Nev

The Lindros trade probly does it - hell, Lindros for Forsberg straight up would favour QUE/COL But one that hasn't been mentioned and is always a favourite of mine is Alexei Yashin for Zdeno Chara and a 1st (Jason Spezza).

It was only a matter of time. This is why I've been dead against using Lebda or Lilja as trade bait. We simply must have 7 NHL level d-men on our roster because Kronwall is almost certain to miss extended periods. Kronwall being fit or not has no impact on my desire to land Blake or Foote - I wanted them anyway.

Thing is, if he *was* a wing, and he sucker-punched Barret Jackman, he'd be a hero. If was *was* a wing, and he took a run and delivered a flying hit on Chris Pronger, he'd be a hero. Darren McCarty is a hero (in part) for pounding an opponent who was down on the ice. Brendan Shanahan is a hero (in part) for taking a running, flying mid-air hit on a goalie The last 2 are hardly part of "The Code", but they are Redwings folklore. Don't get me wrong, like I said before, Tootoo is a dirty little *****, but if he'd started his career in Detroit instead of NSH a lot of opinions in this thread would be different....

I'm with ya on Tucker. Can't stand the guy tbh, but he is just what we need, but its those 2 yrs left on his contract that will stop it - teams can't eat a traded players salary till next year IIRC, which is a damn shame. For me, we need 2 things urgently, and 1 nice-to-have. Big, physical D-man. Clearly this is coming down to Blake or Foote. Blake has more offensive upside, would be great on the 2nd PP unit (Righty as well) and will be more availiable (LA out of playoff contention, non-divisional) Foote has more physical upside, but is at a divisional rival who are still in playoff contention. Physical winger who can score a few goals We're not looking for the 2nd coming of Cam Neely here. Just someone who can bang a few bodies, maybe drop the gloves occasionally, and capable of 2nd-line duties - maybe 10-15 goals a season. The aforementioned Tucker, or Raffi Torres would be ideal here. Nice to have would be a 4th line center, add a bit of depth and experience. Fedorov would be a dream, Peca would be nice. Interested to see Stoll is being mentioned as on the block in Edmonton - great face-off guy, again would be ideal on the 4th line. The biggest problem is that atm only 1 team is OUT of playoff contention (LA). Even TB are only 9pts out of the playoffs. We'll have to wait another 3 weeks I guess to see who really will be a seller at the trade deadline, because right now there are a lot of potential buyers. Expendables - Sammy, Hudler, one of Kindl/Ericsson.

Yeah he's dirty little ***** who cheap-shots other players. But ya know what? I AM SICK TO FRACKING DEATH OF OTHER TEAMS RUNNING OUR STAR PLAYERS/GOALIE AND THE WINGS DOING A COLLECTIVE KNACK-ALL ABOUT IT!! Quite frankly, I would love to have a player (or 2, or 3) who slams an opponents head into the boards, because Lord knows it happens to our players often enough. Holmstrom & Lebda last year - whose turn will it be this year to be injured by an opponents dirty play with no fear of retribution?

rick zombo - great link, thanks for posting As for which team is the best? I'm going to take Bowman's answer on this. When he was asked once which was the best team of ALL the teams he coached, he said the 02 Wings. Better than his DOMINANT Canadiens teams of the 70s with Lafleur, Shutt, Robinson, Dryden, Gainey, Lemaire etc. Better than his stacked Penguins team with Lemieux, Jagr, Murphy, Mullen, Francis, Coffey etc. And if it's good enough for Scotty, its good enough for me I mean, for crying out loud, the 02 Wings had a 4th line with Pavel Datsyuk and Brett Hull!!!!!

Yzerman Robitaille Leetch Hull Larionov and Andreychuk will have to wait another year - but herein lies the problem If you actually look at the eligable players the next 4-5 years (and include probable retirees as well), the classes are stacked almost every year, especially now the first wave of European players have retired and are coming up for eligability. I think with the expanded NHL, 4 players may not be enough per year. IMO it could do with expanding to 5 (that doesn't mean you HAVE to elect 5, just a max of 5). IIRC Larionov was eligable this year but stood no chance against Messier/Francis/McInnis/Stevens and the fact is that he will struggle to get in, because despite being called the HOCKEY hall of fame, it remains the NHL hall of fame.

Good for D-Mac. He's still a long way from being a regular NHLer again, but if he can at least secure himself a regular spot in GR that will be a big step up from where his life was at 12 months ago.

Isn't the 4th fastest to 200 career wins or something?

Messier and Leetch are no brainers...Richter is a yes in my book. But Graves? Yeah, he was a heart and soul player, fan favourite, yadda yadda yadda. He had 1 really good season (52 goals) and 2 OK seasons (38 & 36 goals). But apart from that....260 career goals in 772 games and 1 Cup as a Ranger with no major awards = nowhere near retirement numbers IMO. It makes the Fedorov debate on here look like a joke. As others have said, based on this criteria 91, 30, 14 & 33 are all certainties for the rafters. To which I will add 25, 18 & 96 as needing serious consideration.

Thing is, it must be hard for the kid to develop his game and gain some confidence when you're only playing 5 minutes a night. The only way he'll get more ice time is if we get 2 or 3 injuries up front.

I was actually referring to Sundin with my comment. But wrt to Kubina, he's probly gunna be cheaper than Blake or Foote (and is also a right shot which is important). Having said that, a top 4 of Lidstrom, Rafalski, Kronwall and Blake/Foote looks a hell of a lot scarier than Lidstrom, Rafalski, Kronwall and Kubina. Check where I live mate I'm not even going to go into different cultures and different sporting styles.

Fixed. Now that's a line-up I'd be happy with going into the playoffs But yeah, I'd be content just to swap Samuelsson for Mayers.

If we're giving up top picks, top players and top prospects I want it to be the kind of player we need like Blake or Foote, NOT another skilled European, however good.

You should go ask the fans in Hartford what they think about Shanny being a loyal, character kind of guy Don't get me wrong, Coffey Primeau and a 1st for Shanahan was one of the most important trades in Redwings history, but try and look at the bigger picture when comparing players. Of course, if Feds had signed that $50M contract, he'd still be here eating $7M of cap space with rapidly diminishing skills. Then the fans would *really* hate him!

ANd if you think we can resign Clearly for less than $2M, you're crazy There are a lot of desperate teams out there with a lot of salary cap space. On 20 other teams in the league Cleary would wear an A or a C. I *really* hope he resigns with us, because he is starting to become to Detroit what Wendel Clarke was in Toronto and Gary Roberts was in Calgary.

Great stuff! Nice that the team made the time for the fans - I'm sure the fans will repay them tonight against LA

Frack At least the all-star break gives him a chance to get some decent rest without missing more than a couple of games.

Been ruminating more on Kennys semi-cryptic comments........clearly if Cleary wants somewhere in the $3-4M range either he's going to have to walk, or someone else is going to be shifted to make room. The more I think about it, the more I think that if we want to keep DC, Huds will be moved before he gets his payday (probly in the $2-3M range if he keeps up his points)

Why has this myth grown up amongst Redwings fans that Fedorov left for more money? He was offered, and turned down, a 5 year $50M contract 6 months before he became an UFA. For various reasons (that it seems even Kenny and Sergei still can't figure out) the relationship between Sergei and Management broke down and Fedorov felt it was time to leave. Shanny turns down big $$$$ to leave and everyone kisses his ass for it. ??? As for those who said he's not in the top ranks of Wings scorers, are you kidding????? 4th all-time in regular season scoring (Howe, Yzerman, Lyndsay, Fedorov) 3rd all-time in playoff scoring (Howe, Yzerman, Fedorov) - 163 points in 162 games! Top scoring Russian in NHL history 6 All star appearances 1 Lester B Pearson 2 Selke's 1 Hart Trophy 3 Stanley Cups Wings fans dislike of Fedorov is so irrational I feel sorry for the guy. He helped give this franchise perhaps its best ever 10 year spell and he gets zero gratitude for it.

Loyalty is one thing, but Cleary earns a paltry $675,000 and has an agent who can see $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ in front of his eyes. 4 years, for $10M or $11M would be a fair deal but if he's not signed by the summer someone is going to be offering him $14-15M over the same period. Who wouldn't want a hard working, gritty team guy who can put the puck in the net?

you guys expect too much from Lilja - he's a 3rd pairing d-man earning not too much. As for that turnover, you think he would have been on the ice with Selanne if Schneider and Kronwall were healthy? Exactly. Cleary worries me though. That crazy Pat Sharp deal may make it hard to keep him, and reading between the lines on Hollands comments he seems to be saying "if we can't get DC signed before the trade deadline, we'll move him"

If his back holds up, and if he stays on a ZDH line then yes. Otherwise no.

Wow, this kid plays one game for Florida and he's suddenly a stud? At the end of the day we still gave up virtually nothing for Bertuzzi. Calm down people, there is a long way to go before this trade turns in Alexei Yashin for Zdeno Chara and a 1st (Jason Spezza)

Holy Frack.....