players who are forced into the wrong roles. Franzen is not a top 6 scorer. He is occasional secondary scoring forward. Abdelkader is not a top line power forward, and hence frustration there. Holland and Babcock need to recalibrate the lineup based on roles players can actually play and go from there. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

If there's any truth to the Hossa returning to Detroit thing that'd be huge. Hossa is fantastic, and with a new, better contract that's something we cannot pass on. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

He will. Zetrerberg was the same way of I remember right. He sacrificed speed for bulk and Nyquist will have to do the same. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

I absolutely disagree. None of our defenseman are good puck movers anymore except Kronwall. Smith may be one day, but it's just as likely he regresses like Kindl did. We need a right hander for sure. A lot of people have a "good enough roster" outlook. To win the Cup we will need a defense like: Kronwall-Top 2 puck moving guy Ericsson-Smith DeKeyser-Oullet/Sproul Provided Smith doesn't regress that might be good enough. Defense takes priority but this is a team with holes at every position and lacks an identity. They need to settle on a playing style that works and find the talent for that style. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

I'm not saying they'll never be good. But I don't like wait and see approaches in sports. You just waste years doing that. They will learn, but we won't become a stronger team by adding even more rookies. That's the Edmonton route. Some people want to just promote from within and I think that's a bad idea. It relies on too many flaky "ifs". Nyquist and Tatar will be beasts one day, but until then they need bonafide prime year players to bridge the learning gap years. Players don't learn from losing. Datsyuk and Zetterberg didn't learn by sucking. They learned because the team struggled but had reams of talent. That's all I mean. We need to keep trying to win to avoid complacency and installing a mediocre or losing culture. See: all the other perennial middling teams. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

Lashoff won't be back. He's a serviceable 7th guy, but we have too many D-men pushing for a spot. We don't need a designated 7th guy anymore. If someone is injured, we can just call up whichever of Sproul or Oullet who isn't up with the Wings at the start. I don't see both starting with the Wings. Kindl's gone. I hope Quincey is gone but fear Holland will look at the tough market and overlay for him out of desperation. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

I think we all got carried away with the youth movement. It failed miserably when it mattered. I'd rather keep the kids that are up, surround them with capable vets and return to a one or two rookies a year tradition. We've got so many kids coming up we will have to trade some anyway. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

People need to move on. Even if Jarnkrok is good he's on a team that's going nowhere. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

I don't see any team beating the Bruins. They would have to seriously slack off to not win the Cup this year. The East is so weak this year. Maybe a Western team could beat them but I doubt it. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

I don't know how player development goes, but I hope this series doesn't stunt Tatar and Nyquist. The Bruins were a brick wall that barely broke a sweat beating us. We never even really threatened them. Starting against the Penguins would've been a much better playoff experience. There's nothing really the kids can learn from this series. They didn't get better. They just got ground up. They're just as likely to have PTSD as to have learned anything. This is the first postseason where I really feel like there were no positives. Only Datsyuk, Smith and Zetterberg even tried. It was so lopsided even I feel shell shocked.

I hope we at least get another goal to not look like total chumps. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

As stupid as that two minute span was, the refs did not cost the Wings this series. A goal or two sure, but they still don't score enough. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

I hear dives get called sometimes but of the hundreds of games I've watched the past few years I don't recall ever seeing one called. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

We better get a damn makeup call. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

Obligatory back breaking last second goal from a broken play? Check. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

Wings are trying their best to lose this. Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2

Is this real life? We had a couple good chances! Sent from my ADR6350 using Tapatalk 2