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  1. Chelios after 3 games played....

    Hes no better than he was in the Dallas series, where he got benched for being mediocre. I mean hes 46 and its a great story but if we werent up against the cap, Quincey, Kindl or Ericsson would be playing ahead of Chelios. I can't see him making it to 50, at least not on this team.
  2. Franzen or Hossa?

    Not at all really, although I do agree that Lidstrom is declining. And when your game is 100% positionally based, you can't get slower or you'll get caught. My argument isn't about Norris trophies or whether or not hes the best defenseman in the league, its about the percieved importance of him to this team. Does he play a key role? Yes. Will this team fail, or even misstep the day he retires? Doubtful I would argue that both Zetterberg and Datsyuk are more important to this team than Lidstrom. Lids does rack up the assists but he hardly scores like Mike Green. We can find a suitable replacement to play the point on the power play(Not Rafalski) that can take wrist shots and slappers knee high so Homer can tip them. Bouwmeester would be a perfect replacement.
  3. Franzen or Hossa?

    Ok, lets just say both Z and Hossa leave for greener pastures. Homer-Dats-Hudler Franzen-Flip-Leino Cleary-Helm-Samuelsson Maltby-Draper-Kopecky Lidstrom-Rafalski Stuart-Kronwall Lilja-Lebda/Meech Conklin Osgood Howard would be signed to an offersheet, id take the picks. Thats just assuming no one is signed to replace either player. The cap savings would be around $9 million. If I were Wings management I would seriously think of poaching various restricted free agents from teams close to the cap. That is of course after signing Hudler. I would also seriously consider Bouwmeester, even if Lidstrom doesn't retire. That than opens up the possibility of trading Rafalski. Kari Lehtonen will also be a free agent and both Kessel and Krecji will be RFA's who will get much bigger deals. The Bruins can't afford Begeron, Kessel and Krecji together. Theres various ways to spend the money more productively. Or just trade Flip, keep Zetterberg and Frazen
  4. Franzen or Hossa?

    The captains role is to lead but if you're debunking the points argument than why is Lidstrom fit to be captain? He doesn't fight, hes not really vocal and honestly hes no Steve Yzerman. Comparing Yzerman vs Datsyuk vs Zetterberg is flawed. Its Lidstrom vs Datsyuk vs Zetterberg and when I see that, I see three of the same kind of players. One just happens to score a little more frequently. Your opinion about Zetterberg being better defensively is fine but the sports writers decided otherwise.
  5. Franzen or Hossa?

    We're discussing "Future captains" the concept of anyone but Lidstrom being captain is laughable. The discussion is Datsyuk vs Zetterberg and what makes a good captain. So far, the only thing in Zetterberg's favor is... 1. His beard 2. His chick 3. And the unknown intangibles, that don't include "Leading by example", playing hurt or clutch scoring. So I guess he rescues baby kittens from trees, its really the only answer.
  6. Franzen or Hossa?

    "Best captain ever" is debatable but i'll give in just to end that argument. The legend of Steve Yzerman is being a clutch player, even while injured. He didn't consistently lead the team in scoring because unlike today, in the post cap world, we could pay Yzerman eight million to be a shutdown centerman. We had Shanahan, Kozlov, Fedorov, Larionov and Hull. Yzerman didn't NEED to score because that wasn't his role. On the other hand, Datsyuk and Zetterberg's role is just like Yzerman's (Shut down center) but they're also expected to be point per game players.
  7. Franzen or Hossa?

    Datsyuk and Zetterberg didn't play together in 05-06 and the first half of 06-07. The second half of 06-07 is where Zetterberg caught fire, playing with Datsyuk and Homer and the line remained together for the season and a half. They haven't "Always" played together so the sample size is a little bigger than you may think. And if you recall, which im sure you don't, Datsyuk scored 87 points in 05-06 playing on a line with Shanahan and Draper. It was terrible, it had no chemistry and he still lead the team in scoring.
  8. Franzen or Hossa?

    The cap is DECRESING, its a fact not fiction. Its going to decrease to $56 million and than moreso after that. Any argument about inflation or different cap totals is ridiculos. Relatively, the cap will be 10% higher at best between the season Datsyuk's deal took effect and when Zetterberg's will. And Hossa turned down $100 million to sign with this team. Hes leading the team in goals. Even if he decides he wants to cash in there are other players out there who are becoming free agents and restricted free agents that will take less than Pavel and will fit just as well as Zetterberg. You're seriously underestimating the Zetterberg hype and upper hand he holds in the negotiating process. He scored 90 points, got nominated for a Selke and won the Conn Smyth. Anything short of an MVP, he could be the highest paid player in the league. Which is fine, theres plenty of teams out there willing to pay the price but my point is that hes not better than Datsyuk, a guy who will make considerably less, in a comparable cap setting.
  9. Franzen or Hossa?

    Ive watched every Wings game since 1996. But if the standard is in fact Yzerman, how does Zetterberg compare, if at all to Stevie Y? If media reports are correct, Datsyuk played in the 06 Edmonton series when he couldn't even walk on one leg. And if we're discussing clutch, who was it that scored the final two goals in game six of the Anahiem series in 2007? In an attempt to tie the game and keep the series going Dats, scored both goals in the final ten minutes.
  10. Franzen or Hossa?

    Id be willing to bet that those "Intangibles" are the same that led the Wings brass to giving Datsyuk a seven year deal. In other words, you have no specific example of why Z is better fit, you're just using three year old quotes from Wings upper management for your case. The only thing holding Datsyuk back before was not showing up in the playoffs and now hes silenced his critics. What else could he possibly do to qualify for being captain? The Dr. Ramani commercial should be enough.
  11. Franzen or Hossa?

    Less than Zetterberg, yes. Which allows us to sign a guy like Hudler or Frazen. Before the playoffs and even after I wasn't sold on Frazen but this season its obvious. His shot is insane, as long as the Wings make it clear that he needs to improve his skating somewhat, I see no reason to not give him a long contract. Losing Zetterberg sucks but hes an eight rounder, developed for nothing and cost nothing to acquire. Its the cap world and we wouldn't lose Zetterberg for nothing, we would gain $8-$10 million in cap space. Maybe the Wings win the cup this season and Lidstrom feels the need to retire? That extra cash allows the Wings to sign a guy like Bouwmeester or go after Kovalchuk, both of whom will get less than Z as a free agent.
  12. Future Wings

    Whats your point? His game isn't about world class skating. Hes a fourth liner, who excels playing with Datsyuk and on the PP. Hes a specialist of sorts and with the new rules he doesn't take as much "Abuse" as before. The only thing going against him is the fact that he stands in front of 90+ mph slapshots on game by game basis. If he can avoid getting hit in the face, theres no limit to his playing career.
  13. Franzen or Hossa?

    What cannot be observed on the television? Work ethic? Locker room presence? Getting along with teammates? Datsyuk isn't Terrell Owens, he isn't a locker room cancer that the Wings keep around because he produces. You're dealing vagaries because you have no argument. Its a very simple question, what does Zetterberg have that Datsyuk does not?
  14. Franzen or Hossa?

    I never said Lidstrom's ability was overrated. His worth to the team is. Like I said, hes so consistent that life without him seems impossible, when in fact we saw a glimpse of it last night and really, it wasn't all too terrible. Post lockout, people thought the Wings would have trouble making the playoffs without the likes of Yzerman, Shanahan and Fedorov and nothing changed. The same will hold true with Lidstrom. The collective talent of this team is more important than anyone player, including Nick.
  15. Franzen or Hossa?

    Z has said he wants to finish his career in Detroit. Hes the reigning Conn Smythe Winner and the last time that happened in a contract year, Brad Richards got an insane contract. Coupled with the fact that Z has in fact been underpaid, its the worst of all situations from a business perspective. Does it really make sense to give Zetterberg a ten year deal? Making $2 million more than the team scoring leader? Or the ungodly Nick Lidstrom? I appreciate Z for what he is. A good center but he needs to be paired with certain players to succeed. And if you want a repeat of the last season and a half, he needs to be paired with Datsyuk. On the other hand Datsyuk can be paired with anyone and finish with 85 or more points. In my eyes, when you have Flip making three million per season on the third line and hes shown he can center the 2nd line, its an obvious choice of Franzen + Hossa over Zetterberg. Datsyuk is wasted playing LW, even if it looks good, hes too good of a faceoff man to be playing wing.