Doc Holiday

Because fighting is prevelant in the NHL and GMs believe that having one is important in some instances, whether it be entertainment or because the team is based on grit. They have plenty of their reasons. I never said that GMs think they are worthless, just that I do not see the importance in the big picture to an enforcer. GMs keeping them in the NHL doesn't make my point automatically incorrect. That is an argument from authority.

You are kidding right? A video is never going to scare some player into not making a hit that they aren't even thinking about anyways. Shelley didn't think about enforcers when he made that hit. Lappy didn't think about enforcers when he hit Lidstrom. Moore didn't think about enforcers when he hit Naslund (was it Naslund?). I mean you could consider that cheap hit momentum for the Sharks, because after the hit, the Sharks scored four straight goals. Four straight powerplay goals. Perhaps when people see video of that they will make a cheap hit then rely on their powerplay to win the game for them.

It's been three games. If we judged each player by their first couple games, Moen this year would be considered a better option than Hossa last year.

Is it just me or is goal scoring up this year? Nothing but high scoring games.

That isn't what I said. What I said was that the moderators obviously had a justifiable reason to delete the thread, and one person saying it isn't is probably not going to worry them much, if at all. I never said the mods were pricks or that they don't care for the welfare of the posters here. I am saying that they do care for the welfare of the posters which is why they deleted the thread, and you outright bashing them because you don't THINK they were doing it is not warranted, and the moderators aren't going to look at one another and shout "Oh god, what have I done!" because one person is going out on a tirade.

Great game between Philly and Washington. Goaltending sucked, but that's what you get in a 6-5 game.

Don't make me unleash my powerplay on you....

Once again, either talk to a mod about it or leave. I doubt they give a s*** that you think them deleting the poll was "unjustified".

You could always PM Matt, Jedi, or another mod with your concerns, instead of openly bashing them on here.

Cause, you know, we were all serious when we made those statements.

I'm sure it didn't. Don't worry about substantiating your emotion towards what I said. Just make the faces and continue on as if nothing happened....

And I would support May on the team 100% to do his job and f*** s*** up. Including players' faces. ESAD: Excellent retort.

Success in juniors isn't an indicator of how well you will do in the NHL. No one doubts that goons and enforcers can play the sport of hockey. We are talking about compared to NHL caliber players.

I think that Mayweather would be able to hold his own on skates, and considering his boxing background, he'd be the toughest enforcer in the NHL!

I think you guys overrate May's abilities. I really don't think he could play on any line except for the fourth, let alone the first line. Having one enforcer who plays 5 minutes a night on the fourth line is not the only form of intimidation, if you find that intimidating at all. Just because you sell out the rink doesn't mean you couldn't use more business. If you ask any businessman if he would want to take the chance at getting a larger amount of profit with a small amount of risk, very few would say "no thanks, I'm content with what I have."

Not what I said but thank you for playing. How does a fourth liner create space for a first liner? Does a fourth liner protect guys like Franzen from getting punched in the face too? Was Detroit intimindated last year when an enforcer wasn't even in the lineup? En route to a second seed in the playoffs and to game 7 of the stanley cup finals? With 7.4 million invested in a complete piece of garbage? You say I hinge my arguments on the deterrent factor, but that is essentially what the pro-enforcer crowd hinges their beliefs on. The "magical intimidation" powers that enforcers have. The "well they deter but not 100% of the time" and the maybes and hypotheticals to prove your point. At least I understand that Detroit's success and failure in the postseason hasn't hinged on enforcers, positively or negatively. Enforcers are entertaining, and make the fans happy if a cheapshot occurs and the victim is avenged. Sometimes they deter. Sometimes not. I am not going to lose sleep over them being in the lineup or if they aren't in the lineup, because I appreciate the sport of hockey. Hockey will be hockey whether there is fighting or not.

I am not arguing that an enforcer is "useless". I am arguing that an enforcer isn't a deterrent and that an enforcer isn't someone who is going to suddenly make a team tough and have fewer injuries and cheapshots during the season. Entertainment, preference, low salary, it doesn't matter. GMs aren't perfect, so all you are doing is making an argument from authority. Maltby and Draper are still playing. Chelios was on the team last year. Must mean that they had a very good reason to be there and Holland is doing all the right things, right?

I will agree that any player with fists that can take care of a guy like Ott is okay in my lineup.

The best team is the team that wins the cup at the end of the season. End of story. The beauty of winning the cup is the fact that it is the hardest trophy in sports to win. Pittsburgh earned it. They made their breaks, and Detroit didn't. End of ******* story.

When you consistently have an enforcer as a teammate, it makes sense not to throw that type of player under the bus. Matt Bradley-Washington Capitals after Brashear left Wayne Gretzky-His own autobiography Now I am not saying I agree that there shouldn't be fighting or tought guys in the league (in fact I enjoy fighting as much as any hockey fan). But just because this group of players believes they are protected doesn't mean that the entire NHL believes so. Some feel protected. Some feel influenced. Some don't. I'm sure some people feel nervous then going one on one with Zdeno Chara, but that doesn't mean that I would want him to defend my team over Nicklas Lidstrom in a one on one scenario.

I'll take the evidence over PC testimony.

I won't argue that a fight is an awesome thing to see, but I cannot understand how an enforcer "prevents" players from committing cheap shots. Cheap shots have been and are still in the game regardless of an enforcer being in the lineup.

So Downey's enforcing of Lappy was a success because only one of Detroit's franchise players was injured during that game?

Quite the romantic statement.

This is what happens when your team doesn't play for almost a week. People keep freaking out.