hokike

Bless Legace for that win...Obviously he did not forgot that once he was Reg Wing and felt he needs to return a favour...

you forgot one important aspect: Holland has promised to Lidström that nobody earns per year more than capt'n as long as Lidström is under contract. And yeah, Z-type contract in longterm is too risky for too many players, Holland does not want make "tampa bay mistakes" Conclusion: signing hossa is pipe dream. But as I have noticed, most of LGW seems to hope to some silly "kenny's magick"

keep that in mind that trading Flippula won't guarantee anything: it does not mean that Hossa will be signed. Trading Flippula for capspace would give to Holland more negotiating room and that is all.

[quote name='lets go pavel' date='January 31, 2009 - 07:46PM' post='1533473'] a) Hossa has made it plain that he wants to stay here, and if he's willing to come here for 1 year at 7 million why not more? PR talk and reality are two different things. He was willing ONLY to take 7.4 for one year because of: SC possibility and that is it. b) That isn't the point ... Z may earn 7.5 through the first 8 years, but his cap hit is only 6. This is the number that matters, and theoretically we could structure our other contracts similarly. My point was that Z was not willing to take bigger discount actually than Lidström did. to bring cap hit down Holland had no choice than add 4 "cheap years" c) 10% of what? He's a RESTRICTED FREE AGENT. He's not on the open market, so his open market value doesn't really apply. Yes it does . When you try to force player to take significantly less than open market, "because of you are only RFA", what kind of message it would send? If Hudler really takes some discount then contract won't be longer than 2-3 yrs, IMO and theoretically we could structure our other contracts similarly. I'm not capologist but it is sure that rules and league have something to say about such structures. Maybe you can form one contract per team in similar way or something like that.

a)Hossa's 7 mil is huge exception, only because of 1. one year deal. 2. win cup -good chance. And we can be pretty sure that somebody offers to Hossa 90 mil again in open market. b) de facto Zetterberg still earns 7.5 per year through 8 yrs. I do not expect him to play more, so he will get 4yr for nothing after retiring . c) don' t expect still Hudler to take more than 10% hometown disount ( if even this) d) "savings" from Zetterberg and Lidström help to sign Franzen and Hudler but not Hossa.

For thos who propose "add D, add goalie", get real: RW has not cap room even for signing their current players... Hossa is not going for 7 mil per y contract, he wants much more. Franzen is worth 5 and hudler 4 mil at open market. Lets talk about hometown discounts: Lidström 1 mil, Zetterberg 1.5 at best. They still got 7-8 mil per y, so ther discount was approximately 15%. 15% discounts from Franzen and Hudler won't help keep Hossa and asking bigger sacrifices from Franzen and Hudler and Hossa than Lidström and Zetterberg commited -15% - would be REAL LOW BLOW from Holland and as a player I'd leave from team IMMEDIATELY. Face it - players are ready to sacrifice but no more than 10-15%.And Holland, I can bet, knows it very well.

Read all this stuff and for me conclusion is obvious: excitement is down. There is no young soon to be SidneyCrosby's as Datsyk and Zetterberg were couple of seasons ago. D&Z were young and exotic and promising players some time ago- reason for excitement. Now they look like seasoned vets and "it has become all the same" . being young and promising creates excitement and thats the reason why Yzerman created lots of "bandwagon jumping". And I do not think that Helm or Abdelkader or actually anybody from Grand Rapids is able to create "bigger storm".

Cap space in todays NHL, especially when it is rumored that cap space goes down, very valuable asset and therefore you have to offer for cap space something more than one struggling player with expensive and expansive contract . Your pointed discussion became quickly my rotten tomatoes for your rotten apples.

my typo. Idea behind this was potential cup wiil increas Hossa's value or if he does not get SC, he'll get that 90 mil offer anyway. ....And even some forumites here admit that Flippula has no value, compared to his contract and , yes therefore is practically untradeable.... Why other team would want such deal to roster? Lets start with this question.... therefore I'm calling "trade Flippula" wishful thinking...

1.You at least admit that this all is happening is mere speculation. Good. The fact that Finger was well paid does not mean that trade with Flippula is likely. You're drawing absolutely not connected "conclusions". What I'd like to see is: how good is chance to get Flippula traded?( almost zero chance b/c of longterm extensive contract, IMO) And ppl are already discussing potential draft picks from Flippula trade... :huh: :huh: 2. Lidström took "hometown discount" b/c of he had earned pre salary cap era more than enough and still his "discount" was no more than a million Datsyk signing was sort of gamble b/c of his previos PO performances were huge dissapontments and I'll remember clearly that many forumites considered that deal to be "too risky and way too expensive". Datsyk did not take "hometown discount" Zetterberg actually did not take any discount: from 12 yrs he probably does not play more than 8 (even less is more likely) and remaining 4 ( probably more) years will cover up nicely "discount" from "playing years"( and even after retiring his contract will count vs cap). As in case of Flippula instead of posts like "oh, plz, kenny make magic happen, oh plz, Hossa take "hometown discount" ask yourselves: What does it "Kenny's magic" mean in real NHL and more importantly, isn't that "hometown discount" merely a myth? ( IMO it is - this discount isn't actually so big as perceived ) Keep also in mind that maybe Datsyk and Zetterberg own to Red Wings a little ( b/c of they were picked up from 200-ish draft spot and given a chance to play) but Hossa DOES NOT OWN TO RED WINGS ANYTHING - HE ALREADY TOOK DISCOUNT FOR ONE YEAR.

expect similar dealls from other GMs longterm , front loaded but "merely fillers " at the end just to reduce cap hit. And for those who wish to sign hossa and trade flippula: I understand homerism but this exceeds my tolerance. I'm polite GET REAL!!!! Nobody wants Flippula nd there is no room for Hossa. And Hossa already had before the season 90 mil offer and after this season ther will be more lucrative offers, I'm sure. AND PLEASE STOP MASTURBATING THAT MAYBE HOSSA WILL TAKE "HOMETOWN DISCOUNT". DETRIOT IS NOT "HOMETOWN" FOR HOSSA AND WILL NOT EVER BE!!!!

Hossa and his agent ain't stupid - he turned down before the season 90mil $ offer from Vancouver ( IIRC) just to win cup with red wings. Potential cup in the future would mean even more lucrative offer and even if Hossa does not win cup this year - somebody will offer 90mil$-like deal anyway( and hossa is already playing better than he did it in pittsburgh)

take those long terms as insurance money - when player retires earlier than contract end he still gets his money but it does not count vs cap. And Zetterberg's playing style affords him to play 'til 40ies anyway. Hudler and Franzen next! ( For Hossa is no room but it was already clear, but we should be thankful that Hossa wanted to be for one year "cheap rental")

Playoffs are more important for Red wings anyway than one or two reg season games. saga is over. Move on.

sry, but once again LGW forum proved that average IQ is here pretty low. Do you think, players get their huge sums just for playing - no - advertising is actually very big part and there is no better place for players to "earn" their salaries than ASG event. Consider this - both Datsyk and Lidström refuse to show up for fans and you're hurry to protect them, and in other thread same protectors are so angry toward NHL:why Bettman does not try attract fans and popularity. Is there bigger hypocricy than this ? Man, some here are so dumb here that they see Bettman everywhere, but Bettman works for owners and owners pay for this stuff. I'm offensive for obvious reasons.

....and profighters answer will be like: but I want fights 'cuz of reg season is so annoying, I want fight 'cuz of life sucks!!! But why Ken Holland should care of "profighters" personal problems?

Ottawa or any other tema don't want our "kopeckys-lebdas" for picks or salary cap relief or whatever. Why ? Because of teams need salary relief and picks, they are not giving away those for overpayed/ underperforming Red Wings playes. I hope this thing is clear

Franzen contract's numbers have nothing to with Flippula. Those who wish to keep/get players cheaply are wishful thinkers. players don't have to sign here cheaply and if they decide that they'll get something better from other teams, it does not mean they are "greedy" or "do not value loyalty" or just "******* to whom money is over cup" or whatever label they would get from full of themselves LGW idiots.

howimportant is ASG from player's perspective? Fan's, marketing perspective has discussed ad nauseaum... In NBA has almost every year complaints "oh why I wasn't there" and has been situations where injured but voted in star refuses to give away his spot, at the same time knowing that he won't be playing anyway. Obviously, in NBA is ASG for players important, but in NHL? I've been under impression that players in NHL don't care, not much.

I donno what's the reason of panick here. fans vote only 12 of 40something to roster. "our" stars will be in anyway. This forum is sometimes so childish.

I still don't get it - what is the obsession with minor leaguers? Do you really think that some "fighters" ( Mac tussled but it did not change anything) or some role 4th liners from GR can change anything? GR goalies are here as backups, Conclin starts. Calm down.

god thanks that Holland is Red Wings GM not hysterical LGWers.

nobody wants your struggling players, idiot I'm so offensive because of I'm tired to see trade proposals: our suckers for MVP. But I hope you were sarcastic, really....

@yankeebaddabbing in addition to your post I can add a comment from Hossa who admires how nobody is panicking in Detriot bench in crucial situations. Everyone throws "A" game vs Red Wings but champs respond usually with "C" game and still win. Opponents feel very humiliated, thats for sure.