Opie

Cicada I wouldn't personally call 2g 11a 13pts in 18 games stellar, he was decent in he stay with the Caps, I still contend had his stick blade been on the ice where it should have been there season is at least a few minutes longer! Not saying that should show up in his salary but he wasn't an all world player for the caps he was probably their 5th best player.

In this deal is Feds overpaid, yes, HOWEVER in this free agent season Hossa (Stuart) is about the only player who wasn't overpaid. He could have been one of the overpaid and taken the 90 mil from EDM, but as it stands this offseason all players (except one or two ) were overpaid. So based on just this offseason alone Feds Payment is a steal compared to Fingers at 3.75 or some of the other numbers that were thrown around this offseason!

The other part to that is that the team that wins ends up playing about 2 months of extra hockey, that is two months of healing time lost, 2 months of offseason workouts lost (due to the fact that your rest and recovery time is pushed back) then you spend the your summer going to parties, you listen to everyone tell you how great you are, these are the things that make up the Champion's hangover, this is probably the main reason Hossa will impact this team, he has a very very strong desire to win. He is not a 3 year guy, he is a vet, therefore players will listen to him, and he will hopefully be the tylenol to Detroits Cup hangover!

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writ...ex.html?eref=T1 Good article about Players being able to get what they want, and not having to choose the offer they like best, but can choose to do what they like and in some cases (Hossa) they can lead the negotiations instead of waiting for the team to offer them something!

Whom do the ducks have that is a top 10 center in the league? And who makes up the best shut down line in hockey?

ahahahahahahahahahaha great answer Stevie

Oh, I have a bad feeling about how this will turn out long run, but I saw the news and thought I would share.

Did he un-retire it or is it retired and just not in the rafters? I can't remember!

Yet the Ducks with less offense and who are in desperate need of getting rid of their #3 d-man, who were owned by the stars last year some how have a better chance to beat the wings? Nevermind I get it, because the Ducks are NA heavy and hit and fight and play a scrappy game they have the better chance. It has absolutely nothing to do with who is the better team you just think that the Ducks style of play would be better to beat up the wings and win a series as opposed to a team beating them with actual skill. So you are back to buying into the theory that the best way to beat the wings is to beat them up. The Ducks will be very very lucky to make the playoffs this year so the odds of them facing either Det, SJ, or Dallas in a series is very very likely. Det SJ Cal (some one from that division has to be in the top 3) Dal Chi Min Ana Nas is how I see the top 8 filling out, but that is just a guess, with no offense and a great d that is soon to be weakened. Not to mention everyone knows Burke is in salary cap hell, and no one will want to help out when they can wait and get him for free, you know sort of like Bryz last year. If this team has an injury to one of its top 4 dmen or top 3 forwards they will be in a deep deep hole, they have 6 dmen right now, and need to get rid of one.

You were once sour, some one made you sweet and then you were retarted!!!!

RE Bolded part: If I am retarded by that logic you are even more so retarded as Dallas just beat Ana last year, and Dallas beat SJ! And When ANA beat Det they had the following players on their roster that are no longer or were replaced by far inferior players: Penner Teemu MacDonald 3 of their top 5 players from the year they beat the Wings. Your own logic in fact defeats what you are saying. Plus Doug Weight is gone, Bert gone and even though he was a downgrade to Penner he put up 40 points that no is going to replace. SJ some how got worse, yet ANA didn't?????? 4 of Dal's top 6 are top forward on ANA, 3 of SJ are top forward on ANA, so how in the hell will they be beaten by the Ducks. Because 2 years ago the Ducks beat the wings this year they have a better chance than a team that dismantled them in the playoffs this past season, not two years ago but last year!!!! LAST YEAR (NOT 2 SEASON AGO) THE DUCKS LOST TO THE STARS!!!! Do you happen to know why, because they couldn't score, and when the stars beat the ducks they had a less than healthy Zubov. I pointed out already who SJ added to their team, and regardless they are better than what ANA added to their roster. SJ has the better goaltender, has the better offense and has a top 10 at best D. But if the two teams played in a 7 game series SJ can score 2-3 goals a game against a very good d, while the Duck will be lucky to score 2 goals on a better than average D. Corey Perry will not carry this team they way Teemu could have, and in order to fit Teemu they will have to weaken their impressive D to fit the O.

Been there done that look for the old thread on this, and if you read his whole quote he was very complimentary of the wings org!

Avery, as much as I dislike the guy, is a decent addition, the only problem is can he fit in in the lockerroom!

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/stor...&id=3476586

Apparently by signing the best available UFA's in the position you need! Go figure, go after the best available player where you think you have a weakness, what is holland thinking?

Hopefully this is better for you! BTW your entire first post I replied to: I wasn't talking about the wings beating them I was talking about you saying they have the best shot from the west (which I assumed to mean at beating the wings compared to other teams not they were the favorite), therefore the part about the wings beating them is moot, hence why I didn't mention anything about the wings beating the ducks in my post! What was so wrong with my metaphor saying they are the Bolts in reverse, they have all D no O, the Bolts have all O no D? He would need to shut out the opponent or have a GAA that was unheard of in this era with that offense! Of course they would be fourth or fifth on this team, Detroit has 3 of the top 10 maybe 15 forwards in the game, that is like saying Neids or Pronger or Phanuef would be the second best D man in Detroit, no s***! Turco is shaky goaltending? Yet Jiggy is rock solid? Sharks got worse, let me see they off loaded a offensive defenseman who is overrated and overpaid and got Blake, solid d-man not all star anymore but solid and Boyle who is a decent top 4 dman just not the #1 that they tried to make him in Tampa. So the sharks only have Joe T in your opinion, what does Ana have the even comes remotely close to Joe Thornton's jock strap? Dallas has a very good D, Zubov will be healthy which is huge for them, they added Avery, they still have Modano who is better than anything the Ducks have, they have Morrow, Avery and Richards way more than what the Ducks have, even if I can't stand Avery he is the equivalent to Perry skill wise, btw the Ducks now best forward. Morrison is nothing but a shadow of his former self. Lets see the Stars and sharks have made improvements since the Playoffs, while the Ducks have lost players, who won more games last year, who went further in the playoffs? Weren't the Ducks super gritty last year and with more offensive players than this year, yet some how with all of these player loses they are going to be better than last year?

Are you high? The no offense having Ducks have the best shot from the west? What is with the Duck nut sucking, just because they beat the wings 2 season ago doesn't mean they are still that good. Their D is top 3 in the league, their offense is probably bottom 5 at least bottom 10 in the league. How about the Stars or Sharks. People get caught up with the Ducks NA fighting scrappy players because the Wings don't have that type of players or in the they beat us once they have to be great, no one beats the Wings and then isn't great. They are the anti Lightning, they spent everything on D nothing up front. We had this discussion last off season, will they make the playoffs sure, will they win their division, doubt it. Yes the saying is Defense wins Championships but while the bolts will be using the mantra we will score 6 lets keep them to under 7, the Ducks will be we might score one we will shut all the other teams out!!! Why did they not repeat last year, well lets see they let the number 2 offensive player on their team walk for the same amount of money they offered Bert, a washed up power forward, when they could have spent the money on Penner an up and coming power forward, they lose MacDonald, their 4th best offensive player from the year before. Now they are not even able to afford Teemu if he wanted to come back, their top offensive producer for the past what 4-5 years. Odds are Schneider is gone, that would be their best Defenseman, in terms of offense, from last year. Yet some how

Can I ask what liberties were taken last year on Red Wings players. I will not argue that fights are entertaining, I will not argue that Lids got hit hard, clean but hard, and Downey stepping in was a boost in energy. However I will go back and find posts from last year where some of you, not naming names, and I had a discussion in which you guys were claiming it(fighting/enforcing) was necessary to winning. Now you are starting to take the argument that it is entertaining and that is why you like it, well fine that is your opinion and we all like different things. I also think a hockey fight is great entertainment, but I understand that it hasn't been a part of Red Wing hockey for a few years now. But when you say players were taking liberties with specific players or just making that statement in general, who on the wings was in any way shape or form abused by some one last year? I can think of one situation and that was Mclaren on Z, other than that when did some one take a run at or liberties with a player. And BTW what the hell is entailed in taking liberties with a player? A glove to the face, stick to the back of the leg, two hander across the thigh, what exactly are these liberties you speak of? Hank, When was the last time Z or D or even Hossa for that matter where in a spot to get hurt? They position themselves very well, but your arguments sound more like defending the need for an enforcer/fighter than they do defending their entertainment value.

Also his take on spending this offseason: http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/stor...&id=3475686

If those young guys earn the spot at Traverse City or Babs sees that they can do it I am fine with that. However just suggesting that the wings get rid of Sammy for draft picks, when he costs them next to nothing and provides them top 6 type numbers, just because a prospect is promising is exactly the things that the wings don't do and how they stay a contender. Holland has said and shown multiple times that if a player has waiver options left more often than not they will develop in GR. Unless that player can come in and make an immediate impact and better the team, see Dats and Z!

Lilja has proven time and time again that he can kill penalties, which of the D-men you mentioned can kill penalties at the NHL, not do you think can, which ones are known penalty killers? Sammy has a hell of a lot more scoring touch than either Helm or Kopecky have shown. 5 goals in the playoffs including the first ever 2 unassisted goals to start a game, including a game winner in a SCF game. Don't get caught up in the bashing of players on this board, it is a whipping boy ideal, not a this player is actually only worth a bag of pucks. Let me know the last time Kopecky, Helm, Abdelkader, Leino or any of the other youngsters scored a 40 point season, or had an NHL season in which they scored more than 10 goals, let alone 23. Also look up the last time any of them scored 5 goals in the post season, better yet tell me how many wings scored 5+ goals in the playoffs? (I'll give you a hint, there were 3 who scored more than him and 2 that scored as many as he did). So I guess no one on the wings has a scoring touch, not Huds, not flip. Then you add to the fact that Sammy is defensively responsible. YES Lilja and Sammy make mistakes but wasn't Lids who put a puck in his own net this season? I am not comparing either of them to Lids, but if he is the best player in the world (IMO he is) and even he makes mistakes what do you expect from depth guys? I will wager that Maltby or Mac were larger weaknesses than Sammy or Lilja. But Maltby has been a wing for so long you can not knock on him, because once he was a very good agitator and he used to be a great pker. He lives more on his past reputation than anything he has done recently.

Yeah I don't think the coaching acquisition was given enough weight, Hanta Yo has had a hard time in the playoffs for as long as I can remember.

No it is when the American economy goes back up that the cap will go back down. The reason, or one reason, that the cap goes up is revenue is up, because the Loony (sp) is at about the same value as the US dollar, players are paid in American Dollars, the exchange rate being near even means the 28% of revenue from Canadian teams is at a higher value because of the current exchange rate. If the American Dollar goes up the Loony will not be worth as much American dollars and therefore the amount of revenue from canada will go down while the American amount will likely stay the same, unless the rise in economy brings millions more American fans to the game of hockey.

WOW, so many things in that post make me shake my head, bring back Legace who is now a starter, but in order to do it they have to trade with the Blues who have such a great history or good relations with the Wings. Plus you want to give up spots that vets have proven they can hold and do a better than average job at, for unproven untested commodities? Lebda played the PK how many times? Meech? Lilja? How many blocked shots did Lebda have this year? You can't just plug in names, that is why most all star type rosters fail, you need pluggers, you need some one to block shots, you can't just say because Meech is a better skater than Lilja he should play over him. So because something is a bargain doesn't mean you need it, no, but if that bargain was a large player in your team winning the cup it is a better idea to keep it around than to trade it off for picks and plug in an unproven commodity that plays A) a different position (Kopecky Helm are centers not wingers) B) has no where near the scoring touch and C) IS UNPROVEN. Mason or Legace are way more expensive than Conklin, you do know there is a salary cap right? Are you a Blues fan trying to get rid of Legace?

I always contested that was more of a Joe Thornton stat than it was Cheechoo's doing. I think Michalek will have a similar issue if off of Joe's line, not as bad because I think he has more of a scorers touch than Cheechoo does.