Frozen-Man

First the thread was started because if is sad to see your whining baby of a coach happy. The tread was started not because the poster was crushed by the loss but nauseaus because of how bad of a sport and big of a baby Therrin has been throughout the finals. Furthermore, many of the posts are joking about how tired they were or sick from eating pizza. Granted there were several fans that were very upset but it was not a devostating loss in that it took the best game that Flurrey has played, the worst that Ozzy has played in the playoffs this year, 3 OTs, a goal with your goalie pulled, and a goal shot in by one of the Wing's players in order for the Pens to get the win. I am not saying that to take away from the Pens victory, they played hard and got a good win BUT the disappointing part was that we thought the cup was most likely won which is vastly different from the Pens play crushing the Wings (for example see the way that the Pens lost games 1 and 2). It was deeply disappointing that the Wings outplayed the Pens and still lost but there is no feeling that the Pens play in anyway dominated the Wings or that their actual play crushed them. A 4-3 triple overtime loss is disappointing but a 4-0 victory is a crushing defeat. At least thats my take on it.

Actually, the games have been selling out. In fact they were sold out except for a few single seat tickets within 10 minutes of going on sale. http://www.examiner.com/a-1400615~Red_Wing...ls_tickets.html I don't think most here thought that it was a legit question that started this thread but rather a taunt to which Wings fans responded. Most of the complaints here were not about non-calls but the absolutely horrible overtime calls for goalie interference (which my gripe was the calls in general I don't want the Wings getting those calls either especially in OT). Furthermore, you have to be kidding when you say that ya'll aren't talking about the ones that go our way. Did you listen to anything that your coach said after games (especially after games one and two). I have no problem with the Pens and like most of the players but I have rarely heard a coach whine as much as Therrien did. I was disgusted with the way that he whined and I honestly believe that even if I weren't a Wings fan it would have made me sick. I appreciate your post and the tone in which you wrote it but respectfully disagree as I truly believe that your coach has been an embarrassment this series. That being said great play and comeback from your team Monday night and I look forward to another great game tonight and may the best team win.

Yeah crushing because the Pens lost a two goal lead got it handed to them for most of the game, had to have Flurrey play the game of his life, and still took 3 OT's to get their second win of the series. I mean the Pens have scored a whole 7 goals in 5 games thats incredible (and squeeked out both wins) whereas the Wings have gotten 14 goals and blown the Pens out twice. I mean congrats on the big OT win but your team is still sucking hind ***.

In my opinion there is a big difference between whining about the refs and blaming our losses on them and being genuinely concerned when the refs make such patently horrible calls (no matter which team they are called on) for something like crashing the net. I do not want the Wings to get a PP based upon a similar call and would be greatly disappointed if we win the Cup in overtime tonight based upon call such as the two OT goalie interference calls in game 5. How can it be good for the sport for players to be afraid to crash the net (especially in OT when it is sudden death) because they are afraid that a wonderful hockey play will not only not result in a goal for their team but will actually put them down a man. Additionally, it is compounded by the fact that there were two almost identical horrible calls in OT. You would hope that the refs would be embarrassed by such a gaffe and would be certain before they called the penalty. It is not just that they were botched calls (that happens no big deal) it is that the result will be that players will not drive to the net or will do so with great trepidation and that is a horrible result. Again I am not blaming the refs for our loss if the team had played better in the first, or not given up a goal with 34 seconds left it wouldn't even be an issue. Regardless of the outcome of any game we should not have one much less two calls.

Maybe you don't understand the phrase "three in a row" if the Pens were to win the cup they whould have to win three in a row. Yes, they have one one of those but the point is that it is still going to be really hard to win the last game and the next two. Thats how winning and losing streaks work you count all the games. The Pens will have to win three games in a row without the Wings winning one.

I agree with you to a degree. Penalties will always be missed or called when there was not one. And in my opinion this has been an amazing SCF and has been great for the sport of hockey BUT I also think that serious damage will be done if Detroit wins the cup or in 6 or 7 the Pens win the game on a call that poorly officated. I don't think that the calls were because we are the Wings or they are the Pens or anything like that but what a horrible ending to an amazing game if that happens. Furthermore, I think it is bad for the sport to penalize guys for driving to the net while rewarding guys when there is a small and often embellished interference 80 feet from the net. My gripe is not oh thats why we lost (because I don't think it is) it is more that this cannot be the best that we have to offer in the way of officiating in the SCF or someday soon the Cup will be decided by a ref on a call that is not even questionable (at least in 1999 the Bret Hull goal was questionable and debatable) and I don't care who wins I don't want that to happen.

You know absolutely NOTHING about hockey if you think that there was a penalty on either of the OT goalie interference calls. There is not one player (except the Penguins) or commentator anywhere that I have seen or heard that thinks either of those calls were even close to correct. There is not much argument about the high stick it should have definitely been a penalty. I don't care if you don't like the Wings or even if you bash them but it is idiotic to state that either of those calls should have been made.

That made me laugh out loud. It amazes me when the fans of the team that are down talk trash.

True. It amazes me how little it takes for some people to turn on their teams players. The guy has played very well over all but had a rough night last night. It happens, give the guy a break I think that if you look at the playoffs as a whole or even just the SCF he has played as well as you can ask a #4 D man to play.

:clap: :clap:

SO TRUE

No I agree but neither should you just waste the 5 million just because you have it, especially when you will also have to give up draft picks, prospects, and/or players. Furthermore, we would have had to spend it on either someone that would be a free agent that we might not resign or on a player that after this run we might not want as much as some of the free agents this summer or guys that we need to resign.

I would agree with that but I just don't think it would have ever happened especially considering that the Pens gave up Erik Christensen, Colby Armstrong, thier 2007 1st round pick Angelo Esposito, and a 1st round draft pick for Hossa (and Pascal Dupuis). I just don't There is no way that we could have gotten Hossa for Flip (or less) it would have taken much much more. Furthermore, I don't think that we could resign him unless he agreed to almost no money especially with what we are soon going to have to pay Z and Franzen (I realize that at the time Franzen's stock was not as high). What with the big money already tied up in Dats, Lids, and Raffy I just don't think that there is any way that you can sign 2 more 6-7 million dollar players and then still have anthing for guys like Cleary and Franzen. It seems to me that if we had gotten Hossa for Flip (which I don't think there is any way that we could have accomplished) I think we probably also lose Franzen, Cleary, and Stuart (or at least 2 of the 3) to free agency because we have no money left over. I know that is all just speculation, Franzen might not have emerged had we gotten Hossa and would have signed a smaller contract (or whatever hypo you want) but I just don't see how that big of a piece fits into the cap that the Wings will have.

I agree I don't think that the guy will lose his touch or that he will stop caring so I think that he should be offered a really long term contract. His ability to find players that no one else has is amazing.

I know Ottowa only played 4 games in the playoffs but LaPointe had 0 goals 0 assists and was a -1. I agree I don't think that he would have been a big help.

I don't think that is correct I think he is still going to be a UFA at the end of this year. http://letsgopens.com/pens_roster.php Edit: Sorry TheRock I didn't see the other posts before I posted mine. Didn't mean to pile on.

Cracked me up

Whew, in that case I think you have a pretty good list.

I thought he made a very cogent arguement as to why Lids Dats and Z should be on the top three. Many people would argue that Lids is number 1 for all that he does (points, TOI, +-, all the intangibles) and I thought he made a great arguement for Dats and Z. I don't think that enough credit is given to the fact that they are both up for the Selke and considered to be at least 2 of the top 3 defensive forwards in the league. To me this honor is componded by how phenomenal they both are offensively. Compare the three finalists. Dats = 31 goals 66 assists 97 points +41 Z = 43 goals 49 assists 92 points +30 Madden = 20 goals 23 assists 43 points +1 It is amazing that Dats and Z can be that impressive offensively and still be the best defensively. Furthermore, Dats had 67% more take aways than anyone else in the league. When you look at the total package I think that an arugement can be made for these guys being right up there at the top. They may not have quite as many goals as a few other guys but they aren't responsible for the other team scoring near as many either. It is always said that defense wins championships and these two guys almost never miss a shift either on the offensive end or on the defensive end which is more than can be said for some of the guys that many consider higher on the list. Yzerman said that he became a better player after Bowman came and he began to focus on the two way nature of the game and I think that is visible in these guys as well.

No Lidstrom?

Any explanation as to my lack of class or does any opinion that is not yours classless? Its awesome the way you provide such meaningful insight before you attack someone. Now that is classy.

Read my post again, not once did I claim that I knew what Turco said nor did I guess or call him classless. In fact I like Turco - what I said was that the thread was discussing whether or not people thought he was classless or Ozzie was classy. I don't know what was said nor do I really care, what I care about is you griping about people who chose on a forum to speculate or opine about whatever they want especially when it directly relates to the last series and an interaction between the goalies.

Yeah but he wasn't out forever like Cleary was and didn't have his jaw wired shut or lose 20 or how many ever pounds it was, there was a huge difference in their injuries.

I'm so excited, I'm flying all the way from New Mexico to go to my first game at the Joe. I have hoped for years that some day I would get to go to a game at the Joe but never dreamed it would be a Stanley Cup game. I can't wait 10th row back in Section 109.

DET/PIT: 4-2 Thanks again for the game it has been great to play. :clap: