Nev

. This. Um, it makes all the difference? We're talking about retiring a players number as a RED WING. If career totals mattered, we'd be retiring 14 and 24, but they don't, and we aren't, and we shouldn't be.

Honestly, if he dropped the gloves just a little bit more often, he'd get cut a hell of a lot more slack from a lot of Wings fans. Unfortunately he seems more reluctant to do it - I think it was that fight in particular, he got chewed out by Babcock for leaving them a defencemen short. Same with his big hits. Ever since he got suspended in the 2011 pre-season, the big hits have stopped.

For someone with 3000 posts you're sure acting like someone new to LGW! :lol: Great cap hit, big incentive for Smith to earn himself a realgud contract in 2 years.

I agree its not about stats - that's why McCarty, Holmstrom, Draper and Maltby will never be retired. 4 cups each and a bazillion games in red aren't enough for them. Pav on the other hand has the stats, he has the silverware and he has the longevity. And lets not forget, without that nice Mr Bettman he'd have another 120 games on is CV and be pushing 900 points already.

Honestly, the ridiculous standards that some Wings fans hold up for number retirement these days, we'd better un-retire Lindsay, Delvecchio and Abel, because they don't qualify. Hell, even Yzerman, he's not all-NHL all-time quality, so he doesn't count either. Just Sawchuk, Howe and Lidstrom it is. IMO, Datsyuk is a yes. 4 more seasons and he will be ~1050 points, more than Ullman, Lindsay, Fedorov, Abel etc and good for 5th all time in Wings scoring (only Howe, Yzerman, Lidstrom and Delvecchio will have more)....throw in (at least) 3 Selkes, 4 Lady Byngs, 2 Stanley Cups and an incredible human-highlight-reel style of play and I don't see how you can say no. Zetterberg is going to be borderline. A lot depends on how his health holds up, and what he achieves in the 2nd half of his career. He could easily accumulate 1000+ points, but he might need a bit more silverware. Fedorov, by any measure should be straight up there.............except for the manner of his departure. That was one reason why I hoped he would come back late in his career, so he could have a rapproachment with the fans/management. Hopefully he'll appear in one of the legends games at the WC to begin his rehabilitation.

Win

This. Too many people define a #1 D as "all-star-Norris trophy candidate-hall of famer." As someone else said, those are Franchise Defencemen and no-one here would argue Kronwall is one of those. Plus we've been spoiled rotten and given insane expectations of what to expect from a #1D by 20 years of Lidstrom.

Sammy has an NTC.

O RLY?

One hell of a Colorado team we beat too. Sakic, Forsberg, Roy, Blake, Foote etc. If game 7 hadn't been a blowout it could've gone down as one of the greatest series ever.

Greatest moment in Chelis career? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9V6Y7a9dbo

GMR has already pointed out Bowman. Ilitch is also already in. When Holland finally gets in (when is he eligable?) that will make 13. As for Lindros v Forsberg, they both get in. Lindros was a GREAT player, absolutely dominant, a complete beast before the injuries wrecked him. I'm a big believer in quality over quantity when it comes to the HHOF, I'd rather have a great player whose career was cut short by injuries (Lindros, Bure) than an good player who was a long time accumulator (Cicarelli). The cups argument is completely bogus - do we let Maltby and Draper in on that basis?

Yep, did you know he scored 50 goals in junior? Anyway, what impresses me the most is that only 2 teams average more than 41 wins per season, Jersey @ 43.6 and us at a whopping 47.7. An average of 48 wins per season, over 22 seasons? That's just insane.

I remember seeing Vial play for the Sheffield Steelers in the British Superleague, never realised he was a former Wing, remembered him from the Senators expansion days though.

Fleischmann and Matthias have both turned into servicable NHL players since we traded them away. Avery also turned into a reasonable player before his ego destroyed his career.

No income tax in the state of Florida either, I believe?

This is LGW, so anything short of going 82-0-0 and then a 16-0 run to the cup, coupled with a league record in fighting majors and trading Cleary for the 1st overall pick in 2014 will be an unmitigated disaster which can only be resolved by the instant dismissal of Holland and Babcock

Things is, Jagr loves 2 things - money, and playing the game. And far too many people focus on the first and ignore his love of the second.

I don't mind re-signing Cleary, but NOT for 3 years and NOT for that cap hit.

I must confess this feels really weird. Alfredsson WAS the Ottawa Senators. I've just been over to their board and its sack-cloth and ashes time. Imagine how we'd feel if a 40 year old Lidstrom had signed with the Kings because he felt he had a bettwe chance of a cup? Seems bizarre reasoning to me, they're in a similar situation to us - 7/8 seed with some good kids coming through mixed with a few star players. Are our chances of a cup really that much greater than the Sens?

I confess, I lol'd

Boston are hell to play against because they have a lot of good players. That some of them are big and tough is just gravy. People make the same mistake about the 07 Ducks - they were good because they had a lot of good players and had at least 1 HOF defenceman on the ice for 50 minutes a night, not because George Parros was on the 4th line.

This. He shut down Malkin and scored a couple of big goals in the 08 finals, and for that he gets my thanks and best wishes

It was actually before a pre-season game, if you can believe that. I think it was the one where Bert pounded Orpik for a knee-on-knee hit on Franzen.

Its an interesting point, and one I thought about too. BTW I believe he only has 4 years left on his contract which makes it more tempting.