StevieY'sguy

I'm not wrong, I'm saying that no current hockey player is transcending hockey, showing up on a sports show that is primarily about other sports isn't transcending...call me when he's hosting Saturday Night Live or is a presenter at the MTV Music awards or is getting interviewed by Barbara Walters on 20/20 or making public appearances of this magnitude on a regular basis. That is transcending, being talked about on two programs run on a sports network that don't usually mention hockey is nice, but not transcendent.....the points you are arguing is mainly that Ovechkin should be the face of the NHL because you think he has the potential to transcend hockey, which very may be true, but the fact of the matter is that he is not currently transcending hockey By, the way the reason no Wings are mentioned during Lions games is because all of the Lions games are blacked out these days lol

It's about time somebody brought up this point, so thank you for the post.....some of these knuckleheads act like Bettman gets to run the NHL like he owns it....it's either ignorance of the way things really are or just general stupidity....It's just like all those folks who say last year's Cup Finals were moved up 4 or 5 days by Bettman to "help out" Pittsburgh..wake up and read a newspaper people, that was NBC's decision because they didn't want the Finals to interfere with "sweeps week" because the NHL isn't a ratings darling and that's the whole point of sweeps week.

The Skins were horrific this year and a pain to watch and they play in Washington so it's no surprise that they would take about the only legit sports star that the city has which also explains the sale of the jerseys..there simply isn't any other star power in any sport in the DC area, the next closest thing to Ovie in DC is a guy who pulled a gun on a teammate (Gilbert Arenas) who would want the jersey of a thug??..likewise PTI is a show about guys who as you said, know nothing about hockey they're just journalists for.....the Washington Post so whenever hockey comes up of course the extent of their small hockey knowledge is going to be limited mostly to the star in their town so who do you think they're going to talk about? As far as IMG saying that he transcends hockey, of course they're gonna say that..they didn't become a large sports marketing firm without knowing how to pump up their own clients...that would be like the mayor of Cole Harbour, Nova Scotia (Crosby's hometown) saying something outrageous like Crosby is Canada's greatest natural resource, it's a complement of the highest regard sure, but when you consider the overly biased source it's obviously not an objective opinion and therefore doesn't hold very much weight.

But if Crosby did those same moves to say Ovie as retribution for Ovie's cheap hit that hurt Gonchar's knee last playoffs this site would be littered with moron's screaming that it validated Crosby as a dirty player

Ovechkin transcends hockey?? Gimme a break dude, nobody transcends hockey right now and while you've brought him up I suppose you think that Crosby is cockier than Ovechkin is too don't ya?

I see where you are coming from but I just don't seeing it as being as bad as you make it out to be. You point out that Canada went 50 years between gold medals, but during that same 50 year period the U.S. won 2 gold medals and 4 silver medals while Canada took home 3 silver and 2 bronze so it's not like the 2 North American teams were getting blown out of the water, on the contrary they were actually quite competitive. Also the U.S.S.R. who won 7 golds, a silver and a bronze during the 50 year span has obviously disbanded and splintered into many countries thus eliminating the threat of such a "super country" being in the tournament. Not to mention the fact that the players who lived in what used to be the old Soviet Union are now allowed to enter the NHL with no iron curtain holding them back and the cream of the crop do...likewise is true with Sweden, Finland,etc. I mean the KHL is there but aside from the washed up former stars like Jagr and the occasional NHL transfer like Hudler, it is nothing more than a glorified AHL....I'm not saying Canada and the U.S. would be medal game favorites every Olympics but I do think you may be overestimating the non-NHL talent remaining that would be eligible "across the pond"

Well when you have a great team like the Wings had last year, are playing an opponent that you beat in the Finals the previous year, only to watch their roster get weaker and yours get stronger (Hossa factor), have a 3-2 lead in a series, are the favorite to win, AND have game 7 on home ice and fail to succeed?....yes that is absolutely choking.

I'm an avid hockey fan and that doesn't ring a bell to me so if that is true it obviously wasn't a big deal as not only did it fail to make headlines but he also was named team captain after his rookie year.....

I'm kind of on the fence on this one, it helps expose the game i guess although I'm sure the increased ratings are just due to the worldwide broadcasts that the Olympics provide...I don't know if I am sold on the idea that there are that many people who just up and start following the NHL after the Olympics if they hadn't been previously...Also I think there is a small possibility that giving exposure to young American college kids could cause a few people to follow their careers all the way up through the ranks if they make a name for themselves for the tournament. This could lead to a growth in interest in NCAA hockey which would be a boon for the larger schools such as Penn State (among others) who are contemplating adding a D1 program...if all of this came to fruition it could certainly raise the NHL's profile among the casual American sports fan who now may be paying attention to their favorite college's newborn hockey programs and it's players careers through the ranks.

I'm not sure how Thornton has gotten dragged into this..he has never had any notable incidents behavior-wise (at least to my knowledge) The biggest problem I have is that people take a slash here or there (what hockey player doesn't now and then) and complaining to the ref and turn those on-ice actions into some sort of thesis of how Crosby is such a bad guy off of the ice. As far as the on-ice actions go and comparable to our "innocent" Wings both of past and present I will just defer to Gordie Sid & Ted's post because he nailed it on the head. You mentioned Shawn Avery who has a remarkable pattern of ******* remarks and behavior including the "sloppy seconds" comment and calling one of the greatest goaltenders of all time "fatso". Ovechkin has been brought up by others as well in this thread and the dirty hits and suspension nonwithstanding, I wouldn't term this type of behavior classy either: http://voices.washingtonpost.com/capitalsi...hes-malkin.html Crosby has not once done one thing off of the ice that comes close to the blatantly disrespectful and assholish behavior as these two guys so it is foolish to imply he's such a bad character off of the ice and to even think to lump him in with players who have done heinous things such as this.

How many times have those guys faced us/beat us in the Stanley Cup Finals again? Oh that's right...NONE hmm maybe that has something to do with it....

Yea I have a hard time seeing how they could give it to anyone other than Howard...Colorado's revival has been a nice story and Duchene is turning into a hell of a player but between the uprising of Craig Anderson and the plethora of other young guys helping out (Yip, O'Reilly namely) it's certainly not Duchene doing it all by himself...It should be Howard's to lose in my opinion, hopefully the powers that be see it the same way.

Haha i gotta tell ya zack although we do not agree at all on this subject it's nice to see somebody so passionate about hockey that they would go through the trouble of arguing back and forth at the length that we have....I'll lay down my keyboard because neither one of us is going to give an inch on this issue...but i'll leave you with something I think we can both agree on...Go Wings! lol

As I have stated before on the thread bearing his name, i would be extremely wary of bringing Smith up to the AHL for 2 reasons 1. because he has holes in his defensive game that are already exposed at the college level and if they are exposed there, they will only be worse in the AHL..and 2. I follow college hockey pretty closely and in most cases the players who end up leaving school early don't progress to the NHL any faster than players who fulfill their NCAA eligibility...Smith should stay in college another year.

No...not at all really, I don't know where you come off saying that I'm complaining about overanalysis...I was just explaining that Crosby didn't do anything of behavioral significance to become the "face" of the league, it wasn't of his choosing, he didn't fill out an application, it was just a circumstantial effect of being the best young hockey player to come out of North America in a long time. Secondly as you basically pointed out, forums like these are the essence of overanalysis, so if i was so "against" overanalysis i wouldn't be here would I?? Lastly, even if i was against overanalysis I couldn't be critical of the majority of the posters on here and their opinion on Crosby because the things they are writing can't be considered analysis, it is mainly just jealousy/garbage/etc., much of it stemming from the fact that the Wings have faced off against Crosby's team the last 2 years and they hate how successful he has been at an early age (and also, i would suspect because the Wings have no one like him). If people say they don't like Crosby because they say he talks to the refs too much or they think he is overexposed then so be it, I don't share the same view but i can respect a profanity free comment like that....but for the idiots who just sit back and call Crosby a p*ssy, b*tch, cheap shot artist, etc. then I'm sorry but you're only making yourself look like an uneducated moron just like this Dubinsky hack...I hope this nobody enjoyed his 15 seconds of fame that his mouth got him because if he's relying on his hockey skills to get him attention than he's outta luck.

Show me the clip where an 18 year old Crosby ever campaigned himself to be the face of the league, cuz if it exists i sure haven't seen it. The kid grew up an amazing hockey player and in today's day and age (for better or worse) that comes with overly excessive hype. The guy worked his whole life to get into the NHL, he does so and is one of the best young talents to enter the league in years...meanwhile a down league looking for a player to build it's image around for the next decade or so basically had to choose between a politically correct, baby faced North American born kid or a scruffy, slobby looking Russian born player who was missing teeth and has an extremely flamboyant, "wildcard" attitude and lifestyle..naturally they went with the safe bet in Crosby...what was Crosby supposed to do?? Tell Bettman he didn't want to be on all of those posters and commercials because people like you might accuse the league of being biased if he someday ever won a Cup?? No one in their right mind would say no to that...including a player like Kirk Maltby who was never half of the player that Crosby already is.

O.J. Simpson didn't murder those people when he was playing for the Buffalo Bills either but i doubt they'll be giving him a citizenship award for his time there anytime soon. I like how you show zero support or explanation of how Maltby is "different".... He's "nowhere near Crosby's style of play"? this is getting to be ridiculously overboard, if you want to talk about superstars that play cheap hockey then talk about Ovechkin he is the one who has delivered knees and other cheap hits that have made other players miss time, Crosby hasn't. As far as the league not being fair, maybe it is, maybe it isn't but alot of things in life aren't fair so I'm not going to let whining about it ruin my objective view of hockey...all I'm saying is if they Wings could have shut down MAX TALBOT in game 7 last June then they would've hoisted the Cup again even amidst all of these "biased factors" or whatever you like to cal them....but the bottom line is they couldn't and they didn't so let's move on

Oh we don't have players like that?? Kirk Maltby (when he actually played more that 6-7 minutes a game) was renowned around the league for cheap shotting people, whining and running his mouth but refusing to drop the gloves..he was the essence of a coward but because he plays for the Red Wings, it's filed under something other than that right? Yea you're right the Wings are all role models, no dirty players whatsoever...ask Steve Moore what his opinion is of Todd Bertuzzi, you'll be able to find him at home, cuz he sure as hell isn't playing hockey anymore thanks to one of our "role model" Red Wings....I'm not going to get into a full on debate with you because judging by your profanity-laced post your probably rather low on the sophistication scale and will just start making up more nonsensical excuses and barbaric comments...I'm a Red Wings fan too but the only difference between us is that i can admit that my team CHOKED when they had an oppurtunity to win another Cup and you can't; end of story.

Yea it's ridiculous...and as i have said so many times before i have a hard time seeing Wings fans being so complimentary of Ovie if he was the one we faced in the Finals two years in a row.

I'm gonna pick this apart piece by piece....you are exactly right saying "he is what he is", he is a 22 year old who has won an MVP, Pearson, and Art Ross trophies along with being the youngest captain ever to win the Stanley Cup. Second of all, the league didn't "steal" a Cup from us..say what you want about the officiating and the changing of the start of the series, injuries, the lights being too bright in Pittsburgh's arena, the pucks not being black enough, and all of those other excuses that makes you feel better, the bottom line is we had game 7 on our home ice, win one game and we have the Cup...we didn't get it done period, end of story. Besides any team that goes on the road to win 2 game 7s against their 2 toughest opponents during the Stanley Cup Playoffs has proved their worth as a champion. Finally, i don't see where you get off mocking Crosby as a role model.. was Crosby the hockey player who while drunk punched a cab driver in the face over 20 cents? (Kane) was it Crosby who was linked last year with drug-trafficking and the mob? (Hamrlik and the Kostitsyns) Was it Crosby who tried to hire a hit man to kill a friend of his? (Mike Danton) was it Crosby who plead guilty to running an illegal sports gambling ring? (Rick Tocchet) Was it Crosby who let drugs and alcohol run his life into ground including bankruptcy? ( McCarty) Was it Crosby who sucker punched a player seriously injuring him and ruining his hockey career? ( Bertuzzi) Has Crosby been arrested for drinking and driving? ( Federov and Chelios, among others)...no it wasn't. You say he's a complainer and that may be true but keep in mind he's only 22...how many people are fully mature at that age?? You can dislike him all you want because you don't like the way he plays hockey but implying he isn't a good role model makes you look foolish especially considering some of the riff-raff that goes on with other NHL players. Call me crazy but if i had a child whose role model was a guy whose most controversial action was a missed handshake after a hockey game, I think i could live with that.

This is very true but the most amazing thing (to me at least) about Gretzky's stats aren't the actual numbers themselves but the margin by which he was ahead of everyone else playing the game.

Sorry, I've seen it before a bunch of times and 99 times out of 100 staying in college as long as possible is the right choice...there's no sense in rushing him and having him lose confidence, he'd be best served by giving the longest time available to develop.

Agreed Ovechkin is nothing more than a cocky slob with A.D.D.

Sorry about that, looking back on it i came off as a total jacka** in that response lol but yea I'm by no means saying that we shouldn't be excited...just that he has alot of game to improve on from a defensive perspective, and I'm willing to bet that Kenny Holland (who probably has more hockey knowledge in his left pinky than i ever will) identified these lapses and figures they can be corrected or else he wouldn't have drafted him where he did....but yes there is certainly no mistaking his offensive talent!

You're apparently a college hockey novice (there isn't a Big Ten conference in college hockey, Wisconsin is in the WCHA and Michigan is in the CCHA), and i doubt you've watched much more college hockey this season other than that outdoor game, because Brendan Smith is known around college hockey as much for his defensive lapses and sometimes head-scratching decision making as he is for his offensive prowess. The only reason his plus minus is +14 is because he is on such a good team (They've been in the top 5 all year long) and when you get right down to it, considering he has put up over a point a game his plus minus should much higher since his team only gives up about 2.3 points a game...I figured somebody would watch him net 2 and get all googly-eyed but these are the facts folks...